TrustFire X9 - Thoughts and beamshots

254 posts / 0 new
Last post
pounder
pounder's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/20/2011 - 16:43
Posts: 1788
Location: Ontario

harry25175 wrote:

pounder wrote:

that's what I got from a trustfire flame that will do 4a on my 980l..this is using a good accurate meter with 14 awg wire as leads..it was bright still because of the size of the hotspot (bout half the size of my 980l) ..with the 2.8a driver the hotspot is brighter than my 980l, but the 980l appears have more lumens on a ceiling bounce test..as well it should given the 980l is driven harder than the x9..both are great lights but the x9 seems more trustworthy at longer run times given the regulated current of 2.8a..

 

well, i mean, before you mods with 2.8 driver, what's the current drawn by the onboard driver?

 

 

stock driver was ~1.7a..

harry25175
harry25175's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 2 months ago
Joined: 08/26/2011 - 11:43
Posts: 439
Location: Padang - West Sumatra

so, are you actually recommending to change the driver? or should i just stick with the current driver?

pounder
pounder's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/20/2011 - 16:43
Posts: 1788
Location: Ontario

harry25175 wrote:

so, are you actually recommending to change the driver? or should i just stick with the current driver?

 

not recommending anything..just stating the facts..2800mah is much brighter than the stock driver, but if you like the stock set-up then stick with it..for me it was a no brainer to swap the driver, but to someone else they might be completely satisfied stock..

weiser
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/18/2011 - 15:25
Posts: 1811
Location: Montana, USA

pounder,

 

How much brighter is it visibly out 100 yards, for example? 

pounder
pounder's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/20/2011 - 16:43
Posts: 1788
Location: Ontario

weiser701 wrote:

pounder,

 

How much brighter is it visibly out 100 yards, for example? 

 

well you know as much as me that brightness gets hard to judge when you get this bright and 4 times the lumens to our eyes appears twice as bright..well the best way I can see the difference was with my 980l..before the beam intensity was about on par with the 980l..the 980l had a bigger hotspot so accounted for the increase in brightness..now the spot intensity is brighter than the 980l..I would guess it 1.5x the lumens..so if the x9 was 600 or so lumens i'd guess it's close to 900 now..hard to explain the brightness increase in words..it's brighter no doubt..the x9 was almost identical to my xp-g running at 1.7a..so take a hard driven xp-g vs a properly driven xm-l and you have your difference..

weiser
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/18/2011 - 15:25
Posts: 1811
Location: Montana, USA

pounder wrote:

weiser701 wrote:

pounder,

 

How much brighter is it visibly out 100 yards, for example? 

 

well you know as much as me that brightness gets hard to judge when you get this bright and 4 times the lumens to our eyes appears twice as bright..well the best way I can see the difference was with my 980l..before the beam intensity was about on par with the 980l..the 980l had a bigger hotspot so accounted for the increase in brightness..now the spot intensity is brighter than the 980l..I would guess it 1.5x the lumens..so if the x9 was 600 or so lumens i'd guess it's close to 900 now..hard to explain the brightness increase in words..it's brighter no doubt..the x9 was almost identical to my xp-g running at 1.7a..so take a hard driven xp-g vs a properly driven xm-l and you have your difference..

 

Thanks! I was just curious what you thought of it in comparison, kind of like you explained. I don't expect you to judge lumens and such. I just meant if you were comparing it to the ~1.7A driver how much of a difference you see at 100+ yards. A lot of people are just concerned with intensity, but I'm seriously curious about throw because that's what mine (now my dad's) is used for. I'm wondering if it's really worth the hassle for a guy who isn't too familiar with flashlight modding.

pounder
pounder's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/20/2011 - 16:43
Posts: 1788
Location: Ontario

weiser701 wrote:

pounder wrote:

weiser701 wrote:

pounder,

 

How much brighter is it visibly out 100 yards, for example? 

 

well you know as much as me that brightness gets hard to judge when you get this bright and 4 times the lumens to our eyes appears twice as bright..well the best way I can see the difference was with my 980l..before the beam intensity was about on par with the 980l..the 980l had a bigger hotspot so accounted for the increase in brightness..now the spot intensity is brighter than the 980l..I would guess it 1.5x the lumens..so if the x9 was 600 or so lumens i'd guess it's close to 900 now..hard to explain the brightness increase in words..it's brighter no doubt..the x9 was almost identical to my xp-g running at 1.7a..so take a hard driven xp-g vs a properly driven xm-l and you have your difference..

 

Thanks! I was just curious what you thought of it in comparison, kind of like you explained. I don't expect you to judge lumens and such. I just meant if you were comparing it to the ~1.7A driver how much of a difference you see at 100+ yards. A lot of people are just concerned with intensity, but I'm seriously curious about throw because that's what mine (now my dad's) is used for. I'm wondering if it's really worth the hassle for a guy who isn't too familiar with flashlight modding.

well throw will be amplified because of the added brightness..with the new driver you will put more light on target at 100 yards 1.5x times as much..it's really not that hard to mod but if you're worried about it then start small on cheaper lights and get comfortable..grab a 12$ xm-l pill from manafont and put a kd driver in it..good place to start (that's where I did) I ordered the hi-low-strobe version of the manafont xml drop-in and hated the driver so I did the swap..just have a decent 25ish watt soldering iron, desoldering braid and some good flux thin solder..

agedbriar
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2011 - 18:11
Posts: 642
Location: Slovenia, EU

Anyone contemplating a controller swap based on the low stock current readings alone, should consider the fact that due to the internal resistance of the DMM itself, the current metered with the original direct drive controller in place is lower (perhaps substantially so - depending on DMM and leads) than the current that flows in normal use (with no ammeter obstructing it).

On the other hand, the current measured with a regulated driver installed, is the same as in normal use. The DMM inclusion has no ill effect here, since the current is regulated. Thus, the actual current gain from the swap will be less than usually expected.

That being said, I have a NANJG 2.8A ready for possible swap. Wink But I'll try better unprotected batteries first.

pounder
pounder's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/20/2011 - 16:43
Posts: 1788
Location: Ontario
Reason I use 14 awg wire as leads..my 980l pulls up to 4.6a on my trustfire flames..no problems with innacurate readings here Wink
agedbriar
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2011 - 18:11
Posts: 642
Location: Slovenia, EU

pounder wrote:
Reason I use 14 awg wire as leads..my 980l pulls up to 4.6a on my trustfire flames..no problems with innacurate readings here ;)

No pounder, the ammeter internal resistance is still there and is usually bigger than the leads', unless the latter are real crap.

I use the same 2.5mm2 (AWG 13-14) 0.5m leads yet from one DMM I get 2.05A, from another 1.44A, while the computed true unobstructed current amounts to about 2.2A.

The two meters connected in series yield the same reading, so it's not a matter of different accuracy.

pounder
pounder's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 01/20/2011 - 16:43
Posts: 1788
Location: Ontario
Man I hope not..lol if my 980l is pulling more than 4.6a than I'm in real trouble! From what I've seen my dmm is pretty accurate but I do see what you're saying..
agedbriar
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2011 - 18:11
Posts: 642
Location: Slovenia, EU

Yes that could be well over 5A in normal use. Smile

EDIT: ... unless the battery tops out before that.

agedbriar
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2011 - 18:11
Posts: 642
Location: Slovenia, EU

Just to put this straight.

It's not a meter accuracy problem at all. The DMM is measuring the current accurately enough. Only it chokes the current down when connected to the flashlight. The reading is right, but the current at the time of measurement is not the normal one.

This is a special case. In most other instances you do not need to think about the influence of the meter itself on the current being measured, as it's usually negligible.

spottie
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 06/21/2011 - 21:25
Posts: 196
Location: Australia

my stock x9 pulls 2.4 a on fresh SF batts

gen1.3_
gen1.3_'s picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 7 months ago
Joined: 05/25/2011 - 09:16
Posts: 763
Location: Commifornia

spottie wrote:

my stock x9 pulls 2.4 a on fresh SF batts

Looks like you got yourself a good one! Mine only draws ~ 1.3A with my best cells (Xtar 18700).

weiser
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/18/2011 - 15:25
Posts: 1811
Location: Montana, USA

DMM leads sure do make a difference, so make sure to keep that in mind. The cheap HF leads measured less than 1.0A while the Equus is measuring around the common draw of ~1.8A.

Ian2381
Ian2381's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 4 months ago
Joined: 06/11/2011 - 00:50
Posts: 643
Location: Philippines

I think the ebay X9 can use 2x CR123 as the reason it only pulls 1.7A on 1x18650. like my Solarforce skyline 1 which is really brighter using 2xCR123 as compared to 1x18650. Can anyone confirm this without getting any problem? I contacted the ebay seller and they confirmed this can use CR123(not 16340).

mitro
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 2 weeks ago
Joined: 01/25/2011 - 11:58
Posts: 707
Location: Montgomery, IL USA

Easy DMM calibration:

Build yourself a light with an 8x7135 driver

Insert fresh, fully charged battery

Measure current. If it is not 2.8A then your DMM is off.

 

My x9 was pulling 2.4A (before it popped) and it was from ebay. Now it's 2.8 A and neutral. Smile

harry25175
harry25175's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 2 months ago
Joined: 08/26/2011 - 11:43
Posts: 439
Location: Padang - West Sumatra

spottie wrote:

my stock x9 pulls 2.4 a on fresh SF batts

 

this is the problem of china made flashlight. the inconsistency of quality 

spottie
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 06/21/2011 - 21:25
Posts: 196
Location: Australia

I dont know wether its inconsistant quality or just user differences with MM and tailcap readins , mine reads 2.4 with my MM using heavy leads and my SF MPP1 pulls 0.78a on same fresh SF batt and leads ...theres just to much room for differences ie batt types MM's leads ect seems everyone will always get differing readings unless we all sync'd with same batt's MM's ect ..lol..that aint happenen ...either way it throws a ton'a light and im real happy with it ...  it was an ebay purchase not MF ..I wont hesitate on purchase due to tailcap readins of others or you'l never buy because theres always differences

agedbriar
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2011 - 18:11
Posts: 642
Location: Slovenia, EU

spottie wrote:

I dont know wether its inconsistant quality or just user differences with MM and tailcap readins , mine reads 2.4 with my MM using heavy leads and my SF MPP1 pulls 0.78a on same fresh SF batt and leads ...theres just to much room for differences ie batt types MM's leads ect seems everyone will always get differing readings unless we all sync'd with same batt's MM's ect ..lol..that aint happenen ...either way it throws a ton'a light and im real happy with it ...  it was an ebay purchase not MF ..I wont hesitate on purchase due to tailcap readins of others or you'l never buy because theres always differences

I think we are dealing with all of the above.

Current draws vary between samples of the same model even with regulating drivers, more so with direct drives. Internal resistance between multimeters varies a lot and even the thickest leads cannot entirely obviate the current reduction that the inclusion of the meter is imposing.

So yes, the comparison between readings carried out by different people on DD flashlights is unreliable.

The lottery continues. Wink

edc
edc's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 1 day ago
Joined: 01/16/2011 - 02:28
Posts: 3300
Location: NSW AUSTRALIA

Ian2381 wrote:

I think the ebay X9 can use 2x CR123 as the reason it only pulls 1.7A on 1x18650. like my Solarforce skyline 1 which is really brighter using 2xCR123 as compared to 1x18650. Can anyone confirm this without getting any problem? I contacted the ebay seller and they confirmed this can use CR123(not 16340).

Have you tried it. I am tempted but don't want to blow it up

 

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums

edc
edc's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 1 day ago
Joined: 01/16/2011 - 02:28
Posts: 3300
Location: NSW AUSTRALIA

I get 2.2a with short leads on an xtar18700. Only 1.8a on normal leads

 

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums

Ian2381
Ian2381's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 4 months ago
Joined: 06/11/2011 - 00:50
Posts: 643
Location: Philippines

edc wrote:

Ian2381 wrote:

I think the ebay X9 can use 2x CR123 as the reason it only pulls 1.7A on 1x18650. like my Solarforce skyline 1 which is really brighter using 2xCR123 as compared to 1x18650. Can anyone confirm this without getting any problem? I contacted the ebay seller and they confirmed this can use CR123(not 16340).

Have you tried it. I am tempted but don't want to blow it up

I can't, I dont have new CR123 batteries, all are already used and at half its voltage.

Langcjl
Langcjl's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 6 months ago
Joined: 03/05/2011 - 05:36
Posts: 2162
Location: Wisconsin USA
spottie wrote:

I dont know wether its inconsistant quality or just user differences with MM and tailcap readins , mine reads 2.4 with my MM using heavy leads and my SF MPP1 pulls 0.78a on same fresh SF batt and leads ...theres just to much room for differences ie batt types MM's leads ect seems everyone will always get differing readings unless we all sync'd with same batt's MM's ect ..lol..that aint happenen ...either way it throws a ton'a light and im real happy with it ...  it was an ebay purchase not MF ..I wont hesitate on purchase due to tailcap readins of others or you'l never buy because theres always differences

+1 Wiith my old HF DMM I got low readings. With my new, better, DMM I get 2.6 on my eBay x9.

Piers said " ....but who wants enough light, when you have the option for far too much "

spottie
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 06/21/2011 - 21:25
Posts: 196
Location: Australia

yeah go's to show its wise to use tailcap readings as a rough guide only  , my x9 's a great light to say the least , took it out bush last night for a shootout along with the Solarfoce MMP 1 head on L2T body ,both loaded with fresh SF protected cells ....both lights a good throwers the MMP1 nice tight clean beam plenty'a throw for my use hunting , the x9 fantastic to just light'em up throws as far as the MP plenty'a usefull spill but no so much as to greatly hinder ya night vision . both lights are very well made and look to be water thight


just took these readings now using
4.21 v solarforce protected Battery
my MultiMetre thick leads 
x9
2.2a

same battery

MPP1
0.72a

on my sons MM thin leads

x9
1.17a

______

MPP1
0.50a 

agedbriar
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2011 - 18:11
Posts: 642
Location: Slovenia, EU

Ian2381 wrote:

edc wrote:

Ian2381 wrote:

I think the ebay X9 can use 2x CR123 as the reason it only pulls 1.7A on 1x18650. like my Solarforce skyline 1 which is really brighter using 2xCR123 as compared to 1x18650. Can anyone confirm this without getting any problem? I contacted the ebay seller and they confirmed this can use CR123(not 16340).

Have you tried it. I am tempted but don't want to blow it up

I can't, I dont have new CR123 batteries, all are already used and at half its voltage.

I can lend you a brand new pair! Laughing

Ian2381
Ian2381's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 4 months ago
Joined: 06/11/2011 - 00:50
Posts: 643
Location: Philippines

Just now sold my Spare X9 and my other X9 will be modded with 2.8A 4.2v driver. Still I will be using the stock X9 driver in my P60 dropin. hehe

weiser
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 week ago
Joined: 07/18/2011 - 15:25
Posts: 1811
Location: Montana, USA

I was naive and tried 2xCR123 before I ever tried 18650 because I didn't have any around at the time. They were at 3V and it ran without any poof. I only had it on for maybe 15 seconds. 

gen1.3_
gen1.3_'s picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 7 months ago
Joined: 05/25/2011 - 09:16
Posts: 763
Location: Commifornia

Langcjl wrote:
spottie wrote:

I dont know wether its inconsistant quality or just user differences with MM and tailcap readins , mine reads 2.4 with my MM using heavy leads and my SF MPP1 pulls 0.78a on same fresh SF batt and leads ...theres just to much room for differences ie batt types MM's leads ect seems everyone will always get differing readings unless we all sync'd with same batt's MM's ect ..lol..that aint happenen ...either way it throws a ton'a light and im real happy with it ...  it was an ebay purchase not MF ..I wont hesitate on purchase due to tailcap readins of others or you'l never buy because theres always differences

+1 Wiith my old HF DMM I got low readings. With my new, better, DMM I get 2.6 on my eBay x9.

 

Did the brightness seem like it was 2.6A when you were getting low readings? I ask , because i get 1.6A with my HF DMM and the output is not very bright . I don't want to buy an expensive DMM and have high readings and the output not show it.

Pages