What blade did you EDC today?

Yep, the knockoff has stainless handles instead of Titanium, cheaper/inferior blade steel than Sebbie, & a hole for lanyard instead of the blue bar.

EDIT… I may be wrong about the lanyard attachment, i can’t tell by the picture if the knockoff has a hole or blue bar.

I don’t have it handy but somebody did a full video on the differences using a G10 version several years ago. There are some significant ones, such as riding on caged bearings and being meant to flick. While 12C27 is definitely a step down from S45VN (etc.) on steel, it’s totally reasonable for the price and I’d take it over 8Cr13Mov any day of the week. The $20ish G10 version is arguably the highest quality knife you can get at that price level.

Some people get really bent out of shape about how much this knife resembles a Sebenza. I don’t love to see designs aped but at the same time, those people tend to be pretty self-righteous and factually ignorant. First, this isn’t a “counterfeit” and it isn’t trying to trick or defraud anyone. Second, “copying” and “stealing” are definitely not the same thing. Intellectual property rights are nuanced by definition and all sorts of geopolitical issues are involved. Third, claims about this knife hurting sales for actual Sebenzas that cost 10x as much (or more) are mostly bullshit for a variety of reasons.

Fo a 20 ish dollar knife it is pretty nice. Steel is decent.
For serious use the Phosphorus Bronze washers are superior to the caged bearings as they do not collect dirt, grit, & blood as bearings do.

As fas as “flipping/flicking” goes… who cares. That is not on most people’s prority list unless they are using the knife as a fidget toy.

There are probably a few people who are as you described. Chris Reeve is probably one of them.

As far as hurting sales goes, maybe… maybe not.

Your opinion of that matter is just that, an opinion.

At least this knockoff did not use the Chris Reeve logo.

Im still carrying the middle one, mini osborne, it weighs 58 grams, 40% heavier than the mini bug, on bottom, at 42 grams …
.

Ive grown fond of the strong triangular tip, and enjoy the tapered spine. It also cuts really well. I like the ergonomics very much.

The top knife is a ritter griptilian weighs 76 grams, 30% heavier than the mini osborne.

Since my knives are also pocket jewelry, I dont carry clones. I enjoy knowing I have the “best” steel, and that my knife is “real”. Otoh, when it comes time to put on the overals and cut cement bags open, I reach for a clone. I dont want to hurt my nice “fancy” knives… LOL… Consumer I am.

Benchmades are a fine knife. I have aquired more than a few over the years. :wink:

Is it really just opinion? People like to argue that similar designs hurt or “steal” sales but at the end of the day, such an argument always involves a “counterfactual”. You can’t lose a thing you never had. This argument boils down to one person’s prediction (opinion) of what sales would have been in a world without the similar design (counterfactual), and that prediction is always higher than the actual sales in this world. In other words, that argument is “bullshit”.

Extreme example, like buying a Bolex watch. You might buy one for 100bux, but Rolex ain’t losing any sales if there’s no way you’d buy a legit item for 15kbux or more.

Whatever Chronovore, it’s not worth arguing about. Opinions are like rear ends, everybody has one; myself included. :smiley: :wink:

You make a pretty valid point Lightbringer.

The ironic thing is that the Bolex might typically keep better time than the Rolex. :laughing:

:+1:

This little venture of mine into knife making is teaching me more than technical skills. When you start putting something together from scratch and have to make or source everything required the reasoning behind the price point becomes more clear!

Common steels are actually very cheap, supersteels aren’t even that bad… even MagnaCut. Then you start sinking time into shaping a blade. You find or make scales, source or turn pins/screws. Buy leather and/or Kydex for sheaths. Figure out how to place your logo. Heat treat, do it yourself or outsource? At $33 apiece from a top company that one is a no- brainer, but then shipping both ways adds substantially to the cost.

At the end of it all you realize there is still a pretty hefty price to be paid even after putting in the hours of DIY.

So, a $300 knife professionally made is indeed certainly worth considering. Prices go way over that of course, and one must look at what that brings to the table. Worth, after all, is established by the end consumer.

I have managed one complete blade out of the 10 I started. 4 are due in soon from heat treat and the work begins anew! Four are still at the engravers, needing to be sent for heat treat then completed. I carry the Ti blade daily. And the 10th? I made a leather carver from scrap and heat treated it with a torch. Wasn’t easily accomplished even for it’s comparable small size!

Sometimes the sum of the parts is far greater than the whole!

In pocket? The WE Knives ÆternA. Still enjoying the uniqueness.

As an aside, referencing cost, I failed to mention the tools that have been purchased to accomplish the blades. Gets out of hand fast! Overhead huh?

Opinions have weight. Some opinions are based on prejudice or random feelings. Some are based on facts or logic. I’ve offered the latter.

Speaking of…

This is a solid point. If someone is okay with counterfactual logic, accepts the epistemic limitations, and wants to engage in the economics of “what if”; they’ll still run head first into this for lots of products. The people making counterfactual arguments about “lost” or “stolen” sales tend to conveniently ignore it. To flesh out that point:

What percentage of the people who do buy a cheap Bolex were ever in the class of potential customers for a Rolex in the first place? This is an important reason to separate copied designs from counterfeits. Counterfeiters might be able to trick a person from that class into paying thousands of dollars for a fraudulent product. However, very few of the people spending $100 on a Bolex would ever dream of spending thousands on a Rolex, assuming they could afford to buy a Rolex in the first place.

Further, some of the people in the class that constitutes both potential Rolex customers AND people who bought a Bolex might be people who have purchased both. One of those people might get a Rolex for fancy occasions, business meetings, etc.; but wear the Bolex while mowing the lawn or shopping at the local Walmart.

Now, if you really want a headache, consider the class of people who buy a Rolex BECAUSE of their experiences with a Bolex. For instance, Person A gets a Bolex to see if they like the style or whatever, and then buys a Rolex once they know it is for them. Person B gets a Bolex when they are relatively poor and then graduates to a Rolex once they’ve “made it”. Such cases occur, are non-counterfactual when they do, and support a counter-argument versus the unsupported counterfactual claim: the existence of Bolex actually increased the sales of Rolex!

:person_facepalming: :smiley:

Regardless of any argument for or against, copyright infringement ( counterfeiting ) is illegal and can carry hefty jail times.

Truer words were never spoken. A custom knife from someone who really knows what they are doing is a wonder to behold.

And to get to where “they really know what they are doing” means they have invested the time & money it takes to learn.

What Blade did you EDC today?
Post a photo.

for me still, the mini osborne (size compare to Opinel #7)
.

.

Ganzo G729
Offending two fanboy groups at the same time! :sunglasses:

Back when Ganzo’s were good AND cheap, 5 years ago :smiling_imp:

The compulsory VAT made everything even more expensive thanks to our wise leaders…