What's the best zoomie at any price?

I wonder how stock Jax Z1 vs stock UF-1405 with XM-L2 would compare…

http://www.gearbest.com/led-flashlights/pp_71429.html
vs

Yeah, he only uses protected 18650s from reputable vendors and charges them on his desk while he’s working so he can keep an eye on them. Never drains them to cut off.

Of large ones, I like the insides of the Uniquefire UF-T20 and the outside of the Yezl t9. The Uniquefire UF-T20 is well made with a nice short focal length glass lens, XM-L2, etc. but it is pug ugly. I like lights made by soldering together pieces of copper pipe, but I don’t like an NC machined shape to look like it was patched together from plumbing surplus. It feels bad in the hand too.
The Yezl is my most beautiful light, with a smooth elegant unusual shape and fine detail, but both the fancy drivers quit the first week, and the thin long focal lens is only good at extreme throw and extreme flood. With replaced drivers and lenses they are my best lights.

In a smaller size, it is the SK-58, though most others have their niches. The TrustFire Z8 has lovely stainless steel threads and enough aluminum for cooling. I like an UltraOK SK-68 for more than two amps, because of the cooling. The Coast HP1 and others of its type have high optical efficiency even in throw mode, unlike simple converging lens zoomies.

I agree about the Zeusray for intermediate size. But there are other good lights in its class, such as the SK-73.

What is a wavien collar? I don’t see how one can get better throw, with the same area, than a lens. That is, it does not appear to be possible, to me.

The JAX Z1 looks good, except for price and what looks like a thin long focal length lens that will give an unnecessarily small spot with little improvement in throw.
The UniqueFire UF-1405 looks like it would work well, but is ugly and sharp cornered, like the UF T20.

The Uniquefire UF1405 is probably the ulitmate right now. Massive throw, but it’s huge.

For a smaller light I would go with the UF-T20 I love that little light.

Of course either of them benefit greatly from a de-domed emitter and better or modded driver.

Quite similar yes. Pop lite do a T34 which is 4AAA and has modes. Very P7 like. In fact I suspect they come from the same factory. The T33 is a tad smaller and single mode. But is really nice to use.

Another thing. Some of the high lux zoomies, I wonder how useful they always are. I’ve an XP-G2 with a Qlite 3.04A driver in a 26650 sized zoomy. It looks impressive. But the reality is the same Led and driver in a C8 throw further and is more useful general purpose. The beam is just too narrow on the zoomy. De-domed would make it smaller again. It is very good on flood however.

It’s possible to make a zoomie with a Wavien collar. Mount the LED on a pillar (like in an LED Lenser), and attach the collar to the sliding bezel. When the bezel is retracted in flood mode, the collar would slide below the LED out of the way. If done right you’d get a nice wide flood together with the maximum possible amount of throw, though the overall light might be a bit longer or wider than a typical zoomie.

To my knowledge, nobody’s ever built a light that does this though.

I see what you are talking about know. A TIR or reflector outer ring, like a Coast HP1 or a Fresnel lighthouse has. That allows better optics in a small space or a very short focal length. It also allows two elements that focus differently, as in the HP1.
It does not give more throw than is possible with single element optics. That is limited by the luminance and the aperture, and refractive lens zoomies approach that limit.
What no one has done yet is to carry it another step and use more than two zones. There are “Fresnel lens” flashlights that use multi-zoned lenses but none with multiple refractive and multiple reflective zones or elements, like the optics that Fresnel actually made.

I just recently got a JAX Z1, up till now I’ve hated zoomies, I built a UF-1405 for a friend and liked it but it was way to large to be practical so when a chance to pick up a Z1 cheap came along I jumped on it and I couldnt be happier. It’s replaced so many light’s it’s pretty unbelievable how useful of a light it is. I’ve only owne SK68’s (and some other 1AA’s) and an SK98 and a TF 26650 zoomie, never a T20 so I cant comment there but the Z1 is really a nice light. Mine does 238kcd for nearly an hour on a KK at 4.8A (maxes out at about 5.2A from a 25R and heat’s up instantly so you know its sinking well.

All in all no I dont regret not getting a zoomie sooner but had I waited longer to get this Z1 I would have regretted that. It’s such a useful light. Especially for city use where you don’t want light to go where you don’t want.

“best zoomie” = oxymoron

Yes, it is like wine. You pay for the improbability. That correlates little with what you want, unless you practice wanting what other people want.

Spec says 2000 Lumen. Anybody measure the real, non-Chinese Lumen?

The tail threads on my Zeusray are on the loose side. This sort of thing might be caused by thermal expansion during rapid NC machining. I junked one $3 SK-68 for loose and short tail threads.

No idea on actual output. But it pulls 3.75 amps on a good battery and is very bright.

Updating Opening post with info from this thread:

Zeusray $9.99 $7.99
XM-L2
solid pill for better heat management
580 kcd Lux
1 x 18650 Battery
Available: http://www.dealmetic.com/product.asp?ID=FL05518
Review: Review: Zeusray CREE XM-L2 zoomable flashlight

UniqueFire UF-1405 $37.36 $27.35
Runs 2 x 18650 or can run 2 x 26650 for longer runtime
58kcd at 4.5m
Available: http://www.gearbest.com/led-flashlights/pp_71429.html
Review: Uniquefire UF-1405 - A worthy zoomy?

JAX Z1
$ 59.79
1 x 18650 Battery / 1 x 26650 Battery
AR coated Lens
43 KLux @1m/Kcd
946 metres range
Available: JAX Z1 Cree XM-L2 U2 Zoomable 1100lm 5-Mode LED Taschenlampe Sale - Banggood Deutschland sold out-arrival notice-arrival notice
Review: JAX Z1 XM-L2 zoom

JAX Z1 Extension tube for $6

WOLF-EYES Seal Hunter
$226.76 $149.99
131kcd
Available: http://www.banggood.com/WOLF-EYES-Seal-Hunter-CREE-XM-L-U2-1000lm-Zoomable-LED-Flashlight-p-919779.html
Review: Wolf-Eyes SEAL-picture heavy

Close but not quite.

A wavien collar is a half-sphere shaped reflector with the LED on the focal point. All light emitted into the sphere is reflected directly back to the LED. This makes the LED brighter, by allowing more excitation of the phosphor layer and more reflections off the LED. The collar has a hole in the top to allow the LED to see the aspheric lens. The idea is that all the light coming off the sides of the LED that would ordinarily hit the sides of the bezel and be wasted is instead redirected directly back to the LED making it brighter. This results in increased intensity of light to the lens and therefore more throw.

Unlike an LED lenser TIR or a fresnel lens, the collar is usually physically mounted directly below the main aspheric lens. The collar is also not a TIR type optic. Instead it has a metalicized finish like a conventional reflector.

Since the light is hitting perpendicular to the sides of the reflector a conventional TIR wouldn’t work. Though come to think of it, if the outer edge of the TIR was made with a series of diamond shaped ridges a TIR probably would work. This is how a bicycle reflector works… there are a series of triangular ridges which allow the light to bounce inside them before being reflected back to the source. A wavien collar made in this manner would have an additional benefit: it would be self-focusing. As long as the LED was in roughly the right location the light would always go back to close to the source. Could eliminate the problem of tricky to focus conventional wavien collars.

My thought is you could mount a wavien collar on the sides of the sliding bezel below the aspheric. When you retract the bezel into flood mode the collar would also retract. To make room for the retracted collar the LED would have to be mounted on a post so it could rise up through the collar’s lens-hole.

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NOTE regarding lighthouse fresnel lens: A fresnel lens has the same effect as an aspheric lens. The advantage is it’s flatter and thinner. The disadvantage is there is some light lost at each ridge, so it isn’t as bright or focused as a standard aspheric. An aspheric lens will always throw further than the same-size fresnel.

This is a completely different concept from a Wavien collar which actually increases the LED’s luminous intensity to the lens and can result in more throw than a standard aspheric by itself.

It had occurred to me that that would be a way of getting more out of an aspheric, but I didn’t catch that that was what was being discussed. So the Coast lights don’t have Wavien collars, as they are like Fresnel lighthouses.
The Wavien collar will increase the spot size if it is a bit out of focus so some light does get past the LED. In focus, as you describe, it increases the throw, because, like the dome, it is not a passive optical device, but interacts with the emitter.
There is no such thing as perpendicular TIR.
I think bicycle and car reflectors are corner reflectors, like radar reflectors.
Did you catch, though that the Coast lights have Fresnel optics, though not what is usually called a Fresnel lens? This may be an important point, as I have read a lot about the the Coast and Lenser lights being patented. The concept patent, if any, was Fresnel’s and has expired.

I got a few measured #'s. My modded ZeusRay measured just over 1,300 OTF (@30 secs) in flood mode of course, LED almost/maybe barely touching the lens --> Nanjg at 3.85A, measured 3.92A tail, XM-L2 U3 1A on Noctigon, swapped switch with an Omten, bypassed springs of course, probably screwed down MCPCB, etc... All right, 1,300 is truly amazing for a little cheapo zoomie - never seen anything like this, but this was my first U3 1A mod, so think I got a good one... Also, the LED is extremely close to the lens on this modded ZeusRay, so closer, more lumens - all zoomies seem to work this way.

Stock I measured the same ZeusRay at 3.60A tail, 782 OTF (@ 30 secs). Not sure of cell, but probably fully charged LG HE2.