New interesting XML flashlight but with a cheesy name

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Budgeteer
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New interesting XML flashlight but with a cheesy name

http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductID=11242

Looking nice and not overly expensive.

The name however...

Looking forward for Smiling Fire or Unique Shark or Trust Ray's may come in future... (please manufacturers stop that nonsense and the "POLICE" brand may go as well as far i'm concerned)

C'mon lets do a separate thread with names suggestions. Since we buy those flashlights at least we have a chance to buy something that doesent make you ashamed saying it out loud. Then ask someone from our retailers representatives on forum to pass the info along.

 

Ah on the phostos says TrustFire! Phew... just a typo... hardly sellable with TrastFire...

kragmutt wrote:

They're gonna send you a green redcat with a black LED.

Edited by: Budgeteer on 03/19/2011 - 10:06
Aleister
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It is not so bad, it could have been TrashFire Laughing

But it looks like it can be a very interesting light!

 

 

Let a flooder be my wife and a thrower be my mistress

Match
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Look at the pics....it's a Trustfire.  They just made a type-o on their website.  I agree it does look like an interesting torch though.

Tas62
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"(1)High mode:operating current 6500mA ,brightness 2300LM.(2)Mid mode: Operating current 2000MA.brightness 1500LM.
(3)Low mode :operating current 800mA,brightness 500LM. (4)Flash mode: operating current 5000mA,brightness 2000LM.
(5)SOS mode:operating current 6500mA ,brightness 2300LM"

Poor li'l XM-L.

srfreddy
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@6.5 amps: 0 lumens is moar like it. The lead wires heat up like mad past 4 amps or so. 

Tas62
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They've used the specs from the Trustfire X6 SST90.

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/trustfire-x6-sst-90-5-mode-2300-lumen-memor...

brjones
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6.5 amps at... what, 8.4 volts? 54 watts? What poppycock (okay, old word, but works well for international users using e-translators).

Claiming 2300 lumens on high... 16 watts and 1500 lumens on low... who are these people?! Don't they give lying classes in Chinese marketing schools? Lying tip to the Chinese: the best lie is closest to the truth.

 [Update -- Ok Tas62, the stolen specs do make more sense for a 3 x 18650 SST-90 flashlight]

 

Did you notice: "deep mental reflector".

(I think I have one of those in my head.)

 

(...further reading of description) that's some pretty bad Chinglish. "Feel good ,non slip", "The attack of Stell material Front cover design".

 

That said...

 

Techjunkie on CPF is routinely driving XM-L's to 5 amps and beyond. And some of these on budget flashlights!

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?305258-First-XM-L-exp...

 

Perhaps the most surprising to me was his SacredFire NF-08 zoomie (originally 3 x AAA) project (firmly in the budget category):

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=307271

He runs that at 4.2 amps regulated. Before that, he ran an SST-50 at 6 amps... but said that got "really hot". He doesn't give any indication of special heatsinking for it. He says at 4.2A, "heat is managed well enough to allow an extended run". I don't know why, but he never discusses sag, either voltage or heat sag. From what I've been reading, Technjunkie routinely runs XM-L's in pure direct drive mode, i.e. with no driver... and with LiMn... and cells bigger than 18650(!).

 

I've seen extended back-and-forth on CPF whether you actually gain significant brightness over 3A with an XM-L, and while I've seen proof there that it can depend on the LED itself, I've also seen proof that in many cases, you're not just creating excess heat. What becomes even clearer is that the XM-L appears to be very forgiving when it comes to high current and excess heat. I've seen a lot of chicken-little'ing about running P60 drop-ins over 1.5A too, particularly on DX forums... so far, I've seen no evidence to support their claims, they offer none, and I personally have 3 XM-L drop-ins which all go either to nearly 3A or beyond on high, and no problems. I'm reasonable and don't use High for very long, though I wish Medium were higher than .75A/3 watts; 5 watts would be nice, since high is around 10-12 watts. A low on about 1 watt would be nice, but the lows IIRC are only about .7amps or around .3 watts which is pretty low even for close-up work.

 

I've seen people declaring 2.5A the 'sweet spot' for XM-L's. While this may be true, it also appears possible to get a lot more out of it with proper current and batteries. Hence the success of the Manafont Ultrafire XM-L drop-ins which typically go 3A and higher on high (I suspect they're simply pure direct drive in that mode).

 

It doesn't appear to have been established at what current XM-L brightness levels off and actually starts reducing. The few actual tests I saw were quite conflicting (one not becoming significantly brighter over 3A, the other one was), so I guess "more to come".

- Circumcision, regardless gender, by definition causes sensation loss, and thereby usually causes difficulty later in life. Oppose amputation of children's genitals. ALL children. http://tinyurl.com/haszs6o

photon1k
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Nice looking light. Specs are obviously not real. This site seems to make more realistic claims. Too bad they are sold out at the moment.

Match
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Brjones good post, and I've a few comments to add:

- The guy you mentioned on cpf is rather vague at times with hard data. He states extended runtimes...is that 3 minutes or 30?  And 4.2a in a sacredfire zoomie with no attention to thermals??? I don't buy it, at least not for more than a few minutes...

- Pertaining to an XML's current limit:  Recently during testing of a new build I had 7 xml's hooked up in series to a regulated bench power supply. This allowed me to easily dial the current to whatever I wanted, and I did take all 7 to 5amps ( emitters were mounted on a 2"x8"x14" slab of pure aluminum).  I'll say this: Lumen output increased quite a bit up to 2.5a, and then slightly more to 3a.  The difference between 3a and 5a was less than that of 2.5a to 3a.  These are my results in testing 7 emitters and later on 6 other emitters.  So, maybe I got 13 poor performers?  Highly doubtful.  If anyone is curious or disbelieving I can shoot a video of another test.

- I believe the success of the MF drop-in lies in the combination of running at 3a along with a well designed reflector.  Case in point:  My MF drop-in draws 3.1a and my new yetzl z1 draws 3.3a, and I can only assume similar driver efficiencies. Having said that, the MF one is noticably brighter to the eye. I will verify this once I'm done building my I.S.

 

Sometimes I wonder about the validity of some of the builds at the other site.  Maybe the need for "one-up manship" is leading to less than accurate claims?  It reminds me of the internet horsepower claims I used to read about when I was into street racing. It's amazing how many excuses came about after a 900hp trailer queen lost to my little 600hp daily driver.  Then again, what do I know...

Kokopelli
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Couldn't resist and ordered one. This one really looks like it has a good design. I have a SST 50 driver with 4 Amps output, from DX. I still don't think I can fit such a big driver circut into even this big light. 

Budgeteer
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There were reports that over 3A is either not worth or very risky for the emitter. Pick up one of the reasons to not do it. Silly

Personally i like the XM-L performance lumen/heat/runtime at 2,4A. But that's me, that aspect may not work for you.

kragmutt wrote:

They're gonna send you a green redcat with a black LED.

mfm
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TrastFire isn't any worse than Suterfire...

 

BTW, Trast means thrush in Swedish.

Boaz
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lets not kid ourselves here these people lie ..Or the 2nd best answer is ignorance .. neither is excusable . Most customers are pretty ignorant and simply rely on specs to tell them which one is better .. the bigger is better mentality and everyone here knows that it's a classic  newbie  mistake .

I'm surprised people aren't quicker to talk some kid off the ledge when he's all geared up to buy the biggest superlumen flashlight made .i blame the people who have been around the block for allowing the xml means  it's a better flashlight thinking to exist ..there are lots and lots of people buying Q3 xre emmitters in lights because of tint .that's about 6~10 generations of emmitters back ,or 4 year old emitters  so who's wrong here . Like match said claimed horsepower versus reality ..people love to be lied to ..An honest intelligent guy who explains things clearly  or a shyster who is just out of prison and on his way back ..who will they buy from ????

They will pay double for a light with less lumens shoddy workmanship ,bad driver ...if you just lie to them

       καὶ τὸ φῶς ἐν τῇ σκοτίᾳ φαίνει καὶ ἡ σκοτία αὐτὸ οὐ κατέλαβεν

                            

       Dc-fix diffuser film  >…  http://budgetlightforum.com/node/42208

photon1k
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Many people will buy from whoever tells them what they want to hear. Both sides are complicit. The seller obviously, but the buyer is too, when they don't take the time to inform themselves, or even bother to apply the old axiom "if it sounds too good to be true it probably is."

@Match - Thanks for the current on the Z1. I think I'll get one to play with. And I'll take 600 that wins over 900 that doesn't any day of the week.Wink

Match
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photon1k wrote:

...And I'll take 600 that wins over 900 that doesn't any day of the week.Wink

Hehe...yup! Cool

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Manafont has better photos of this flashlight, added just today to the site. Mind the ultra deep looking reflector it has.

okwchin
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Dont buy it, Don't support the abuse! Say NO to head abuse!

 

Mana says the Stainless steel head has been assaulted...

"Assaulted stainlesss steel head"

 

 

 

From KD, this torch has starred in the front cover to the movie  -  "The Attack of Stell"

"The attack of stell material Front cover design"

"like everyone else - I’m looking for my next “last” flashlight" -  ohnonothimagain

Kokopelli
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At least nothing like "Assaulted Stanleys Steal Head" Smile

Kokopelli
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My Trustfire X8 arrived just today. I put black-flame Trustfires and fired it away. The emitter is flawlessly centered, all the threads are clean, no chips or dents in the delivery. A well built light, and its belt clip seems to work. All in all, the body is a step beyond TR1200 bodies. 

It is a thrower and a well focused one. Light is cool white, I think cooler than my Fenix TK35 and it may even be a better thrower than TK35. 

Haven't measured the currents yet.  

The tailcap currents for High, mid and low are 1500mA, 650mA and 150mA respectively. Note that I didn't use topped-up 4.2V cells but Trustfire Blacks at 3.9V each. These values should give something near 3Amps on the emitter.

photon1k
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That's a nice looking light. One of the photos on DX shows it in a single cell configuration. Is it as bright in that mode? How does the lumens output compare with the TK35?

Kokopelli
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Maybe slightly dimmer than the double cell but still very bright (XML bright) on 1x18650 configuration. Couldn't measure the current though. I don't think it reaches a 2x18650 TK35 with only one battery but may be a bit brighter (or as my eyes see brighter  because of the cooler light) using the full setup, but it's only my eyes I use to measure output. I also don't know if my batteries limit the current on single cell operation or not. Better equipments may give better information.

photon1k
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Thanks for trying. It's probably designed to take advantage of the two cells. If I paid for a two cell setup I would want the second cell to give me more than just run time. Are you able to do some beam shot comparisons between it and your TK35?

srfreddy
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The TK35 puts out 820 ansi lumens-you can't push the XML much harder, as its already pushing over 1000 emmiter lumens. 

Kokopelli
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Fenix TK35 and Trustfire X8, here's how they compare to each other in output: 

 

TF X8 vs TK35

Beams and Halos

TF X8 vs TK35 : Ceiling Bounce on high

Piers
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Is the light from the TK35 as green as it looks or is that just weird white ballancing?

photon1k
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On my monitor the X8 looks a little blue and the TK35 a little green. But I would be quite happy to have either.Wink

Nice work on the beam comparison. Very neat and tidy. Thanks Kokopelli.

Kokopelli
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Pook wrote:

Is the light from the TK35 as green as it looks or is that just weird white ballancing?

Oh, sorry to respond this late. The walls are mild green in real. I don't remember my fixing the white balance at daylight so it may be the Auto WB working there and exaggerating the colors. The TK35 as a better color for outside though. X8 is as blue as it's been seen here.  

uncajesse
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Yeah look at the last two pictures, with white balancing is all over the place.  You'll have to disable that for the beam shots to be of any use to judge color.

Kokopelli
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uncajesse wrote:

Yeah look at the last two pictures, with white balancing is all over the place.  You'll have to disable that for the beam shots to be of any use to judge color.

 

I know, I just took these pics at the office and I shouldn't be doing that at there, so I had to hurry Smile

The last pic (bouncing TK35) on the other hand, is more close to what this room is in real daylight. So not a bad score for TK35 I must say.    

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THe last two photos look to be the same flashight on the table?

Rats, finally sold my 2010 509hp Mustang...now I can buy more lights!

Sold the red one too! Now guess what I drive, doing my penance for 500 hp commuters...

http://dreammustang.com/

http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac47/Ha

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Kokopelli wrote:

I know, I just took these pics at the office and I shouldn't be doing that at there, so I had to hurry Smile

Ha! I'm guilty of reading BLF at the office, and even posting once in a while. But you're showing true dedication to our obsession by doing beamshots at work!

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