I've been a flashaholic for years and I still don't get the obsession with ultra low modes.

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Speedsix
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One thing I want to clarify is what I mean by moonlight mode. I mean less than one lumen. A low mode of 3-10 lumens is very useful and I will never argue otherwise. I’m talking about that ultra low mode that you have to look at the emitter to see if it actually on.

I’ve had lights with moonlight mode and attempted to use that mode for things that I thought were reasonable. For example, I had to use my keys to open my front door once (normally open garage door from car) and I tried moonlight to see the lock and my keys. My neighborhood is really dark but it isn’t pitch dark. The moonlight mode was simply not bright enough to be useful.

I guess my point is, I don’t think there have ever really been any situations where I wanted less light than say 3 lumens. It just seems like such a specialized mode that I’m surprised how common it is considering I don’t have a use for it or know anyone who would ever use it. I think it’s a flashaholic kind of thing that has found its way into production.

hank
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You get out of your car and try to unlock your house using “moon mode” and complain?

You’ve been using it wrong.

Look, no offense meant, but you either can’t use it, or you don’t know when to use it.

Moon mode — for dark-adapted eyes — is useless half an hour before your eyes get dark-adapted.

And it’s useless if you’re well into your late 60s or 70s, on average, because your eyes no longer work with so little light.

Have you spent half an hour in complete darkness so you have some idea what your night vision can do for you?

Good. Now, spend two hours in a dark sky site so your night vision has fully adapted and you’re getting the maximum night vision you’re capable of.

How’s that work for you?

Seriously, sincerely, no offense meant here — but you have to know how the tool works for you, to be able to use it, if you can.

Think of it like using earphones to listen to music.
The older you get, the louder you have to set the volume knob.
The louder the surroundings, the higher you have to set the volume knob.
If you’re an old guy, you never hear silence — you always hear the noise in your ears, some whistling or clicking — tinnitus. Increases with age.

Same sort of thing happens with vision, and our other senses.

Rufusbduck
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Think of it as a whisper of light when you don’t want to shout.

Three Tanna leaves to give him life, nine to give him movement. But what if he eats the whole bag?

Scott

Ormbett
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Rufusbduck wrote:
Think of it as a whisper of light when you don’t want to shout.

“Think of it as a whisper of light when you do need to shite”

(Urban Dictionary: Shite – a very british and therefore great way of saying shit. shite sounds much more effective than shit)

DavidEF
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Ormbett wrote:
shite sounds much more effective…

effective? You need a laxative? :Sp

The Cycle of Goodness: “No one prospers without rendering benefit to others”
- The YKK Philosophy

Ormbett
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DavidEF wrote:
Ormbett wrote:
shite sounds much more effective…
effective? You need a laxative? :Sp

That was a quote from Urban Dictionary website Smile

xv-750
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hank wrote:
And it's useless if you're well into your late 60s or 70s, on average, because your eyes no longer work with so little light.

i resemble this remark, being 67, and moonlight is my favourite and most used mode!

Riding for 57 years, last off was black ice in ’73.

First paid computer job was in ’75, writing an extra report for HAPAS accounts on a Wang Computer.

Lightgecko
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I find myself using moon modes all the time.

I have another hobby: repairing small engines. I find myself using them to look down tiny holes in shiny aluminum chainsaw carburetors. Even 5 lumens reflects enough to shadow the bottom of the hole.

Curiosity killed the cat……But I’m not a cat…..

cabfrank
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Surprisingly, since I got into this hobby wanting only the brightest all the time, I would like to try out a light with a true moon mode. I like the low on the BLF SE X6, but it is definitely not moon.

ToyKeeper
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Personally, I find the 0.1 lumen moon mode on a ZL SC52 (spec’d at 0.34 lm, but actually just 0.1), ceiling-bounced, is plenty of light for the entire bedroom at night. A tenth of a lumen spread around an entire room is quite a bit dimmer than actual moonlight, but it’s just about right for my purposes.

On the other hand, I’m blind outside in direct sunlight unless I wear very dark glasses, and even then it’s still uncomfortable.

Different people have dramatically different levels of light sensitivity. More generally, different people are different. Recognize it, respect it, move on.

jerm03
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While I like it, if I had a choice I would select about 3 lmn instead of the less than 1.
Jerry

Gunga
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Well. My favourite circuit is a dr Jones lucidrv /ft so I can use short cycle memory and get my Moon mode. I use moon every night. Love it.

beam0
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Every Mfg. is not going to build a ML mode into their lights, some will have it and some won’t, like some of us want ML and others don’t.

Why do we need to debate this? I thought most of us are flashlight junkies with multiple light collections. There are so many different lights / drivers / modes available.
Of course we all have different wants and needs! So just get what you want or need!

 

DavidEF
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beam0 wrote:
Every Mfg. is not going to build a ML mode into their lights, some will have it and some won’t, like some of us want ML and others don’t.

Why do we need to debate this? I thought most of us are flashlight junkies with multiple light collections. There are so many different lights / drivers / modes available.
Of course we all have different wants and needs! So just get what you want or need!


Part of the debate (maybe even the biggest part) is centered around whether ML is a necessary mode when doing group buy lights. If you want to be in the group buy, you have to buy the light that the group buy provides. A lot of times, it is a BLF customized light, which means that opinions are solicited for what people want in a light. That’s when the debate rolls around. Some people only want the highest high. Some want the lowest low. And others want everything in the world for $20 or less, shipped! In order to get participation up on the group buy, every reasonable request is taken into consideration, and usually compromises are made.

Nobody wants their must-have feature to be the one on the chopping block, so feelings get hurt, and threads like this get started. Really, this thread is about one person’s inability to see value in something that they don’t personally use. I call that narrow-minded. But, what do I know? It’s also a little selfish for people to think every GB light has to have everything on their personal list of favorite features. If the light doesn’t have a feature I want, or if it has features I can’t live with, I just ignore the GB and move on. Seemingly, some people can’t do that for some reason. Then, there are those that have no comprehension of what is actually taking place, but they read that one feature was compromised in favor of another, and they believe it without verifying if it is even true. That happened a lot on the EE X6-SE group buy.

The Cycle of Goodness: “No one prospers without rendering benefit to others”
- The YKK Philosophy

bibihang
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DavidEF wrote:
Part of the debate (maybe even the biggest part) is centered around whether ML is a necessary mode when doing group buy lights…

This is very true. Whenever there is a GB happening, one of the highly debatable, most difficult things to come down to a conclusion is always the choice of the driver modes, and then the LED tint is next.

For me I usually just set two very basic requirements for the flashlight driver: High PWM frequency and no/hidden blinkies. Other than that I won’t start/join a debate like that.

beam0
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Yes true I was thinking the same thing about the group buys.

BLF Special Edition lights could have the “user selectable” Dr. Jones Guppydrv, then everyone can have whatever modes they want and change them with button clicks. I like how you can change from multi-mode to single mode.

Another thought is to have the ML mode “hidden” like hidden strobes.

 

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