I have been wondering which one is more probable to happen:
Get injured by lightning or a blown Li-Ion?
Both are possible, no doubt about it.
>>>>>>I think using cheap protected Ultrafire cells is much more dangerous then using unprotected brand name batteries. (Sanyo, panasonic, etc.)
I now use almost-all (95%?) unprotected NAME-BRAND (sanyo, LG, Pannasonic, Sony, Samsung, etc.) cells. Although I use matched-voltage TFFs in the few multi-cell lights I still have. I really try to stay away from multi-cell lights now because of the explosion.
There are many arguments for and against protected/unprotected cells. My personal feeling is that I can’t trust the PCBs in ANY protected battery to do more than become shrapnel. They’re the weak link even in expensive “designer” protected cells. No one can see inside any battery wrap and know who made that PCB. It could come from a tin shack in China. I just don’t know. If a manufacturer said where and how the PCB was manufactured, I might trust it more, but then some of these vendor/manufactturers are the same ones who try and sell me 1200 lumen lights and crap batteries that supposedly have 3000 Mah.
I feel safer with straight as-manufactured unprotected cells from major manufacturers with established safety records, but that is me and I don’t expect anyone else to follow my example.
>>>>>>Oh yeah, forgot to ask were there any fumes
Not what you would call fumes exactly, but a strong odor that smelled EXACTLY like the afternath of a dynamite/gunpowder/cordite explosion. And the gooey flakes were in the air for a few minutes. We quickly set up exhaust fans to vent the flake crap, but it had mostrly settled by then.
Yes, the gray 14500 ultrafire was “protected.” whatever that really means. You can see the bottom disk from the protection unit on the floor in picture three, lower right.
I reciprocate quite consistently.
Stop it you two.
To be fair, re-read the 3rd from the last paragraph - Ubehebe refers to the explosion as a 16340, while the title says 14500, so the question was legitimate.
Ubehebe - I'm glad everything worked out ok and there were no injuries or fire. It takes reminders like this every once in a while to keep us from getting complacent with Li-Ion. No matter the statistics, we need to treat these batteries with respect and be vigilant when chargingl. Thanks for posting.
On reflection it seems more likely that this was an internal chemical fault, not really anything a pcb would’ve helped. Electrical safeguards offer protection for a different (perhaps more common) type of fault.
Ubehebe had two issues, the one with the 14500 explosion, and the 16340 (over)heating. I was curious about both.
>>>>>>To be fair, re-read the 3rd from the last paragraph -
>>>>>Ubehebe refers to the explosion as a 16340, while the title says 14500, so the question was legitimate.
I apologize for any confusion.
I am talking about TWO events:
1. 14500 gray ultrafire explosion 6 months ago.
2. 16340 xtar battery overheating event (without explosion), covered in another thread, which occurred two nights ago.
I thought I was explaining it clearly, but apparently not. As a professional writer, I try to be concise, but often I try to detail too much and include too much spurious detail. My apologies. Hopefully with this further explanation, it will all become clear now.
I also changed the original post to hopefully make it clearer. Thanks for poiting that out to me.
Another ultrafire kaboom story. Somehow I think these batteries are living up to their names.
Ubehehe, did you happen to check whether the protection circuit actually has circuits on them? They look flat to me.
The reason I'm asking was because, I once disassembled a protected 18650 with dubious characteristics and found that the "protection" was nothing more than a shorted bare PCB. It was painstakingly soldered, placed and rewrapped there JUST to make it look protected. Looks a lot like yours.
>>>>>>Ubehehe, did you happen to check whether the protection circuit actually has circuits on them? They look flat to me.
The ultrafire had a PCB in it. It was recovered with the various debris. Was the battery protected, i.e, would it shut down as designed and prevent a catastrophic event? As I said, I wouldn’t trust that or any battery pcb to do anything more than become shrapnel. As I said, I for one have no idea who makes those PCBs or even if they work reliably at all. As I said, I don’t trust them any more. I just buy the best unprotected batteries I can.
But I don’t wnt to get into an argument about the benefits of those PCBs. Not trusting them is my choice. I’m not trying to push that choice on others.
Wow! 
Do you have seagulls close by? If so, avoid them.
Switch to NiMHs. Your family, the neighbors, the fire dept and police will be glad you did.
I was almost at the point of considering trying a Li-ion. This convinced me that not using them, ever, is the right decision.
Yeah, watch out for those seagulls, especially the ones carrying fish. :P OL, I still think you should try Li-ions; they are really great and rarely explode. :)
It’s the initial cost of the Proper safety enclosure, that’s my concern, LOL.
sooo ,dont buy ultrafires no more ??? yess yess huh huh :bigsmile:
Old-Lumens,
I’m just curious - does your phobia of LiIon batteries only apply to the flashlight realm of life, or does it extend further? Do you own a laptop or a cell-phone?
PPtk
All you need is a quality charger and some good batteries. No way would I ever use anything that had the “fire” brand on it, charger or battery. I use the single bay 4sevens charger and it charges to a safe level every time. The only precautions that I make are that I always charge when I am in the same room and I check the voltage when they are done. No problems so far.
Batteries and a charger are where I would recommend to spend a little money more and you will be fine.
This is NOT to argue with the poster suggesting nicd/nimh. My reasons for continuing to use li-ions, but with considerable more safety provisions, since my brush with being sent to the big flashlight collection in the sky?
I think that there are DISTINCT differences between crappy Chinese li-ion cells and top-notch li-ion cells from respected companies (as much as any sleazeball money-hungry public-be-damned company is a respected company these days). 
Like pilotptk notes: MANY of us could not carry-on life that we consider normal without li-ion batteries in cell phones, laptops, backup batteries in some desktop computers, tablets, readers, blah, blah blah. No one worries that their arm may be blown off by their laptop the next time they click their way to ordering the new Snoop Dogg aural delight from Amazon. Because if that Dogg devotee was to crack open his/her li-ion laptop battery pack, he/she would NOT find CRAPFIRE batteries inside. They would be top-notch branded cells. With heavily tested circuitry to prevent li-ion venting, overcharging, undercharging, etc. That’s why there are no headlines screaming: “Snoop Dogg fan beheaded by laptop explosion while ordering new Dogg CD.”
There are SAFE (or relatively safe) li-ion batteries with pheomenal safety records. And then there are Chinese crap li-ion cells, which can be passable, but usually are borderline dangerous to even store in the house. I would not bet my life on a cheapie Chinese safety belt for a race car. Ditto with Chinese gray-market li-ion cells.
Can’t afford a laptop, but If I had one, it would have a NiMH pack converted to it. I have a cell phone, don’t like it and don’t trust it. I figure sooner or later it will melt down or explode. I have thought of converting it to NiMH as well.
It's not really a phobia. I just am not willing to take all the precautions that Li-ion needs.
A heavy duty fire and explosion proof box
A good/safe charger for each size of cell, or a hobby charger
A fire extinguisher
A meter to check condition
What else?
The willingness to take all that time and make sure to do checks. I would never do that. I'm an Alkaline/NiMH guy. Either toss them out or toss them in the charger and walk away.
Then there's the cost of good protected cells on top of it all. It's not a poor man's game and when you buy cheap, look at what happens.
I will just stick to NiMHs (eneloops). I know you have a very low chance of something going wrong, but if you're not willing to take the care needed, then the risk can magnify fairly quickly. I'm not about to have to show respect to a battery.
I had a 6S sub-C NiMH pack blow in a very similar manner. It was being slow charged off a lab supply at less than 1/20C (safe for constant trickle charged). Ripped open a couple of the cells big time, spewed carbon dust everywhere, including a $50,000 logic analyzer. Nothing is safe. Might as well crawl in the coffin and call it quits…
Fair enough… Was just curious. To each their own.