Did I? I don't remember, but I only have a bookmark for the SiR404DP. Did anybody ever try that one?
I think it was me that found the SIR800DP initially, based on what Wight told me to look for in the spreadsheets. Then Richard looked at it and tried it, found it to be spot on, and it became the de facto standard for some of us.
I used 16 ga for the first time tonight. 
This is actually an MTN 17mm driver with the positive contact in the middle.
Hmm… so you did… I see that we had a PM conversation covering that topic called ":-) retaliatory try this! :-)" back in October 2014.
So… in that case who identified the SiR800DP? Eh, apparently me heh… at the time I found it I must have recalled that PM conversation and thought that SiR800DP was the one you showed me. (FWIW note that I later realized that the SiS414DN which I mention in that post uses a different package / eg is unsuitable.)
I’m certain that I have examined SiR404DP at some point, but I couldn’t tell you a thing about it right now. :-/
EDIT: And DB Custom (then DBCstm) must have done the leg work! I certainly wasn’t shelling out $2 for an FET at the time.
I bought my first 5 SIR800DP from Mouser on Dec 15, 2014 for $1.83 each.
With one left in my kit, I have used 114 of the SIR800DP since that first purchase.
Used a lot of PSMN0R9 and 3R0 as well, and a few Toshiba thrown in for good measure.
Where’s the smiley with the big, wide, and alarmed eyes when you need it? Good stuff DB Custom.
I vaguely remember the Toshiba ones… they had a unique package with more metal involved. And maybe they cost around $3/ea? I dunno.
I bet that you’ve assembled more drivers in one day than I have total.
The Toshiba had a second metal plate on the top, not to be used for current but to be connected to a thermal mass.
I just did 25 in 2 panels the other day. Love doing em on a panel, looks so cool! Richard, now, is really REALLY making some drivers!
Sometimes I just do one, I have a small piece of sheet copper that I clamp in short straight stats and hold that in my vice, apply the soldering iron underneath. Occasionally I’ll reflow an emitter that way as well, if just doing something simple and quick.
Edit: Might be worthy to note that when I was just starting to populate those 25 boards it was storming and our lights went out. I used the 10,000 lumen BTU Shocker with triple 9V MT-G2s doing a ceiling bounce to be able to see to populate em. Later, when we got electricity back, I re-flowed them simultaneously on the stove top. Yet another light with a AW driver in it. :bigsmile:
For the record, the tiny 10mm FET’s with MMU and crazy small MOSFET’s are a PITA! The MMU has to be re-flowed onto a programming chip board, then taken off and put on the driver. All 7 components, virtually the same as our normal drivers, fit on a 10mm board. Those can drive ya bonkers!
Hey Dale, since you're up for seemingly absolutely anything, try the SiR404DP. It's got only about 2/3rds the resistance of the 800DP!
I'm just not sure about the gate charge/capacitance specs and whether it'll play nice when driven by a dinky little MCU.
On the way, should be here Thurs or maybe Fri.
Edit: ie, SIR404DP
Yet another FET that isn’t available where I buy components. Any thoughts on the SIRA00DP? I can get that one, and it appears to have pretty low resistance too.
If it turns out they work, Dale will end up buying a few hundred and he'll send you some. LOL.
Guess I’ll just have to get a SIRA00DP and try for myself.
Sorry, that was a roundabout way of saying I don't know how the specs (the gate characteristics) will affect things since I don't know yet how the 404DP will behave.
But at a glance, it doesn't look promising.
SIR800DP: (works)
| Gate Charge (Qg) @ Vgs | 133nC @ 10V |
|---|---|
| Input Capacitance (Ciss) @ Vds | 5125pF @ 10V |
SIR404DP: (probably works? maybe?)
| Gate Charge (Qg) @ Vgs | 97nC @ 4.5V |
|---|---|
| Input Capacitance (Ciss) @ Vds | 8130pF @ 10V |
SIRA00DP: (???)
| Gate Charge (Qg) @ Vgs | 220nC @ 10V |
|---|---|
| Input Capacitance (Ciss) @ Vds | 11700pF @ 15V |
It doesn't help that those aren't directly comparable since they are not at the same voltages (and also especially that I really don't know what happens when the gate specs don't play nice with the MCU).
Cool. I’ve just made a version of my FET driver (Mod: My take on the convoy S series with side switch mod.) with the PowerPAK SO8 and ordered some samples from OSH Park. I’ve got an order ro place on Farnell so I’ll just add a couple of SIRA00DPs, stick ’em on and see what happens.
The SIRA00DP works but doesn’t put out as high a current.
Apples to apples it might do 4.2A while a SIR800DP does 5.3A.
I did try some, great if max amperage isn’t required and probably a good option for those situations where a light is going to be used with a protected cell.
Thanks DB!
I got some to compare with the SIR800, built X6 lights with everything else being the same, literally. The output on the SIRA00DP was disappointing. The PSMN0R9 was very similar on a fresh charged cell , very close to the SIR800DP, but when the cell runs lower then the SIR800DP pulls ahead. Richard has found this to be true as well and highly favors the 800.
Found the notes…
Built 3 X6’s with XM-L2 U2 3D emitters out of the same tape. Samsung 20R cells at 4.22V
It wasn’t so much the amperage as it was the output…
SIRA00DP 4.59A at 1169.55
SIR800DP 4.59A at 1373.1
PSMN0R9 4.63A at 1373.1
Differences exaggerated as the cell dropped power.
Sharpie, was it on an Aluminum star? That’ll do it every time…
Yikes. Yeah, I’ve done that to the little mosfets and I certainly do hate that smell. Do the little rectangles have the implosion dot on top? lol I actually got a new light once that had a massive brass pill in it. It stunk of that electrical burn. I know good and well it had been blown and returned, the driver actually had some burned components still on it as though they didn’t even bother to put a new driver on it, told me it was the last one available and sent it. I, of course, put an FET in it with an MT-G2 and except for the smell that’s in that brass to this day, never looked back.
I know the older XM-L2 can take up to 8A, usually, but apparently the XM-L can’t go that high. I seem to recall really liking the T6 versions of XM-L, I’ve got a bunch of old ones sitting in my kit that have been removed but of course not much way to identify them. My UV light can get me close on the tint bin I guess, after that power level would pretty much sum up the bin.
I think you’re right about the XM-L being great for 3A and under, even maybe 4A in a certain kind of light, so maybe they aren’t quite as capable as the new ones, they’re still nice emitters. Everything doesn’t have to be hot rodded. Just everything mine. 
Keep reading, you’ll get there.
For FET selection for use in single cell (or 1s4p & etc) lights the RDS (on) vs VGS graph, or another graph containing similar info, is a primary factor for obvious reasons. Low RDS (on) is good of course… Clearly as long as we have a lower resistance than the equivalent wire length there’s not much gain to be had. When comparing SiR800DP and PSMN0R9-30YLD the graphs for RDS (on) vs ID (so top of page 3 and Fig10 on page 8 respectively) are very telling. The rest can either be seen in the specs table or with a scope…
FWIW I think you may have keyed off of comfychair’s comment. Remember that comfy’s very skilled but also hit and miss on driver knowledge - and just back from an approximately 1-year break from the forum.
I don’t want to sound mean about this, but we are quite aware that cells are a major limiting factor! For many of us this sort of information is quite mundane (especially in a thread like this one). You must have noticed all the discussion of high drain cells and the results they provide in ‘XYZ’ DD light? That’s not monkeys and typewriters…
Springs are another major limiting factor, that’s why we bypass them for these lights. You’ll find that if not bypassed at high currents they simply fail. Switches also have high losses, so some builders use the best switches they can. Another solution is to use momentary/e-switch lights where that’s no longer an issue (Tom E’s preference).
In terms of your burnt XM-L… you’re doing it wrong. I’ve personally measured an XM-L at 9A in short bursts - repeatedly. That setup went into a P60 which is still duty-carried with a cell that can make 9A through the LED. It’s got instant turbo rampdown, but the turn-on is always at 9A. I probably should have dialed it back, but I didn’t and it still functions. (Djozz has done considerably worse things, but not to the old XM-L.) Your missing ingredient is DTP. FWIW IIRC XM-L has higher current handling, old XM-L2 has high current handling, and new XM-L2 has mediocre current handling. (3 bond wires, 2 bond wires, 2 weaker bond wires)
At the end of the day, having some limiting resistance for a DD light is sometimes a good idea. You’ll see folks do it here. DD does mean that “any old cell” is never suitable - a [hypothetical] high enough drain cell will kill any 3v LED.
EDIT: Oops, looks like DB beat me to it. If you killed the XM-L while it was on a Noctigon mounted in a light… I suspect that your meter simply wasn’t fast enough to show the actual current. (Not enough solder on the thermal pad can also be a problem of course.) I added some strike-through since you’ve already ruled out my prime suspect.
EDIT2: I’ve destroyed more parts by “foolishness” than anything else. 