Review: Small Sun ZY-T08 2 x 18650 (Parallel)

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eddamoo
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Hi Guys, i’m new here so please excuse me if i get a little terminology incorrect! Decided to finally register and let people know my opinions…

I received my Small Sun in around 7 working days from Manafont (to England) which is pretty great! I have a few other LED torches including the KD-C8. I wouldn’t place the quality of this one very close to it to be honest; the Anodisation is thin and very slightly chipped (barely visible) on the quite sharp heat-sink machining abeam the pill. The aluminium obviously had some flaws in the casting also, as the head ring has what looks like ‘chips’ which can be removed to expose a darker metal, almost like when chrome plating falls off. Ill have to give this a light sanding.

This is a nice and chunky light and looks great, but having large hands the lanyard holder protrusions get in the way a little!

I haven’t tested the seals, but the main body screw will need well greasing to stop it from giving you the shivers on every turn! I would HIGHLY recommend using a dielectric grease on the pill’s positive surface , as the batteries literally rub against this when you tighten the body. If you use reclaimed 18650’s like me, i’d solder a ‘blob’ on your positive terminals and make it nicely smooth to prevent the pill from wear.

I was rather disappointed in its output however… On high, the spot is only very marginally brighter than my SMO KD-C8 (High – 3A), with the C8 having much more spill. These are my readings using 1×18650 directly against the driver, and 2×18650 by shorting the switch (both were near identical):

High: 1.97A
Med: 0.95A
Low: 0.45A

Memory bleed is good, only 3-4 seconds. Spot is bright and tight but with quite a ringy spill as others said, on a white wall.

I have a question… I need to mod this to give it some more grunt to turn it from a good torch into a great torch. I’ve seen the ‘Viffer’ mod to increase the value of those 3 paralell resistors, however i measured those resistors and got only 0.4-0.5ohm, which was the same value as just the multimeter’s leads on their own! Am i doing something wrong or is my multimeter just not sensitive enough perhaps?

Thanks for reading Smile

BetweenRides
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Hi, eddamoo and welcome to BLF! Sounds like yours is underdriven compared to mine, which is at least the equal to my HD2010 if not slightly brighter. Can't help you on your questions, however.

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eddamoo wrote:
I have a question... I *need* to mod this to give it some more grunt to turn it from a good torch into a great torch. I've seen the 'Viffer' mod to increase the value of those 3 paralell resistors, however i measured those resistors and got only 0.4-0.5ohm, which was the same value as just the multimeter's leads on their own! Am i doing something wrong or is my multimeter just not sensitive enough perhaps? Thanks for reading :)

Welcome eddamoo!  I don't believe you can measure the resistors value while in the circuit.  You'd have to desolder one end to take it out of circuit to measure it correctly.  Can't you just go by their value stamped on top?

Also, are you aware of low tailcap current readings with cheap multimeters or even decent meters with cheap thin leads?  Can you try using heavier/thicker wire for leads (just shove it in the sockets so long as they make decent contact) and test again.  It does sound like you have an underdriven model though comparing to a C8 at 3A.  This light should be blindingly bright in it's hotspot even without being modded!  I reflected mine off some white aluminum trim on my garage outside and it almost blinded me!

-Garry

My Bike Lights Thread, Optics (TIR) Comparison Beamshots, Diffusion Techniques

, MTBR’s Lights & Night Riding Forum
NOTE: Now hosting my photos from my Google account. Post up if you can’t see them. Older photos hosted on Photobucket or Flickr may disappear (PM me if you want access to them).
eddamoo
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Thanks for the welcomes guys, this place certainly seems very friendly! Smile

My DMM’s Leads are pretty good and like you said, have easily read over 3A before, but will indeed try some thicker wires just in case.

I totally forgot that i took a photo of the driver and there are 3x R150 (0.15 Ohm) resistors. So thats 0.45 Ohm total. I don’t know if the current regulation circuit is linear to the resistance – does anyone know more who could please educate me? I have sat before me some R27 (0.27 Ohm) surface mount.

VFMaddict
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Hi eddamoo and welcome.

What cells are you using in that T08 ?

"You are making progress if each mistake you make is a new one."

Remember - Most great discoveries start with maki

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Welcome to the BLF family, Eddamoo!!

eddamoo
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Hi guys, resistor mod results are in for me, wired in parallel to the 3x R150 resistors…

High power
Original… 1.95A
1x Extra R27 .27 ohm resistor… 2.45A
2x Extra R27 .27 ohm resistors… 3.2A

Perfect! Smile Have a great weekend all!

CheapThrills
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eddamoo wrote:
Hi guys, resistor mod results are in for me, wired in parallel to the 3x R150 resistors…

High power
Original… 1.95A
1x Extra R27 .27 ohm resistor… 2.45A
2x Extra R27 .27 ohm resistors… 3.2A

Perfect! Smile Have a great weekend all!

Nice! Thanks for posting, will mod mine when it arrives! 8)

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Thanks old and all!!

Will this light work with flat top cells? It looks like theres a chance the fatter +B could short against the -B trace…???

BetweenRides
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kramer:

My new Keeppower 3400 button tops will not work in the ZY-T08. However my Callie's Kustoms 3100 raised flat tops work perfectly:

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awesome thanks between…
can you do a favor and measure these two distances? I only use flat-top, unprotected cells so this is a concern for me…. I’d be a little uncomfortable if the +B of the batteries is close to the -B trace on the board.

THANKS!!!

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Distance between outsides of the buttons is about 27.5mm
Inside Diameter of the circle on the board is 24mm, so the cells overlap and actually rest on the circle.

Please explain this to me - I'm an electronics dunce and I would be curious why it makes a difference. I've measured length on the KP's and they are identical (68.5mm) to the CK's. So out of curiosity, I tightened the board by about a half turn (didn't notice it being loose before) and inserted the Keeppowers and they now work fine. So I checked the distance on these and it's about 23.5mm. Does the lower surface area of the button tops cause more pressure on the board?

MarioSS
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thanks for the great review and info found in this thread!
I hope you guys don’t mind me asking can someone please recommend some decent 18650 batteries from Manafont?
I am asking because i am interested in this bad boy but i need a pair of 18650 and would like to order all my stuff from 1 place and have the shipped at once (i live on the other side of the world ><)
I already have the trustfire TR-001 charger.

Thanks in advance
Mario

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am I gonna be the only guy on BLF that doesn’t have one? Shocked

“When I buy something in bulk you should prolly buy at least one too.”…..“They that have light shall rule the night.”…..“Flashaholics feel depressed without darkness.”…….“I’m a very terminal torchaholic. My entire life just flashed before my eyes

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Lumatic wrote:
am I gonna be the only guy on BLF that doesn't have one? :O

I don't have one yet or the HD2010. Shocked

BetweenRides
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MarioSS wrote:
thanks for the great review and info found in this thread! I hope you guys don't mind me asking can someone please recommend some decent 18650 batteries from Manafont? I am asking because i am interested in this bad boy but i need a pair of 18650 and would like to order all my stuff from 1 place and have the shipped at once (i live on the other side of the world ><) I already have the trustfire TR-001 charger. Thanks in advance Mario

Mario, you can order these from Manafont, but I won't really recommend them:

http://www.manafont.com/product_info.php/protected-trustfire-18650-37v-3000mah-rechargeable-batteries-2pcsset-p-7941

No one that I know of has found fakes at Manafont. I have two pairs and they work fine, but they don't have the advertized capacity. Seems to be some issues with shipping out batteries from China lately, though.

BetweenRides
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Lumatic wrote:
am I gonna be the only guy on BLF that doesn't have one? :O

Yes!

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Ok, kramer and scaru: Apparently my CK flat tops are overlapping the -B trace on the board, and the KP button tops are right at it, so why am I not having an issue with either? I've shaken it and even rode with it on my bike briefly and had no issues or mode switching, although the light is really too big for biking.

kramer5150
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BetweenRides wrote:

Distance between outsides of the buttons is about 27.5mm
Inside Diameter of the circle on the board is 24mm, so the cells overlap and actually rest on the circle.

Please explain this to me – I’m an electronics dunce and I would be curious why it makes a difference. I’ve measured length on the KP’s and they are identical (68.5mm) to the CK’s. So out of curiosity, I tightened the board by about a half turn (didn’t notice it being loose before) and inserted the Keeppowers and they now work fine. So I checked the distance on these and it’s about 23.5mm. Does the lower surface area of the button tops cause more pressure on the board?

scaru pretty much nailed it…
If the +B of either cell touches that outer trace !!ZAP!! you’ve got a short across the batteries (-B to +B). Probably not a big deal with small button cells like the ones in olds picture, but flat tops and unprotected cells with wide/blunt +B could be a problem. I would be very cautious using the 27.5mm cells if the ID of the -B trace is only 24mm across. With protected cells is less of a concern though…. but still its not good practice to trigger the protection circuit on any cell.

THANKS!!! very useful information, I think I’l pass on this light… either that or get small button top cells.

kramer5150
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BetweenRides wrote:

Ok, kramer and scaru: Apparently my CK flat tops are overlapping the -B trace on the board, and the KP button tops are right at it, so why am I not having an issue with either? I’ve shaken it and even rode with it on my bike briefly and had no issues or mode switching, although the light is really too big for biking.

Thats a good question…??? I can’t answer that one.
EDIT One possibility is that -B “looking” trace-ring (where scaru points to) is not actually grounded/connected to the -B battery tube on the battery side of the board.

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kramer5150 wrote:
BetweenRides wrote:

Ok, kramer and scaru: Apparently my CK flat tops are overlapping the -B trace on the board, and the KP button tops are right at it, so why am I not having an issue with either? I've shaken it and even rode with it on my bike briefly and had no issues or mode switching, although the light is really too big for biking.

Thats a good question...??? I can't answer that one. **EDIT** One possibility is that -B "looking" trace-ring (where scaru points to) is not actually grounded/connected to the -B battery tube on the battery side of the board.

It may be that or is the green insulator thing is elevated?

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BetweenRides wrote:

MarioSS wrote:
thanks for the great review and info found in this thread! I hope you guys don’t mind me asking can someone please recommend some decent 18650 batteries from Manafont? I am asking because i am interested in this bad boy but i need a pair of 18650 and would like to order all my stuff from 1 place and have the shipped at once (i live on the other side of the world ><) I already have the trustfire TR-001 charger. Thanks in advance Mario

Mario, you can order these from Manafont, but I won’t really recommend them:

http://www.manafont.com/product_info.php/protected-trustfire-18650-37v-3000mah-rechargeable-batteries-2pcsset-p-7941

No one that I know of has found fakes at Manafont. I have two pairs and they work fine, but they don’t have the advertized capacity. Seems to be some issues with shipping out batteries from China lately, though.

I bought a pair of them and have them in my Olight M3X. They are in a word awesome. And they are only about a dollar more. So however much mah gain they are over the 2400mah Trustfire Flames I don’t know, but I have read they are a higher mah battery vs the flames.

I would tell you to get the Xtar 2600mah batteries but they won’t fit in certain lights. I myself have great luck with Hi-Max. But then again they may not fit in certain lights. But typically work in most.

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kramer5150 wrote:
BetweenRides wrote:

Distance between outsides of the buttons is about 27.5mm
Inside Diameter of the circle on the board is 24mm, so the cells overlap and actually rest on the circle.

Please explain this to me - I'm an electronics dunce and I would be curious why it makes a difference. I've measured length on the KP's and they are identical (68.5mm) to the CK's. So out of curiosity, I tightened the board by about a half turn (didn't notice it being loose before) and inserted the Keeppowers and they now work fine. So I checked the distance on these and it's about 23.5mm. Does the lower surface area of the button tops cause more pressure on the board?

scaru pretty much nailed it... If the +B of either cell touches that outer trace !!ZAP!! you've got a short across the batteries (-B to +B). Probably not a big deal with small button cells like the ones in olds picture, but flat tops and unprotected cells with wide/blunt +B could be a problem. I would be very cautious using the 27.5mm cells if the ID of the -B trace is only 24mm across. With protected cells is less of a concern though.... but still its not good practice to trigger the protection circuit on any cell. THANKS!!! very useful information, I think I'l pass on this light... either that or get small button top cells.
Kramer, do what I've done.  I am guessing you have a bunch of the flat-topped Panasonics Rev. Jim sold a while back like I do. I use then in my King by adding a quick and simple button to them.  Get these magnets from BIC for $1.79 .  They are only 1mm high but 3mm wide so there is no chance they will reach the outer ring and short anything out.  I put one on the center of the positive end then to secure it, then I use a superglue in gel form (only $1 for two tubes at my local Dollar Tree store) to apply a bead around the base of the magnet.  This keeps it from ever dislocating if the flashlight is dropped.  If you ever need to remove it you can chip/scrape off the bead of glue or use solvent then pop off the magnet. Wink
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ILIKEFLASHLIGHTS wrote:
BetweenRides wrote:

Mario, you can order these from Manafont, but I won't really recommend them:

http://www.manafont.com/product_info.php/protected-trustfire-18650-37v-3000mah-rechargeable-batteries-2pcsset-p-7941

No one that I know of has found fakes at Manafont. I have two pairs and they work fine, but they don't have the advertized capacity. Seems to be some issues with shipping out batteries from China lately, though.

I bought a pair of them and have them in my Olight M3X. They are in a word awesome. And they are only about a dollar more. So however much mah gain they are over the 2400mah Trustfire Flames I don't know, but I have read they are a higher mah battery vs the flames. I would tell you to get the Xtar 2600mah batteries but they won't fit in certain lights. I myself have great luck with Hi-Max. But then again they may not fit in certain lights. But typically work in most.

For both TF batteries from Manafont, I find the 2400mAh version to be superior. My TF3000 only do 2500mAh or so, only 100+ more than the sibling, but the voltage sag is significant in it after a few months (no heavy use). TF2400 is more solid performer.

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Thanks for all of your replies guys really appreciate it!

Damn flashlights is driving me crazy lol hardly sleeping. Keep on reading reviews and tips here at BLF and still can’t pull the trigger on my first 18650 setup lol

kramer5150
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JohnnyMac wrote:

kramer5150 wrote:
BetweenRides wrote:

Distance between outsides of the buttons is about 27.5mm
Inside Diameter of the circle on the board is 24mm, so the cells overlap and actually rest on the circle.

Please explain this to me – I’m an electronics dunce and I would be curious why it makes a difference. I’ve measured length on the KP’s and they are identical (68.5mm) to the CK’s. So out of curiosity, I tightened the board by about a half turn (didn’t notice it being loose before) and inserted the Keeppowers and they now work fine. So I checked the distance on these and it’s about 23.5mm. Does the lower surface area of the button tops cause more pressure on the board?

scaru pretty much nailed it… If the +B of either cell touches that outer trace !!ZAP!! you’ve got a short across the batteries (-B to +B). Probably not a big deal with small button cells like the ones in olds picture, but flat tops and unprotected cells with wide/blunt +B could be a problem. I would be very cautious using the 27.5mm cells if the ID of the -B trace is only 24mm across. With protected cells is less of a concern though…. but still its not good practice to trigger the protection circuit on any cell. THANKS!!! very useful information, I think I’l pass on this light… either that or get small button top cells.
Kramer, do what I’ve done.  I am guessing you have a bunch of the flat-topped Panasonics Rev. Jim sold a while back like I do. I use then in my King by adding a quick and simple button to them.  Get these magnets from BIC for $1.79 .  They are only 1mm high but 3mm wide so there is no chance they will reach the outer ring and short anything out.  I put one on the center of the positive end then to secure it, then I use a superglue in gel form (only $1 for two tubes at my local Dollar Tree store) to apply a bead around the base of the magnet.  This keeps it from ever dislocating if the flashlight is dropped.  If you ever need to remove it you can chip/scrape off the bead of glue or use solvent then pop off the magnet. Wink

Good advice as usual JM… thanks!!

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scaru wrote:

Lumatic wrote:
am I gonna be the only guy on BLF that doesn’t have one? Shocked

I don’t have one yet or the HD2010. Shocked

me either!

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Shocked

“When I buy something in bulk you should prolly buy at least one too.”…..“They that have light shall rule the night.”…..“Flashaholics feel depressed without darkness.”…….“I’m a very terminal torchaholic. My entire life just flashed before my eyes

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Lumatic wrote:
:O
LOL...Make that 4 Amish!

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