I've been a flashaholic for years and I still don't get the obsession with ultra low modes.

[DavidEF]

@Speedsix

No normal person carries a 18650 flashlight to have .003 lumen that he could get from the smallest, cheapest, crappyiest light ever.

See, that’s just not true! I don’t know what the real numbers are, but here’s an example to get close. Let’s say you have a 20mA LED light. I can’t think of any LED’s rated lower than that, but maybe I’m wrong. If you say it uses 3.0V, then you have 3.0 X 0.02 = 0.06 watt. At a low rating (cheapie remember?) of 80 lumens per watt, you would have 4.8 lumens coming out of that flashlight! I think most of us agree that doesn’t qualify as “moonlight” mode. And, it is definitely a lot more than 0.003 lumen by a long shot!

Now, I’m not one to use a 0.003 lumen moonlight. But, as others have said, moonlight mode of just under a lumen is plenty of light for seeing in the dark without ruining your night vision, while also taking care not to disturb others who don’t want to be awake at that time. I use my moonlight mode every morning when I get up, so I don’t disturb my wife who is not ready for bright lights yet. I actually very rarely have any use for a very bright flashlight. I just like bright lights, so I have them.

I’ll give you this: I don’t have a problem with making moonlight mode semi-hidden. In my Olight S20-L2, you can always get to moonlight from off. But, if you happen to be cycling through modes, moonlight isn’t part of the normal cycle. I think that’s a decent way to do it. In fact, the Olight UI seems to me to be almost perfect. The only thing I would change is the return from lock-out. The Olight always unlocks into moon mode. I’d rather it unlock into the last used mode instead.

I think your posts on this topic are bordering on divisive. You have a right to your preference for more light, but why are you being so abrasive about other people wanting a lower mode? Why do you feel like you have to insult people for wanting a moonlight mode, and insist that it isn’t really useful, even after being told by so many that it is very useful? Did someone abuse you with a moonlight mode in your youth? :_(

[hank]

> the BLF X6 group

moon was an option for a while, before it wasn’t: Search results for '' - BudgetLightForum.com

[Chicken_Drumstick]

@ryansoh3

Firefly or moonlight modes are great when it’s pitch black and you only need 0.1 lumens to go across a room without bumping into something or stubbing your toe. Anything brighter (>10 lumens) will be painfully bright when your eyes are adjusted to the darkness and may annoy others if anyone else is near.

Sorry but is total and utter nonsense.

[DavidEF]

@Chicken Drumstick

@ryansoh3

Firefly or moonlight modes are great when it’s pitch black and you only need 0.1 lumens to go across a room without bumping into something or stubbing your toe. Anything brighter (>10 lumens) will be painfully bright when your eyes are adjusted to the darkness and may annoy others if anyone else is near.

Sorry but is total and utter nonsense.

Sorry, but is total and utter nonsense. I don’t see anything ryansoh3 said that is nonsense, so therefore your post is nonsense.

[Chicken_Drumstick]

@Martini

I bet I use moonlight mode three or four times as much as the highest modes on my lights. Lots of tasks require a small amount of light, like bathroom trips, finding my sleeping pills or getting something out of my pack at night. The times I actually NEED 1000 lumens are rare. Sure it’s fun to light up a whole yard or a tree at the end of the block but most of the time it’s not something I really needed to do.

You do realise that there are many light outputs between 1000 lumens and moonlight

Seriously, why must these conversations always end up being polarised comparisons.

[hank]

> Sorry but is …

I recall a color-blind man who believed “red” and “green” pigments are wasted, because both of them look brown to him.

You can’t see it, therefore it doesn’t exist?

Well, I usually applaud the empirical “show me” approach.

But it has its limitations.

I used to be able to hear 20,000 cycles per second in music.
Now, after retirement age, I’ve lost the upper end of that.

And I can’t see nearly as well in the dark as i used to.
I can’t get around by starlight alone, I need some moon in the sky, or a little help.

When I get older, I’ll be able to see (and hear) less.

That doesn’t change the value of high frequency sound, or low level light, for young people with better perceptions.

I’m not the measure of all things for all people.

What I can’t see — says what my limitations are.

[BLightSam]

@89 300ce

I’m a camper and wouldn’t do without ML.

Have you heard of camp fires? Is that too bright for you?

[wolfdog1226]

@Speedsix

I can see the use of these ultra low mode but I don’t use them enough to justify a dedicated mode on my main light. I’m sure if I daily needed a ML mode, I would look for a light that had one but that seems like a very specialized task and shouldn’t be a main mode. Hidden mode like most strobes are? Fine.

So what I propose is all strobes and firefly modes be forever banished to hidden mode territory. Bury them all deep where we don’t have to cycle through them to get to our real light. No normal person carries a 18650 flashlight to have .003 lumen that he could get from the smallest, cheapest, crappyiest light ever. I didn’t become a flashaholic to have weak wimpy light that nobody can see anything with.

This is ANOTHER post that is a perfect example of what Mike C said in post #41………What I find amazing is how short sighted some people are. When something is of no use to them they simply cannot grasp the concept of it being useful for someone else.
_

This is coming from a guy who has 15 modded throwers staring with one that fits in the palm of my hand[75Kcd] to the TK75vn KT[3300 LUMENS/341Kcd and the TK61vn V4- 750Kcd!!!

Just because you do not like ML or strobe,doesn’t mean it isn’t useful to others! I already posted how important STROBE is to someone walking a Dog on Hilly and curvy roads,I am one of them!

[Adoby]

Those who dislike moonlight modes can buy flashlights without moonlight modes, or simply refrain from using them.

Those who like moonlight modes can buy flashlights with moonlight modes, and use them as much as they like.

What was the problem again?

Do we really need a fatwa or a holy crusade for or against?

[pilotdog68]

@Adoby

Those who dislike moonlight modes can buy flashlights without moonlight modes, or simply refrain from using them.

Those who like moonlight modes can buy flashlights with moonlight modes, and use them as much as they like.

What was the problem again?

Do we really need a fatwa or a holy crusade for or against?

This
Plus, others who really care enough can learn to flash your own firmwares so everything is exactly how you want it. It’s intimidating at first, but in the end very simple.

I don’t buy flashlights anymore, I buy hosts.

[Old-Lumens]

@Adoby

What was the problem again?

The problem is, as it has always been. People. Some just like to cause trouble. Some like to see problems develop and arguments come up. Some live to see others get upset or cause controversy. Here, in a bar, in a home, at work, on the street, on the phone, in a war, there’s always someone to stir the pot and others to jump in and add to it. That’s all it is and it’s a waste of time as always.

[wolfdog1226]

@Old-Lumens

@Adoby

What was the problem again?

The problem is, as it has always been. People. Some just like to cause trouble. Some like to see problems develop and arguments come up. Some live to see others get upset or cause controversy. Here, in a bar, in a home, at work, on the street, on the phone, in a war, there’s always someone to stir the pot and others to jump in and add to it. That’s all it is and it’s a waste of time as always.

AGREED,Very well said “OL”.

We can’t change anyone but ourselves,nothing more needs to be said, it would be a waste of time and energy! :bigsmile:

[ToyKeeper]

@DavidEF

the Olight UI seems to me to be almost perfect. The only thing I would change is the return from lock-out. The Olight always unlocks into moon mode. I’d rather it unlock into the last used mode instead.

In case it might help, the Baton.c firmware unlocks to the last-used mode instead of moon.

@DavidEF

I think your posts on this topic are bordering on divisive. You have a right to your preference for more light, but why are you being so abrasive about other people wanting a lower mode? Why do you feel like you have to insult people for wanting a moonlight mode, and insist that it isn’t really useful, even after being told by so many that it is very useful?

This bothers me too. As O-L said, it’s a people problem and some people like to cause controversy. That’s how things have always been, but the internet has a knack for amplifying this sort of thing from a nuisance to a danger. Fortunately BLF is pretty resistant to drama, but it’s still worth a bit of conscious effort on our parts to try not to weaponize the conversation so our friendly admin doesn’t have to get involved.

[LowLumen]

For my practical use, just 1 floody lumen makes a good low. At the other end 500 Lumen is about as bright as I ever need. I don’t work in a coal mine or find I need to light things up more than 200 feet away or compete with the sun , so this range has me covered for 99.99%.

Furthermore…. all lights brighter than about 1000 Lumen should be banned or restricted to special permit use only. There is just no reason why common civilians should be allowed to use so much light. Someone could be temporarily blinded and it’s just gross light pollution. Too much attention is paid to these big bright monsters here.

And for those that think they can get around with these sub-lumen modes, they should be required to wear a helmet. It’s just too dangerous to be stumbling around in the dark this way. Someone could get hurt.

That works for me. Now I’m taking my toys and going home.

[Haterade]

You don’t spend enough time in total darkness. Waking from total sleep with no light source. That’s when sublumen modes rule.

Or being subtle in public, or a meeting, or in the car on a road trip…… etc…

Buy what works for you.

[2_DOGS]

I like my BLF X6 on low ( among others).
If I need more light I ramp it up.
I like the ability to flood everything and still light a small area when I need to.
I use low more than high unless I’m trying to impress newbys.

[xv-750]

In the other place and 73% of those polled are either 'love it top priority' or 'desirable - a pro feature' voters

see: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?341755-Sub-Lumen-quot-Moonlight-quot-Mode-Poll

[kronological]

[jacktheclipper]

Like /\

[Dimbo_The_Blinky]

@Speedsix

If I need less light which almost is never the case, I just use my $0.99 keychain light. For all other uses, I want actual light I can use.

Hail and well met, fellow Freak Of Nature!

I try to push the fact that, given the embarrassing “State Of The Art” of the fetid fecal matter we optimistically call “BATTERIES”, that light will be plenty dim enough, plenty soon enough, that there’s no point making it dim on purpose!

When we get useful, modern batteries, small & light enough to be portable, with enough power & capacity to be interesting, I’ll still pull out that impulse-buy dispose-a-light (with a momentary switch and the kind of form factor I can bite for light) for any time I actually “Need” a dim flashlight. Especially if it’s red. And if they ever quit making them, a .002-cent Red LED and salvaged CMOS/watch/hearing-aid battery will do just fine. And there’s always the Mag Solitaire if you really must spend Good Money to have the least amount of light possible…

But I get that I’m a freak, because I almost never turn a flashlight ON with a click. Most of my torch usage is Momentary, although I do click them on often enough that I like that feature. If I am around others & don’t want to bother anyone, my hands & fingers or other body parts (stop giggling, not ALL other body parts!) do a perfect job of keeping the surroundings au naturel for that moment.

To address another poster’s comment, I’m also a freak for not liking the pencil-beam “thrower” lights. I have never been able to get myself to the place where that “thrower” is illuminating, because the useful light is always Somewhere Else. Throws a mile?? Great. When you get there, the illumination is still a mile away! As noted earlier, at useful-working distances that freakishly-intense hot spot overdrives the eyes so that nothing else is visible, and the tiny spot only illuminates such a uselessly small area that I end up literally “throwing” them, either in the trash, in the woods, AT someone, or I just give them away to n00bz. Or (thanks to y’all here), now I can mod them!

OTOH, I have changed my mind about the Blinky mode, having used it to Good Effect in Bad Traffic. I would never want to be anywhere near the Zombie Horde, thumbing their “smart phones”, oblivious to the rest of us, at night, without a super-bright strobe!