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Tom E
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I hit over 700 kcd when playing with focusing of the dedomed XPL, but I know vinh can do focusing better than I can. I had it out on the 4th - it's impressive.

The Miller
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still those short threads?
and I would not ant t with those brass nipples instead of a ring
still a pass… (and I love lights like this, Tom lets do a Q10 Big Smile making the wrongs in the Boss right LOL)

alex1234
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Wow thats amazing. I just inquired about an 89.80mm UCLp lens so that should help a little.

Tom E wrote:

I hit over 700 kcd when playing with focusing of the dedomed XPL, but I know vinh can do focusing better than I can. I had it out on the 4th – it’s impressive.

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Ok, i received this true beast thrower and tried a easy emitter swop with XhpV5 and XhpHi with aluminium pcb with custom machined aluminium spacer but the current is too high on high mode resulting in blue light. On the med and low mod the XplHi beam is slighly narrower but its also dimmer than the stock xml2.

With the XplHi emmitters , the high current requires massive heatsinking like a machine out 75mm copper plate for or some resistor mod to lower the current on high to be workable. The narrower beam profile on the 90mm reflector is crossed and not very nice like the stock xml2. i think the only way to easy mod this light is with a dedomed high bin xml2 u4 with copper pcb which im getting soon.

I have a mini lathe and did considered machining copper plate for this light but the cost of machining the copper plate is substantial and might not be worth the work after seeing the poor beam profile with the XplHi on med and low mode.

A better but more complicated mod idea is with the XHP35Hi which requires 2s2p battery mod.

A even better , completely doable but pricier mod idea is with 4x xhp35 with 4 40mm reflector on 4 KD single cell 1amp xhp35 driver linked individually to the 4 isolated tab of the driver for each battery. This is completely doable due to the large 90mm internal head space and would result in a 6000lumens 4amp 4xhp35Hi monster thrower that makes nitecore Tm16gt a baby.

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Tom E
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Uhhh - you really don't want to fool around with aluminum non-DTP MCPCB's - you will get the blues every time, if not burning out the LED completely. Is that what you are using? Copper DTP MCPCB's is the only option, I do mean only... Noctigon, SinkPAD, TPAD, etc...

You don't need crazy heat sinking if you do the MCPCB right -- DTP & copper.

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Mmm fellows, you may want to check this out:

Related thread: 4x quad XP footprint copper DTP stars my dears! Smile

Nice behemoth, LoL! 

Hope this is of help. Smile

 

Cheers Party

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Tom E
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Uhh, 4X quads are totally useless for a SMO thrower. ???

That's some crazy boards this seller has... Optics is an issue, potential big issue...

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Oooo, Dtp-direct thermal path . im still stuck in the aluminium pcb era and this new copper dtp pcb is new to me.Thanks for the update. Thumbs Up

Btw, I find removing the handle from the boss1 makes it a very cute monster. Very wholesome feel and full of flasholic satisfaction to hold this hefty beast in one hand without its handle sticking out. Its rare to come across such an affordable yet very high quality light with massive reflector throw and unlimited 4× 26650power. Thumbs Up

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We put in our boss
XHP 35 hi and LD M2 with 2,5A
Batteries seriall.

Nice Thrower over 500 KLUX and ca 1900 Lumen

Regards Xandre

Fatlight
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Grats! This combo is by far at the cutting edge of led throw potential. Thumbs Up

Another simple mod idea would be a 20mm 60w cxa2530 directdriven on 10xcr123a in 37v series but it would be a unsexy flooder. Well a future combined die cree xhp90 ‘Hi’ release would open up lotsa interesting possibility for boss1 potential 80wh battery power. Crazy

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Tom E
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Hhmm - 500 kcd is a little disappointing for the BOSS1, considering it's reflector size. Interesting....

Fatlight
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Does anyone knows the current on the stock led? how hard is it driving it? i cant seems to get a proper current reading on a sst50 and my stock led is dead. i guess it is at 4-5amp range but i have no way to tell yet.

The xml2 is not such a bad choice for this light after all since it can take crazy high current without turning blue like the xpls on aluminium pcb. The highest efficiency xml2 u4 bin could possibly give it a 1600++ lumens max range when driven at 5-6amp, at 360lumen/700ma. The xml2 dedomed looks exactly like a xpl underneath it , given the large 90mm reflector and perfect beam profile with it, the only easy mod necessary would be a good tint u4 top bin xml2 on copper dtp pcb which is freshly avail on kd now. Well ,2 dead led before i get to know this…….

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Tom E
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Well, you got some things opposite from what I know and understand. XM-L2 U4's cant take as high amps as a XPL - definitely. I smoked a dedomed XM-L2 U4 in my BOSS1, while a dedomed XPL V6 is doing fine. It's also been tested/proved here on BLF the XPL's can take more current. But again (big but), you absolutely must use DTP copper always when doing any DD'ing (Direct Drive, either straight wired or via a FET based driver). Did I mention ALWAYS? Yes - I mean no choice, must always.

I measured 6.08A across the switch using a dedomed XPL - 696 kcd. Then measured 1,740 lumens @30 secs even with cells at 4.14V.

I suspect amps are actually higher because I used a regular DMM - a clamp meter normally reads higher and more accurately.

My setup was direct wired with no driver, using 4 great cells: EFEST dark purple 26650 4200's.

Also fyi... I believe XPL V6's are equal to XM-L2 U3's, and XPL W2's equal XM-L2 U4's (seems to make sense to CREE specs), but XPL's can take more amps.

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Well i dont have a conclusive test done and its just based on some fasttech V5 xpl vs stock xml2 aluminium pcb . The xml2 doesnt turn blue but xpl turns blue fast on the boss1 .That few v5 xpl wasnt nearly as bright as xml2 too so im disappointed . With copper dtp pcb thing could be different but there are also other vf and bin issues that affects . However i feel they are rather similar dies , my choice would be xml2 because they are more common from my sources. Naturally i would prefer whatever is better and brighter , smaller and cheaper when available. Xpl w2 ….cant wait for that to appear …. Cool

Thank for the update, now i just need to fix back boss1 to functional state again Thumbs Up

Again , this xml2 u4 are already so bright and cheap ,it makes it possible to replace xhp50s lights which are barely reaching 2000 lumens in shadow jm35 light with added throw. but i have enough throwers already and could do with flooders. Well it just the modding bug acting up again. Tired

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Well, presuming an XP-L is made from an XM-L2 die fitted on a smaller 3535 package, all other things being equal, I would conclude the XM-L2 should be more abuse tolerant with better thermal dissipation due to higher thermal conduction area. Of course, if this is not always the case, other variables should be considered. 

 

Cheers Party

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Tom E
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MrsDNF said here: http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/869423#comment-869423

From memory 5.5 amps was maximum before they went pop. What the maximum current is on your U4 I dont know. I do know that the XPL are far better for running at high currents than the XML-2.

There's a few more of these quotes from very experiemced members - no point to continue. It's said, its proven, over and over again. No theory, just proven experiences, myself included. You don't have to believe us, but... The old XM-L2's, like T6's and U2's could take a lot more amps. The newer generation ones, higher bins, had a higher Vf and popped at lower amps. The XPL's hold up better, dunno why, no theories I know of, they just work better at high amps.

This of course is costs and availability aside. The XPL W2's are available at Cutter.au - been there a while. heard of other sources, I bought some from an Ali store but I really dunno if they are true W2's, they are good but could be V6's.

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What Tom has just said is correct on all accounts.

 

djozz quotes, "it came with chinese lettering that is chinese to me".

                      "My man mousehole needs one too"

old4570 said "I'm not an expert , so don't suffer from any such technical restrictions".

Old-Lumens. Highly admired and cherished member of Budget Light Forum. 11.5.2011 - 20.12.16. RIP.

 

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Well i was only testing with the old xml stock with the new xpl from fasttech, i haven tested the u4 yet. I completely believe and respect whatever actual testing results was done by modders on Blf and other forums , some of which is at the cutting of of led research and can uncover things even the makers themselves doesnt know. Going at this rate, the days of xml2 are numbered like the xre.

This can be abit baffling for me sometimes since i also wonder why xml dedomed has such a big drop in lumens output but newer xpl hi which can still pump some much light being naked dome. It might be something due to light conversion efficiency on the newer nano phosphor substrate, the old ways of trying to trick out more light with metal rings and silicon dome seems crude in hindsight. Cree seems to prefer starting a complete redesign of led with the latest production techniques for their latest product. The trend for led seems to be higher efficiency first in tiny dies, combination of dies for higher output before eventual moving out to bigger single die production. I can see no one has yet to produce a 3 dimensional raised dome die with a half circle full substrate dome which will give reflectors the best parabolic angle light surface to reflect light upwards……i shall name such design, the XPL3D in advance. Thumbs Up

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Tom E
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XPL HI's pay the price for their factory dedome - highest available bin is V2 while the XPL HD is available at V6. There are many eBay and AliExpress listings showing XPL HI V5 or V6 but that's false - ask for proof of the factory CREE label and you will find they can't produce it - because they don't exist.

So, take an XPL V6 - factory dedome it and you lose lumens - bin is now rated at V2 (best XPL HI). Take a XML, XM-L2, or XPL - dedome it yourself - lose lumens - same rules apply - lose lumens increase throw.

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From how i look at it , the silicon dome helps to relieve more light out of the phosphor substrate but comes at the expense of physically narrowing the beam angle due to reflecting light from the aspheric different density effect .Less light is tricked out and less light is reflected on the reflectors from the narrower beam. All these can be solved by a 3D die design which silicon domed or not would not affect the light angle to reflector interaction so necessary for a long throw .

For a 2D die design , the best optical way to throw would be a large deep aspheric coated lens combined with a small domed led that many large zoomers like jax man have. However it would be a projector beam and very impractical for actual use if both throw and spill is required so i still prefer a reflector based design with spill light and a tight straight beam for distance .But most of these light have rather small reflectors so this boss1 is so exciting because it comes in a nice aluminium machined body with big power option and a huge reflector.While lights could still get larger, it would exceed the palm size and be ‘un’flashlight like. i feel Boss1 is about the biggest head as far a single palm holdable flashlight is practical before becoming a toilet plummer. More excuses to stock up more units for future projects. Evil

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Where do you get these now days?

Tom E
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Texas_Ace wrote:
Where do you get these now days?

+1 - out of stock at GearBest, etc...

 

I'll probably wait for the BLF giga thrower The Miller just started. The BOSS1 is interesting, but it's been a PITA to work with.

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Mmm, I sometimes wonder why so much fuss about reflectors… do you love spill?

How about making use of ultra-narrow (<1°) TIR lenses? A ½° TIR would illuminate a ≈11,5 feet wide area at ¼ mile distance, doesn't it? 

 

Cheers Party

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Barkuti wrote:

Mmm, I sometimes wonder why so much fuss about reflectors… do you love spill?


How about making use of ultra-narrow (<1°) TIR lenses? A ½° TIR would illuminate a ≈11,5 feet wide area at ¼ mile distance, doesn’t it? 


 


Cheers Party

I have tried to actually find lenses like these many times but I could never find a place to actually buy some. The closest thing is the one that RMM is selling but it is only 60mm, I would love a 100mm+ TIR lens if the cost was reasonable.

Which is the other issue, once you get into TIR’s that are big enough to really throw the cost gets impratical, if you can even find it in the first place.

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I wonder why sometimes im nuts about metal flashlight but cool towards big clunky plastic spotlight. i think its because, plastic clunkers are unflashlight like, unaluminium like and unmetal tough , unpretty, too big , not compact and portable enough with poor heatsinking body. Then all these high quality made aluminium flashlight all have similar thing in common and thats reflectors. IM uncool for flood since we have in the day a quadzillion lumens sun flooding light for billion of years already and it is in the night that a light saber beam stands out. So yea,metal flashlight mostly have metal reflectors that are the main key to throw. The bigger the area reflected at the right angle , more light gets thrown straight while still having surface spill for near distance visibility.

Yea this tir lenses could be improved with variable angle tir design to mimic a reflector hotspot with spill but no one made these yet close to the results of a light saber beam from a large reflector. Potentially its could be a more efficient light bending for 2d die design than reflectors. But high light transmission would require good glass and variable optics shape and that means weight and cost. So reflectors are easy to make and way cheaper in this sense. However for most people i do not know of anyway to produce good reflectors at home so it got to be bought with the light itself. So much for interest in reflectors, big reflectors especially. Thumbs Up

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The stock boss is driven at 2,4A on high. I removed everything from driver and use it as a contact board. Then put it in it’s box for later when I have a lathe. My plan is to put in 3 convoy C8 smooth reflectors with XPL-HI leds driven with a fet driver. and on the edge between the C8 reflectors there will be 3 orange peel S2+ reflectors with XPL or XM-L2 leds driven by another fet driver. I measured the diameters. Fit every six reflector nicely without overlapping. And because the new ones not as deep as the original. I can replace the thin shelf with a realy thick aluminum plate. Ther will be two electronic switch on the side of the head to operate the throw and flood mode separately. Ughh Cool

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Seems like a complicated project. Good luck on your lathe. i got mine barely a year ago and it was quite alot of learning and tuning just to fix it and running. Then there was the tooling and sourcing of the materials ….. Mastering the lathe can be a bigger challenge to overcome than the flashlight itself. Tired

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I learnt and used manual lathe when I learned CNC lathe and mill programming and using. But the flasaholism come later when I had no access to school lathes any more. So basically I can use it just need to collect the money for a good one. I almost finished designing the parts for the mod too.

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I got a budget 4“chuck full 7×14” minilathe which is the most commonly available ,ample bed length is very important after tailstock takes a chunk of space out. The better lathe i know of is the brushless ones which cost 40% more. i choose the non brush model so i can spend the 40% savings on complete toolings and quickchange post etc. With more budget, i would prefer those Seig brushless integrated mill lathe which is very useful for side milling after turning operations but will costs 3x more.

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Tom E
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Fatlight wrote:
... More excuses to stock up more units for future projects. })

Where are you buying the BOSS1 from nowadays? It's out of stock all over.

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