Dale, you dont need to come up with a story about hunters when I just said why a certain light/emitter combo is not for me. I have seen those combos myself in real life. I did not have the numbers to confirm what I saw, nor do I have beamshots out of many of the lights Ive modded. Which is why its interesting to see a good comparison like this. But personally I was not impressed with the XP-G2 compared to the XM-L2 (and I tried several different C8 reflectors and several different larger lights).
Your numbers shows:
The XP-G2 have about 6% more throw compared to the XM-L2. Which I consider to not be visible.
The XM-L2 have about 40% more light compared to the XP-G2. Its got stronger spill light and larger hotspot with pretty much the same throw. Easily visible.
I hear people say this all the time. The XP-G2 "throws soo much better at similar current in big reflectors". So why does your Convoy XP-G2 light only have 6% more throw than the XM-L2 light? Drive the XM-L2 harder and it will outthrow the XP-G2 (domed vs domed). Its also easier to drive the XM-l2 harder.
On top of that, the further towards 5A (or higher) you push those emitters, the more the XM-L2 will go for the lead...
Oh, because of the white background (mcpcb) I thought that it’s dedicated XP-G centering ring, should have clicked the image first…
I am doing the same thing but when screwing down the bezel, reflector rotation also twists this centering ring and its very hard to get 45 degree offset…
Smash on the lens with your thumb, holding the reflector and thus the centering ring in position while screwing the bezel down. Then clean the lens.
And I never said any of this was easy. You should try stuffing the MT-G2 in a Convoy C8, more to it than it might appear. Beats digging ditches in the hot summer Texas sun…
Throw numbers are derived from the lux of course, but the variable is in the spill. The little XP-G2 makes high lux numbers at the cost of very little spill. As the indoor photo shows, there’s not much light to show the area to the sides as compared to an intense hot spot. The difference between the XM-L2 and XP-G2 is much more than the numbers would indicate because of the amount of lumens being put into the peripheral area. There’s still a decently intense hot spot (not a whole lot less than the smaller emitter) but there’s waaaaay more light in the outer areas, making it much more useful than the pencil beam in my opinion.
Again, your need would dictate which way to go.
I will, at the very least, get my standard beamshots tonight to show a comparison at 97 yds. Rain or no rain, cold or not.
Awesome comparison Dale. I am afraid I am in the minoroty though. I love the MT-G2 and the XM-L2 but throwers to.me are funner to play with. I prefer the tighter spot and less spill of the XP-G2. It is just easier to see if a tighter beamed light makes a target because you are not blinded by the spill. I am looking forward to seeing it driven at about 4.5A and de-domed. Great job!
Great shots! I am still a big fan of the MT-G2 for close up work, it puts out so much light it doesn't even seem like I have to pan the flashlight because it lights up my entire field of vision! I am interested to see a dedomed XM-L2 vs. stock XP-G2 and dedomed XP-G2 comparison.
The beam shots look as I imagined. I like a single XM-L or L2 for a thrower, because I don't care for a really tight spot with no spill, but for a flood light I still favor a multiple XM-L or L2 with small reflectors, like the SKR lights. Wall of light is really what I enjoy the most. The MT-G2 is somewhere in between the two of those. I think a multiple MT-G2 in something like the SP03 would be about right for a wall of light monster with enough lumens to still reach out 300 yards or so.
I am hoping to mod one as a prize in the 2nd annual home made light contest this year...... Ooops, wasn't supposed to mention that yet.
Anyhow, thanks for the beam shots from the football field.
Just found this thread… must’ve slacked off a bit over the holiday travel season.
Love the comparisons, but hate you for making me want an MT-G2 in a tiny format. (I’ve been trying to stick to 18650s, but maybe I could sneak a couple of 18350s into the pile…)
One question: in your spreadsheet, you’ve got head temperatures. Is that at the end of 2 minutes? Could you do a 10 minute measurement? Or is that risking a china syndrome?
Head temps are indeed at 2 minutes…the end of the run. I wasn’t sure at that point how long the little 18350’s would carry the big MT-G2 with it’s high demands. So I could probably extend that and watch battery voltage, see where a termination point falls. The cells were down a fair amount, as indicated, but still delivering good current which was a pleasant surprise. How far down to take the cells? With no real way to measure battery voltage while I’m running the lumens test in the lightbox it’s just guesswork. Don’t want to risk doing damage to the little cells with more testing in line, so playing it safe for the time being.
The plan is to get some trail beamshots, which I plan to do tonight, then de-dome or slice and dice and do the beamshots again. Then bump power to the de-domed emitters for a final series of beamshots.
This should give some real world ideas as to what emitter might be the one you’re (or whoever) looking for to do a specific task. That was the whole point of the comparison. Which emitter works for what you need…and it’s pretty much going as I thought with the one big surprise being how well the lights are holding lumens in Ryan’s copper pills. I do wish, at this point, that I’d started at the beginning as I’d intended and used the aluminum pills from the get-go, so I’d have that one more phase of how it all works together. But I was sick and impatient and dove right in, loving the looks of those copper pills I was too eager to get started! lol Not easy now to back up, as the Noctigons are re-flowed to the copper pills, with the exception of the MT-G2 which is using Arctic Alumina thermal paste because I wanted to be able to remove it for the slice-and-dice portion of the experiment, as I don’t put it in gas and do a full-on de-dome. Once it’s sliced and diced, I’ll more than likely reflow it into the copper pill as well.
The only way I can see to really compare from the original Al pill provided is to build them separately, which I have entertained doing….but for the cost of the big MT-G2 and additional drivers. That’d be close to an additional $50, and I’ve already spent about $150 on these 3 lights. At some point a line just has to be drawn, doesn’t it? These emitter/driver/pill combinations should ultimately prove to be very useful, not sure what would happen to aluminum pills…they’d probably be disassembled and used elsewhere so might not be a complete loss. Have to think on that one some more.
Anyone think it’s worth the trouble to build the original Al pills for the comparison? The only thing to prove there is longevity of output as compared to the copper pill, not sure if that alone is worth the cost and effort. (Remember, the 20mm Noctigon that the MT-G2 is mounted on would have to be turned down again to around 16.4mm, then it would be compromised for future use)
Yes JackCY, I’m seeing that in this comparison…and keep in mind that the XM-L2 is being driven at the max recommended by Cree while the XP-G2 is already doubled up, running right at 3A instead of 1.5A. So even doubled up, it’s barely doing a better job. It’ll be interesting to see how they both do when de-domed…
Hiking trail pics tonight. Then I move on to the de-domed phase. Hoping the MT-G2 tightens up enough to put some better light down the middle, we’ll see.
Hi-Res pics added to post 1 for clarification. Click the pic to see it larger in a new window. Click again from there to view at 2048px on the long side.
Thanks Scott, quite a bit to it as it turns out, but it’s fun seeing where it goes. I’ve found an improved walking trail a few minutes away that they recently built a foot bridge for, at the bridge there’s about a 160 yd range that looks promising. I’ll be going over this afternoon to see if I can use that for trail shots. Would be nice, as it’s only a few minutes away. The trail I had planned to go to is about a 30 minute drive one-way, would consume a lot of time and some gas monies to run back and forth taking shots. Either way, I should have some better real world usage shots tonight.
Beats digging ditches in the hot summer Texas sun…