In the newest Mailbag, Dave gets a Lumintop TD16 - the manufacturer claims, that this light will run on 1000 Lumens for 2.2 hours.
2.2 hours - or 2:12 means, that Lumintop has suddenly invented a 18650 battery that has over 6000mAh capacity.
Since there is no 18650 over 3600mAh at the moment - they just simply lie.
On a flashlight that costs ~100€.
I just wrote them that question and will post the answer here.
Since they don’t write anything about dimming because of heat or a Turbo-Timer, they just lie to customers who have no idea about this whole stuff.
Edited because it’s not just Lumintop that lies about the Lumens&Runtimes
This is not a lie. It is saying that it will run for that amount of time in the high mode that starts at 1000 lumens. It is not saying it will run at 1000 lumens for that amount of time. It is almost universal at this point for manufacturers to have stepdowns for their highest mode and they advertise the runtime that you will get in the highest mode taking into account the ANSI output (after 30 seconds).
I am 100% for calling manufacturers out on their bs, but you have not provided an example of bs.
Well, if I read “1000 Lumens - 2.2hours” - I assume that this thing will run at 1000 Lumens at 2.2hours.
Also, they mention “ansi” nowhere I have to assume that they don’t use this standart
It wouldn’t be a problem if this thing wouldn’t cost a friggin 100€.
If I buy a 5€ China light with 2000 Lumens (wink) out of a fake XP-E, I don’t expect premium quality from it - but at 100€?
I could buy 2 L6 or 5-6 C8 / S-Line Convoys for that money.
I just simply don’t expect to be cheated in such a way from a premium manufacturer.
I agree that they could mean what you described. Informed people will know that. But the ad aims also uninformed people, and it clearly says 2.5h@1000 lumens, or 11h@170 lumens or 65h@25 lumens... :(
But its not only them i have light from these manufactures that also state the same.
Nitecore
Jetbeam
Xtar
Olight
Led lenser
It doesn’t make it okay but it is what it is. The ANSI testing is a joke for the most part.
I understand what you fellows are saying and, yes, you are correct. It is also true that all manufactures do this.
However, I think the point L4M4 was trying to make was that it is a little disingenuous. Manufactures know that flashlight forum members understand all the nuances and, but to a lay person, they are going to look at those numbers and simply assume it means max out put for the stated time. It’s marketing, plain and simple.
No manufacture wants to be the wrist company to say, “1300 lumens for 3.7 hours, but don’t get too excited because while that lumen number is accurate, the run time includes the step-down at 90 seconds and all the time it takes for the light to continuously dim from there this it goes completely out”.
That’s not going to sell flashlights, right? Even if a company were willing to be 100% transparent and proactive in educating consumers, they’d still have to compete with the guy who is selling 10,000 lumen lights that are actually 100 lumen lights on Ebay because that guy just says, “10K lumens for infinity”.
A similar thing happens when you watch a food supplement commercial, then right at the end, they say really fast, “Claims not tested by the FDA”. Most people don’t actually “hear” that part, do they?
Anyway, being an educated consumer is, as it always has been, the best defense.
I’m just as dissatisfied as you are with how manufacturers typically advertised runtimes.
Seeing your post count though, I’m assuming you’ve been around lights for quite some time, and I’m surprised that you’re surprised by your finding and vexed enough to contact Lumintop about it.
Of all the manufacturers, I think Fenix is actually MORE misleading than the rest, because they advertise Turbo or Max mode runtimes while also claiming “Digitally regulated output maintains constant brightness.” I don’t blame anyone for interpreting that to mean constant brightness for the duration of the advertised runtime at the advertised max output, which a lot more often than not is definitely not the case.
That’s because I don’t usually buy premium lights or care about the runtime.
I mod lights and don’t really use any of my lights regular, just to find stuff in my flat or something - so runtime is absolutely uninterestingly.
I am very interested in the answer from Lumintop - if there will be one.
I am just a bit shocked how they are clearly lying to the customer and just don’t give a f*ck about it.
And if every “big” manufacturer does this, it’s even worse.
ANSI Lumens… so the time for “high” or 1000 Lumens is for how long the light runs on high until it drops from 1000 to 100 lumens - that’s farcical.
There isn’t ANY 1x18650 high power flashlight in the world that can run on turbo for more than a few minutes without severely overheating, at which point it must either step down or shut off.
If the light shuts off before reaching battery depletion it wouldn’t be called “runtime”.
If they didn’t allowed stepdown the Nitecore EC4 would be the longest running flashlight, most other lights not reaching even 5 minutes. And a FET based driver would have a runtime of 1 second, since the output drops soon as you turn it on.
Simply put there is no other way of measuring runtime, and the ANSI standard is the most applicable one. The best solution to this is to force manufacturers to include a runtime chart in the specs.
The lithium battery was a work in progress in the 1970’s and not a fulfilled product until 1980. The general public has little qualified information on these batteries, and is a reason for misinformation as well as deception.
You could specify run time in a unit like lumen*hours, but a runtime chart is a lot more clear and provides more information on the output curve. Frankly, I do think manufactures are using the ANSI standard to deliberately deceive the buyer. Just because everyone does it, doesn’t make it right.
