How things change over the years...The Maglite is actually pretty good

First of all, welcome aboard racomir.

Your comparison table seems a little bit biased to me, because it doesn't take into account that the fenix can pump out 800 lumens when you need it. Or if you need an emergency light, it can give you 10 lumens for 400h according to manufacturer specs.

Besides, I would think that if 130 lumens is enough for you, there'd be better options than a 3D light. Or do you actually spend 80 hours in a cave? (not a rhetorical question, I'm really curious.)

^^This! +1!

No, but I’d rather get in the head with a Maglite than with a Fenix TK70 or even Olight SR90.

raccoon city and Steve_the_Chief : thanks!

It’s true. There are two possibilities about the poor runtime (compared to the Maglite) of the middle mode on the Fenix:

1) it has poor runtime because they poorly designed it
or
2) it has poor runtime because you can’t do otherwise when you want to have several modes

In the first case, I wouldn’t say that “the Chinese make better lights”, because the difference with the Maglite is huge (half the runtime with a more efficient LED and 4 batteries instead of 3). In the second case, I would say that this light is better only if you intend to use it mostly on high mode.

But when do you need 800 lumens so much that you prefer:

- to have 4 hours of light rather than 79 hours

- to pay four times the price

- to use 4 batteries instead of 3

?

I guess that people in such a case are pretty rare.

No, 10 hours at most. But I really love lights with huge runtime. It feels like the runtime is unlimited because you have to change the batteries so rarely. I have a Mag 4D with the Luxeon LED, which has a runtime of 43 hours “only”. But I’m considering buying the new 3D, because it’s a huge improvement over my 4D both in runtime and output, and it’s lighter and smaller. And so cheap.

Thank you for your further explanations.

But concerning the runtimes given from the manufacturer, there is something else to consider and that is the type of regulation.

In an unregulated light, the current consumption (and light output) goes down with the batteries depleting. This leads to very long runtimes, but with usually significantly less output after half the stated runtime. I would expect the TK60 to be regulated for constant output.

Since the TK60 uses a more efficient LED than the Mag, and I highly doubt that Fenix would use a driver that is 50% less efficient than the one Maglite uses, I assume that these runtimes cannot be compared directly. But before anyone takes the time and effort to provide regulation/runtime diagrams of both the TK60 and the Mag, I don't think we can come to a final conclusion here.

It’s true. The Mag 4D with the Luxeon LED is regulated for constant output. So I hope the same is true of the new 3D. Maglite’s website says “Intelligent Energy Source Management - continuously monitors the balance between high brightness and efficient power usage allowing for prolonged battery life”. I don’t understand what that means.

I just checked Maglites website and it says that runtimes are given in compliance with ANSI FL1 standard. That means, the given runtime is the time until the light output goes down to 10% of the initial value.

So, the Maglite may give you 80 hours of runtime, but with constanly diminishing output. Now, Fenix provides a runtime diagram only for low mode, but it's most likely the same type of regulation in the medium mode. And that is where the missing energy goes, it is used to maintain the same brightness over the runtime.

Of course it is totally up to you if you prefer a flashlight that gives you very long runtimes but cheats with the output, or one that gives constant brightness over less time.

Maglite has chinalumens, Fenix has true lumens. That’s the main difference.

So… I guess the Chinese make better lights. I’ll try to think more next time I read some manufacturer’s specs. Thank you for having found this. Now I have to chose between sticking to my old Mag and throwing it to the trash :-).

I'd say, if it works for you, stick with it

But in your situation, I would probably prefer a lighter flashlight and just recharge the batteries after every cave trip.

I do like them - great hosts for modding.

A Mini-M@glite Pro is still on my list (as is a SureFire E2L-AA, but seriously, I am NOT going to pay 150 dollars for that!!!)

A big welcome from me to you Racomir.

But I must point something out. I bought a drop in for my 3D Mag, it’s an XPG R5, runs at 200lm and has a run time of 17 hours. So based on the fact that the XPG is a more efficient LED I would suggest the run times would be very similar. Maybe 20 hours or so. But Mag does have a habit of exaggerating a little. Their new Mini Mag has 220lm, but only for a few minutes when it ramps down to 80lm. So I wouldn’t trust anything they claim.

Marc.

Keep in mind that Flashaholics have been bashing Maglites for years, and mostly with good reason. The current bashing is likely just because its always been that way.

The Maglites have lately been using some modern emitters and the minimag pro is quite solid. 200+ lumens on ALKALINES which is decent. They are modernizing quite nicely, incorporating multiple brightness levels, etc while keeping good quality and ease of use for the average joe.

But this is a pretty recent thing. 2 years ago, Maglite’s best was a 3 watt Rebel LED or some crap that was wayyy outclassed by Cree emitters. Most maglites at that time were incans and xenons which were just awful. Maglite put out their LED variant really late to the game and far behind modern standards.

There’s a lot of rumblings about Fenix better than Maglite etc

I’ve own models from both manufacturers.

The Fenix TK41 is superb and for me the very best money I’ve ever spent on a torch-full stop.

The Maglite MagCharger was the second best.

What would be my perfect torch?

Probably either an up to date LED MagCharger with a sensible battery and a’Smart’ Full Information charger.

And give it Type III Hard Anodised treatment inside and out.

Or a slightly upgraded Fenix TK41?

Rubber armour the head assembly.

Offer a Lithium Ion battery option (ie manufactured by Fenix)

Make the barrel out of a slightly thicker gauge Aluminium.

Pop a battery tester into it.

And DON’T go down the road of some others offering USB Inputs, multi-regulated discharge patterns etc.

IMPROVE THAT AWFUL BATTERY HOLDER.

And that’s about it.

For me, I came across BLF because of the Mag Light. NOT because I loved it, but because I was looking for a light (other than Mag) with a little more reliability. I got so sick of turning on a Mag and having to bang it a couple of times to get it to work. As a plumbing/heating service tech I use my light all day long and having to bang a light just won’t do for me. I passed down all 3 of my Mags to my little kids. I’ve found that ONE Solarforce light has lasted longer than ALL my Mags combined, (and w HAIII) it looks alot better after getting beat up. Now THAT’S a steal!!

I really agree with the OP. I really embraced those 7 led flashlights and those shake lights back when it came out in 2008? I mean cmon maglite it’s been 4+ years and you’re still making the same flashlights with LED upgrade for 30 bucks! It doesn’t matter if u get a 6D or 3D or maglite 50XL. They all cost around 30 bucks.

I also enjoyed the surefire craze back then and they first fenix coming out. Then there’s these modded maglites. No matter where u look they still cost 100+ bucks to collectors. And CPF member’s aren’t selling them to non-members to boot! I mean i wouldn’t mind having a 300+ lumens flashlight that last me 10+ hours, but selling them over 200 is pretty nuts.

Well-said! I won my first Mini Mag at a business luncheon, and they have been my favorites for years! Rugged, compact, reliable, repairable, and rather handsome, IMO. I’ve modified all of mine with some sort of LED module, and find the brightness and run time are improved and fit my needs. I don’t like the twist on and focus, but Kroll clicky switches or the Nite Ize ones solve that problem, except for the LED model.
May they have continued long life and health! :slight_smile:
Carl

Is Everything. This is a forum for flashaholics. Quite simple, isn’t it? Everyone here has gone beyond the norm and wants MORE! But, is this anywhere near average? We are a small percentile of the people. Don’t believe me? Tell anyone you know, or any stranger for that matter, that you just spent $150 on a flashlight. (Did you just spend more than that?) See what they say? We are not normal. This discussion is preaching to the choir.

I have no idea what people do in other countries. Heck, I don’t have much idea what people in the northeast of my own country do. But in the South, here in America MagLight is King! Take a poll, go door to door, ask folks what flashlight sits on top of the refrigerator. Ask how many times a month it’s used. Then ask about the panic that ensues when the lights go out and someone forgot to put the Mag back on top of the fridge when they searched the drawer for a certain sized washer.

Average people want a light for insurance. The best insurance policy is MagLight. Corner store, drug store, convenience store, WalMart, Target, you name it they’re easy to find. Have been for as long as I can remember. Nix that, my memory is horrible! There’s been a black 2D MagLight in the house since they came out with em. The lights before that were truly horrendous! Black plastic head on a yellow body with a single candles worth of light that fell out the front and collapsed like a dying horse. Huge boxes of metal with a rotating head on top that took a monstrous square 6V battery that always seemed to be just about dead, with a feeble glow from the element that defied logic as the cell was known to have been bought right after the great flood.

MagLight revolutionized handheld flashlights in America. Pure and simple. In my house right now, there are 8, with one more in Old Lumens hands for a revision. Only 3 of those are still sporting their incandescent bulb. Such is life. We all grow up, or out, or simply die. When I go, my favorite flashlight will probably still be my most modified…A brilliant red 2D MagLight cut down to 1 cell by JayRob and carrying a 32650 protected Li-ion with 5500mAh capacity. Shining a stunning Cree XM-L T6 at 1000lumens out of a ChicagoX modified ribbed head and doing so through a 45mm TIR. I love looking at it. I love how it feels in my hand. The sheer weight of the thick walled aluminum head is reassuring. And it now has teeth.

What light do I use everyday? My little Titanium CoreTi from MBI, hanging on a titanium curb chain around my neck and boasting a whopping 5 lumens…use it to check the temp at 4 in the morning, the time at 2 AM, find that tiny little bugger of a screw that fell under my desk, read the oil on the dipstick in the garage and every other little thing that comes up where some light is needed. But almost never is that need for 1000 lumens. That’s just for play! :slight_smile: And I can do that in quite a few different ways now, yes some of those thanks to China.

Long Live The King, Mag Lights Rule! :slight_smile:

And please, people, remember that I cannot and do not try to speak for everyone. I speak from my own personal experience and what I’ve heard from others all my life, right here in Central Texas. What I say doesn’t work for you? Guess you don’t come from my neck o the woods! :wink:

1 Thank

I don’t like mag-lights since I actually use my lights, that may sound odd but I’ll explain. Mag-lights are designed to be run off of primary cells (With the exception of “Magchargers” but they cost substantially more if I was to use them) and primary cells are not in this day and age cheap nor convenient for frequent long term use.

I use my lights often during warmer months (Sometimes during cooler months) for outdoor activities, lighting and general purpose. I can be outside and commuting 5x or more during a week with an average of 15 or so minuets where I am stuck in the dark. When I’m really out at dark I can be out for more than five hours where light output is important for around two of such hours so having a light that can’t run at least five hours is quite a disadvantage.

Mag’s don’t offer either in a convenient form or even if they do they simply weight too much and consume too many cells to make it worth doing this more than once or twice a month.

Lions and other lithium based dry cells offer a much higher energy weight ratio and a rechargeable option that allows for even more cell use; If I can use the same cell more than thirty times even at 3x the cost then I’ve broken even regardless of convenience. The fact that the lights are smaller and put out more light is just an added perk.

Either way the majority of people I know still depend on lights that don’t even match up to modern Mag-lights in the slightest with leaking heavy duty batteries that barley function. Mag-Light offers a competitive product for these people (And a good choice considering their robustness) but do not compare in the modern flashaholic world.

It’s 2013, if we can’t have reliable convent light in access than I don’t know where our evolution is going; moving back to primary cells and mag-lights would make no more sense that carrying some lighter fluid and a large wooden stake. I applaud Mag for progressing (As anyone), but do something other than fill a small niche and I’d appreciate you more, what really has come out of them that hasn’t happened somewhere else?

May your reduction of primary cell intake fuel more flashlight purchases :wink:

Maglites weekness is its strength. If they didn’t have such poor output, there wouldn’t be nearly as many people trying to fix them. And since everyone knows they are weak lights, when you pull out a souped up model, they’re blown away. They’re everywhere so mods can be shared and inexpensive enough to screw up without breaking the bank. Some people want ready made lights and some like mods. My flashaholism tends toward modding. The fewer changes I’d make the less a light interests me (screwy, I know). I like my new BLF A8, I really like my 14650, chopped, finned, 2.6A U2 1D Minimag with the spare triple Nichia 219 drop in. There’s no doubt the A8 is a better, higher quality light but I can’t make it mine.