Cree changed production process for XP-G2 emitters!

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giorgoskok
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luminarium iaculator wrote:
I am not the only one…

I would not recommend new S4 2B to anyone… But if people want to try than why not? Smile Myself and quite a few forum members here are heavily disappointed with this emitter.

But luckily and thanks to Wkhchin81 i managed to get some of good old XP-G3 S3 2B emitters so I’ll reply soon how they performed.

I have some of them too , but I’m out of hosts and time right now Silly

luminarium iaculator
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My diy test should be not relevant to anyone but Djozz test is different story:

His post: http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/921827#comment-921827

EasyB
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LI, I wasn’t saying you were the only one who had an under performing new S4. I’m just observing that the new S4 emitter that I bought performs very close to the old S4. So if you get lucky and get one with a low Vf, it will be a good performer.

luminarium iaculator
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EasyB wrote:
LI, I wasn’t saying you were the only one who had an under performing new S4. I’m just observing that the new S4 emitter that I bought performs very close to the old S4. So if you get lucky and get one with a low Vf, it will be a good performer.

Well I guess it is possible…

Until then I made 6 pills with Djozz FET driver and XP-G2 S3 2B from wkhchin81 and thank you very much Sir for selling me some. All necessary bypasses done.

Current draw from 3.95 – 4.1 (none of them pulled more) measured on uni-t clamp meter.
Performance all around 200kcd in UF1503 host (usually in same host I have 220-240 kcd with old type G2 S4 2B), tint and size is same as old S4 2B.

That is good and I am quite happy Smile While they have only about 10 -15% performance drop they behave very nice and stable with FET driver achieving maximum performance at only 4A draw which means that battery will last longer.

So even lower current draw than old S4 2B, and 10-15% lower performance.

Thanks wkhchin81.

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luminarium iaculator wrote:
FmC wrote:
The 3rd gen Oslon’s came very close (~7%), & would be a suitable replacement, if they could be easily dedomed.

I recently came across these, which appear to be binned higher that the 3rd gen’s that we have tested.

I have bought a small quantity to test, but they pose the same dedoming problem.

Any news on Osram Oslon’s ?

Sorry, way too little spare time currently….

The only thing I know so far is that they are just as temperamental to dedome as the first lot I tried.

luminarium iaculator
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This is FMC thread about Osram Oslon…. Hope you’ll manage to make a nice stew that can take dome off Smile

I really prey for return or improvement of old type XP-G2, or improving new G2’s (yes useless pray I know since very nice XP-G3 is out which has incredible lumens per wats performance Smile …)

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Old production type report..

It was asked somewhere above if someone had checked the S3 3D from intl-outdoor for production type. The date on the reel picture being later than the date that shows currently on reel picture at the new production type S4 2B, it was not promising.

Nevertheless I ordered a few to check, and with the 3D tint being on the pink side of the black body line, dedoming could very well produce an acceptable tint.

They came in today and to my surprise they appeared old production type. I hot dedomed two (one fail: small chip of phosfor came off Sad ) and from the good one I made a Brynite B158 pill with a AK47-FET driver.

The tint is indeed agreeable, a very acceptable neutral white without any hint of green, even wood tints look ok-ish, a bit yellower compared to non-demomed 5-tinted leds (I compared with BLF-A6 with 5A XP-L) but at least way better than the (old type) dedomed S4 2B tint that on a white wall looks good but makes a yellow-greenish mess of wood tints.

I got 282 kcd throw out of the Brynite (measured at 7 meter distance, freshly charged 30Q, 30 seconds after switch to high). That is 13% less than I get with the dedomed S4 2B pill (322 kcd).

Pretty good throw, certainly old production type level, but going from S4 to S3 promises only 5% loss. Apart from possible individual led and build differences, my theory for that is that due to the larger amount of blue light already converted to longer wavelengths by the phosfor of a 3D led compared to a 2B led, dedoming can not give the same amount of photon recycling, which is mostly about blue photons reflected back into the phosfor to get another chance for conversion and adding to the light directed to the lens.

Anyway, for me the 13% less throw of the 3D is sort of balanced by the nicer tint. This is not my last build with this dedomed S3 3D led. Smile

Tom E
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I'd say good news! Thanks for the testing!! I'll have to order some as well.

luminarium iaculator
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Djozz,

Good news… You were lucky Smile

Yes same thing with mine new S3 2B emitters (10-15% loss comparing to old s4 2B). And less current draw on our Djozz fet driver (only 3.95 – 4.1, while old S4 2B from 4.3-4.5)

Tint is same as old S4 2B and my favorite tint of course no matter you say Silly Wink

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thanks ,time for order .

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Thanks Djozz… Valuable information, Appreciated.

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luminarium, you need to sell everything you’ve got and go out and buy up all these old stock emitters, before these other guys do! Silly

The Cycle of Goodness: “No one prospers without rendering benefit to others”
- The YKK Philosophy

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somewhere someone must have a forgoten rail with those old S4s Sad

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nofearek9 wrote:
somewhere someone must have a forgoten rail with those old S4s Sad

Even sadder thought: Somewhere, some major lighting manufacturer has multiple reels of those old S4’s that they will be throwing away because they are upgrading their whole product line to XP-G3.

The Cycle of Goodness: “No one prospers without rendering benefit to others”
- The YKK Philosophy

luminarium iaculator
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DavidEF wrote:
luminarium, you need to sell everything you’ve got and go out and buy up all these old stock emitters, before these other guys do! Silly

Well I think 142 pcs of XP-G2 S3 2B will be enough for some time… Big Smile

But as I said they are not S4 2B… So only in a case of resurrection I will buy another lot.

nofearek9
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can anyone identify from those crappy photos ,what version i got ?

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Aaah, every time i see this topic makes me feel quite ok that i have stacked quite a good ammount of those old S4 2B: thanks Australia ( and MRsDNF ofc)

nofearek9

Pay attention that even if they are old ones and doesnt mean they are great: i got very close results with S2 1A from the old ones and S4 1A from the new ones( Mouser breeds)

On the other hand nothing can compare with S4 2B….i got some time today and made 2 B158 for the upcoming hunting season…one came up to 343k cds/ 312 after 30secs ( running at 4.8 amps, fresh VTC6): imbalanced zoomie definately, even better than my own

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this one is s4 2b from intl-outdoor,hope its the old version.

giorgoskok
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nofearek9 wrote:
this one is s4 2b from intl-outdoor,hope its the old version.

Check from this :

http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/961658#comment-961658

Also , when you ordered them ?

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i think its the old version the order was January, 2016

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nofearek9 wrote:
i think its the old version the order was January, 2016

Probably old ones

nofearek9
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have 1 from may 2015 and looks the same to me.

djozz
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@nofearek9: Your pictures clearly shows they are old production type.

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thanks djozz for the confirmation.

luminarium iaculator
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Old production XP-G2 S3 2B really sucks if I compare it to old XP-G2 S4 2B. Like Mitko said pick is necessary to get close to performance of old G2 S4 2B. But they are way better than new production XP-G2 S4 2B!

Old XP-G2 S4 2B had incredible consistency, they were all great performers… Slap it in and candela rises! And I should not fear that I will got rotten egg among them… That never happened(unless dd went wrong way)…

I still can’t accept the fact that in 2016. I have to build lower performing lights (candela vise) than lights I did year ago only because Cree changed production process for them. End they have tendency of releasing even more crappy emitters than “new” s4 2b. That fact is eating my nerves…

If you have real racing horse would you change it to mule? I can’t curse on this forum but *-?!**? Evil Cree.

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A topic update:

Since i order regulary from various sources i `ve found THOSE recently

It seems they are 1d bin, quite a nice looking tint( for my taste) after electrical dedoming plus they perform quite okay( 160k in C8 and 300k in b158, 100k in X6) : ofc they are “ improoved” too yet those are the best improoved XPG2 chips that i`ve found so far

We dont have that great option allright, one cant trust Fasttech binning and labeling : they send whatever they have, IOS have only s4 2b and most of those s2 and s3 bins( or shall i say all of them atm) are also improoved ones

At this moment, XPL CANT take the XPG2 place : bigger hotspot and bigger halo in the reflector based throwers: and especialy the halo thing makes it not okay especialy for a scope hunting

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Those numbers look pretty good. Is that on startup or after 30 seconds?
Have you tested enough of them to tell if they are fairly consistently making those numbers or do they have a lot of variability?

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Mitko wrote:
A topic update: Since i order regulary from various sources i `ve found "THOSE":http://www.mouser.bg/ProductDetail/Cree-Inc/XPGBWT-L1-0000-00LE1/?qs=aO0... recently It seems they are 1d bin, quite a nice looking tint( for my taste) after electrical dedoming plus they perform quite okay( 160k in C8 and 300k in b158, 100k in X6) : ofc they are " improoved" too yet those are the best improoved XPG2 chips that i`ve found so far We dont have that great option allright, one cant trust Fasttech binning and labeling : they send whatever they have, IOS have only s4 2b and most of those s2 and s3 bins( or shall i say all of them atm) are also improoved ones At this moment, XPL CANT take the XPG2 place : bigger hotspot and bigger halo in the reflector based throwers: and especialy the halo thing makes it not okay especialy for a scope hunting

I looked those up and the "LE1" code is the top S4 bin for XP-G2's, at least in the latest CREE datasheet, and the tint is a group of 1A, 1B, 1C and 1D. Mouser US has them here: http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Cree-Inc/XPGBWT-L1-0000-00LE1 for $3.32 qty 1. Mouser has great prices for the XP-G3's as well, here in US: http://www.mouser.com/search - XP-G3s.

Id' be most interested in the XP-G3 groups of LE5 and ME3, with dome. The LE5 one is an S4 bin at 4000K for $2.00 qty 1, and the ME3 is the top S5 bin at 5000K for $2.05 qty 1. But both are relatively low CRI. Seems like you can get high bin neutrals, but you sacrifice CRI -- this is the way CREE is doing it now.

What is electrical dedoming? Must have missed something - never heard of it. Tried warm gas dedoming of a new XPL V6 0D last night, and the outer dome comes off in 1/2 hour, but after 10 hours in gas (no longer warm), the small dome on the dye would not budge. Ended slicing it down and scraping most of it all, not all. No damage to the dye, so I'll see how it works out when assembled in a Manker U21.

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Tom , mitko hot dedomes leds , by using an older battery to power the emitter until it is hot enough to remove dome .

Btw , I have the exact same problem with V6 0D Tom … Small dome is still there after 8 hours in gas …

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Thanks! That would have been my guess, just never heard it called that. Are XP-G3's un-dedomable? Haven't seen much mention of it. Anyone try slicing them?

This one: XPGDWT-01-0000-00M50, Mouser has for $2.07 qty 1, and is the top bin S5, 6000K -- best one I see for dedoming, or this one:

XPGDWT-01-0000-00ME2 at top bin S5, 5700K.

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