Review: MaxToch Mission M12

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Tom E
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Here: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/MAXTOCH-Mission-M12-Long-Shooting-1-Cell-Flashlight-AR-Lens-Copper-Circuit-Board-Long-Runtime-26700/314381_1836678467.html

but Richard at mtmelectronics.com says he's going to be carrying/selling these, and his prices are always pretty good.

 

Ray-o-light
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That Richard is a Genius!

Hey Babe, check out my new light!!

travis
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Do they make extension tubes for this—to make it a 2 cell, like the M24?

“"A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.””
-George Washington

Ray-o-light
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And the driver probably couldn’t handle 8.4v anyways.

Hey Babe, check out my new light!!

travis
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Maybe:
From the OP:

““If you look at the MaxToch M24, the head is identical in looks and dimensions to the M12, therefore, I’m thinking they are using the same driver. if so, the driver could possibly take 2 cells (8.4v).”“

“"A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.””
-George Washington

Ray-o-light
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Well!, if that’s the case, an extension tube would be dandy! Maybe I can find one that will Lego. Hmm…

Hey Babe, check out my new light!!

mudgripz
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Recently got one of these lights and have just done runtime test on it. Very surprised….with a fully charged Maxtoch 5000mAh battery it ran for 3 hours on high beam. Not very bright at end but would have still done a little more.

Impressive runtime performance for a single cell XML2. The Maxtoch 26700 batteries must be good.

bibihang
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As far as I know the ANSI method to measure the runtime is when the light output is dropped to 50% of its initial output.

Tom E
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mudgripz wrote:
Recently got one of these lights and have just done runtime test on it. Very surprised....with a fully charged Maxtoch 5000mAh battery it ran for 3 hours on high beam. Not very bright at end but would have still done a little more. Impressive runtime performance for a single cell XML2. The Maxtoch 26700 batteries must be good.

Well in the stock form, amps draw could be close to 4A or less at start. 4A draw would only be roughly 1.4 hours, but the amps draw starts to drop immediately as the battery drains with a current limited driver, not current controlled. You'd expect more that 1.4 hours, and in this case, it doubles. These cells are the KK 26700 sold by Richard at MtnElectronics. I've tested a few on the Opus charger and they show 5300-5400 - some variations cell to cell which is typical for all KK's. If you measured tailcap amps along the way on occasion, it should indicate droppage in amps. At the end, maybe under 1A? I'm thinking average was about 2A for a 3 hour runtime.

These are excellent cells though - low resistance and high capacity.

bibihang wrote:
As far as I know the ANSI method to measure the runtime is when the light output is dropped to 50% of its initial output.

That's probably the loophole manufacturers take advantage of by dropping amps draw 1-3 minutes into a run. What mudgripz is doing is more practical, but of course with lowering output along the way, a function of the driver, the Vf, and the cell.

unknown00101
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bibihang wrote:
As far as I know the ANSI method to measure the runtime is when the light output is dropped to 50% of its initial output.

The last review I read said ANSI runtime was down to 10%.
SubLGT
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Tom E wrote:

Ok – Amanda pm’ed me. She said the tech told her the M12 MCPCB is different from the 2X – the M12 does not have a direct thermal path, but the 2X one does. This explains it. So, guess gotta pull the LED and attempt a grinding out of the pad to hit the copper, then solder fill… I did this once and it didn’t work out too well – couldn’t get the LED to sit right, too much solder, but if you go too little, no thermal contact….

Will the latest production run of the M12 be improved, and have a direct thermal path?

Tom E
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SubLGT wrote:
Will the latest production run of the M12 be improved, and have a direct thermal path?

I'm thinking yes. I would contact MaxToch, probably Amanda, if I were you before buying. I don't see it specifically mentioned on their product page here:

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/MAXTOCH-Mission-M12-Long-Shooting-1-Cell-Flashlight-AR-Lens-Copper-Circuit-Board-Long-Runtime-26700/314381_1836678467.html

but I thought they updated all these lights to DTP MCPCB's. Richard doesn't say it explicitly either here: http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=80&product_id=359. Hhmm...

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I asked richard before ordering my m12 from him. He said it had the direct Thermal mcpcb. If it didn’t I was going to order a direct one from him and reflow it. Not sure if they come stock with it or if Richard is changing them to direct mcpcb.

I wish there was an easy way to take the tail plug out of this light without scratching it up…. if anyone has any ways of removing it safely let me know.
morris8809
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Here is the reply from Amanda.

Hello I was wondering if the newest production runs of m12’s have direct thermal path mcpcb’s or not.
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MTAmanda 12/09/2014 – 00:14 Delete Block
Hello,
Thanks for your inquiry. The latest production hasn’t apply direct thermal path yet. It is copper MCPCB.

RMM does have DTP maxtoch 26mm mcpcb listed on his site: http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=63_65...

crnkin
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Easily solved!

http://www.banggood.com/MAXTOCH-CREE-XM-L2-XM-L-Copper-Star-Board-With-Direct-Thermal-26×1_6mm-p-944114.html

Chris

Tom E
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Hhhmmm... I wouldn't think Richard would be swapping these out on his own - just a lot more time he has little of, I would think. This sounds quite weird to me... Since they sell the DTP versions, why wouldn't they switch over in all their lights? Maybe just didn't do a new batch run of M12's yet?

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That’s what it sounds like to me as well.

SubLGT
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RMM is out of stock for the M12 flashlight, maybe on his new order he is able to specify the inclusion of the DTP feature? I plan on sending him an email to confirm this.

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I may have been mistaken when I said that the M12 had a DTP MCPCB.  I had checked the M24 and it did, and I think that I checked one of the M12s as well, but I don't know for sure now if I thought I had checked it but just got mixed up with the M24.  Unfortunately I don't have any more M12s to check out.

If I mixed it up, I apologize in advance.  

Mountain Electronics : batteries, Noctigon, and much more! What's new? 

Tom E
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Don't think anything lost Richard - you are out-of-stock now, so maybe something to ask/check in the next run. I know I was sort of surprised the M12's weren't, but I would think these are high qual copper boards anyway, and probably don't have much loss's, accept for 6+A which is hard to get to anyway... In djozz's tests (http://budgetlightforum.com/node/30532), he showed even the cheap copper board at 3A has no difference, and at 4A, it's about 4% or so.

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No problem Richard. It’s a great light either way. I have added 22awg wire to the tail sping, and will reflow the led to the dtp mcpcb once one comes in. I’d like to find a blank to fit in place of the stock driver so I can run a better driver without having to remove all of the components from the stock one.

SubLGT
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I received this in an email reply from Richard:

“If you’re running at stock levels there is no gain, but if you are going to crank it up then a DTP is a big advantage.”

I plan to keep my M12 at stock levels (no mods), so it’s good to know the lack of DTP will not be an issue.

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Does the stock M12 have reverse polarity protection?

Tom E
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SubLGT wrote:
I received this in an email reply from Richard: "If you're running at stock levels there is no gain, but if you are going to crank it up then a DTP is a big advantage." I plan to keep my M12 at stock levels (no mods), so it's good to know the lack of DTP will not be an issue.

+1 agree - probably so small, not measurable or within the error tolerance range.

SubLGT wrote:
Does the stock M12 have reverse polarity protection?

I would assume so - not sure if they spec it that way, but from look'n at the pic of the driver in post #1, appears to be a diode to the right of the MCU - that's probably responsible for the reverse polarity protection.

SubLGT
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Thanks Tom E. I would hate to fry a $65 flashlight because of a careless battery insertion.
From what I have seen, the lesser known Chinese manufacturers don’t seem to write much in their product advertising about the electronic features on their flashlights, such as over discharge protection, low voltage warning, and reverse polarity protection. But the well known manufacturers, such as Fenix, list all the electronic features.

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My several days old M12 draws 1.9 amps ( 18650 B batteries) at the tailcap, and they claim circuit eff to be above 92%, is that means that the emiter is overdriven?
It reaches 93k lux at 1 meter with same batteries

will34
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1.9A from a single cell is not overdrive at all, in fact it is pretty low; that’s about 8 watts to the LED.

How does it compare with your other xm-l2 lights in overall output?

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I am talking about the M12 sniper 2×18650 version,cause i saw ppl talk about it too, if eff is 92% maybe the emitter runs at 3500ma or smth, not 3000ma, or its just the driver eff isnt 92% Smile

My modded Yezl beats it by far, but its dedomed too, still waiting for HD2010 and Olight to arrive
With 19650 PF class barreties it sometimes cant stand the rifle`s recoil, those batteries are a bit short

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@ Tom E:
you told us, you`ve tried to resistor mod the original driver. Could you please tell me the results, and which resistors you have tried?

I have bought a used one, but already dedomed. Was reading 120kcd, after the tail spring mod 140 kcd with an 18650 25R.
That`s ok, but maybe i can get some improvemet by higher amps and better focusing?

Mac

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Tom E wrote:
……………….no mode memory, but it resets to Hi quickly (within 1-2 secs when off), which is ok for me (for a 5 mode driver)………………

I recently bought a M12 from MtnElec, and it has a different UI. It is 4 mode, with memory, and a hidden strobe that is accessed with a momentary half press quickly followed by another half or full press.

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