Zooming Model List (2018 Updated) Tell us about your newest zoomie!

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MascaratumB
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Agro wrote:
Why are brass pills considered premium? They can store ~10% more heat (depending on alloy) while having 3 times the weight and 30-50% lower thermal conductivity…

Not really an answer, but I don’t think they are “premium”.
But, even if they are not premium, there must be a valid reason to see almost all the flashlight manufacturers (that make flashlights with pills) to use them!
I actually would like to see direct comparisons with flashlights and their heat dissipation with alu vs brass pills.

luminarium iaculator
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IMHO They don’t have any advantage to aluminum pills except that you can solder MCPCB directly to it for ultimate heat transfer. Or do they really have? Anyone did tests?

I also prefer aluminum pills + artic silver(or any other quality cpu paste) combination better. Especially if they have aluminum MCPCB retaining ring like this OTR Z821 (I mean it should have from pics on their web site)

That kind of ring is used on a lot of uniquefire and other zoomies. Brinyte for example has poor plastic one but it serves its purpose to press hold mcpcb firmly to pill.

But I also don’t have nothing against brass except for the 3 times the weight you mentioned… I always strive to max throw performance in as smaller and lighter package possible.

MascaratumB wrote:
Agro wrote:
Why are brass pills considered premium? They can store ~10% more heat (depending on alloy) while having 3 times the weight and 30-50% lower thermal conductivity…

Not really an answer, but I don’t think they are “premium”.
But, even if they are not premium, there must be a valid reason to see almost all the flashlight manufacturers (that make flashlights with pills) to use them!
I actually would like to see direct comparisons with flashlights and their heat dissipation with alu vs brass pills.

I think that anyone with a lathe will say that it is maybe easier to work with brass (or copper as most China sellers wrongly state Big Smile ) than with aluminum which tends to bend more easily under pressure…

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Looking at the various heatsink/pill materials, I did some armchair engineering tests. I have some old C8’s with screw in aluminum pills, tested a C8 with integrated shelf, and one with a brass pill. I also tested some aluminum and copper/alumimum heatsinks. From my experience, aluminum transfers heat better than brass, and moves it away from the emitter better to the flashlight body, but has lower thermal mass, so it heats up faster, bit cools off faster. Brass is much denser than aluminum and can store more heat, but is not good at moving it away from the emitter to the atmosphere. Your light heats up slower, but cools slower. Copper is denser than brass and has even better heat transfer, more in line with aluminum, so it gives the best of both metals, high heat transfer and thermal mass/capacity. Drawbacks of aluminum is you can’t solder to it like brass or copper, and you need a bigger host or more surface area to move heat around. Bottom line, if you can get copper pills, by all means do. If you can get brass over aluminum, that’s fine too. If all you have is aluminum, then that’s okay for lower power setups or smaller hosts.

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I agree with you mostly there. copper is great but has some consequences. Those titanium/copper pill combos seemed about the worse setup I've had experience with. The heat just bottles up in the copper and takes long to cool down. Had a D4 (v1) like that - it's awful, burning hot almost instantly. Copper pills are ok as long as surrounded by alum, or you don't have to touch them. Something is needed to draw out the heat from the copper because it draws in the heat so efficiently.

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True. Size matters too. You need a pretty stout host to take away dozens of watts of energy. A small flashlight wlike the D4 or FW3 or FW4 will heat up fast. Very short turbo and aggressive stepdown. A good example is my fet driven xhp70.2 project. Even with the computer heatsink rated for 100 watt cpu, the xhp70.2 on turbo heats it up to 140 F in about 4 minutes.

If I had to choose an ideal flashlight heatsinking material, I’d take the lead from the computer cooler industry and say copper/aluminum is very good, the best of both metals properties. Copper to soak up the heat and its thermal mass, and aluminum to move it away to the atmosphere (or your hand). Downside is copper is expensive! More expensive than brass, bronze, or aluminum.

luminarium iaculator
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Sirstinky wrote:
If you can get brass over aluminum, that’s fine too. If all you have is aluminum, then that’s okay for lower power setups or smaller hosts.
Thumbs Up

My vote goes to aluminum pill with retaining ring for MCPCB & Driver. That is pure perfection IMHO, and modding is the most friendly even for total beginner same as for pro(no soldering, easy repairable). Only problem is that just quite few flashlights have this kind of pill…

d_t_a
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Agro wrote:
I’m looking for a zoomie host advice. I want a new camping light with warm LED and Andruil.

What I need is:

  • 21700 or 18650 or 26650 (in this order)
  • perfectly smooth flood with sharp cutoff
  • overall at least fair quality
  • e-switch
  • smooth push-pull
  • fairly modable so I can have Andruil in it
  • at most 170×55 mm
  • not very expensive, I’m not buying a Led Lenser even if it’s a perfect option

Within the limits above I want something somewhat compact for the cell it accepts and the lens diameter it has. I know I can’t expect too much as most zoomies are awfully huge and junk quality.

What looks promising is Lumintop Zoom1. It is said to have a flood beam that matches my needs. Quality is way above my minimum. Compactness is good. It doesn’t focus well but that’s OK and may actually open some interesting possibilities like quad die emitter.
But I don’t know if it’s reasonably possible to turn it to Andruil.

Maybe someone can share some insight on it?

The other light that comes to my mind is Wowtac A3S. Vinh mods it with his drivers so I assume it’s doable. Considering that it has a smaller cell, smaller lens and aspheric instead of TIR it’s quite a bit larger than Zoom1 but definitely not bad. Quality is said to be top notch.
I’ve read that it has very thick o-rings which make zooming very stiff. It’s a deal breaker unless I can fix it. But I assume replacing them with something looser is an option…

Any thought?
Any other choices?

Zoom1 fits 21700 battery or 18650 batteries.
It uses a side-switch operation.
Uses Push-Pull for zooming (instead of rotating which is a bit common in some other zoomies)

Unfortunately, I’m not a modder so I don’t know if it can be converted to Anduril driver..

Beamshot demo of Lumintop Zoom1 from wide to focused

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Not perfect, there’s still a donut in the intermediate beam but good enough. Thanks for the vid. Smile

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MascaratumB

Did your OTR ever come in? Mine’s still in transit but I did find this, which worries me a bit:

http://kaidomain.com/Flashlight-DIY-and-Tools/diy-flashlight-shell-or-flashlight-host/DIY-Zoomable-LED-Flashlight-Host-116mm-x-32mm-Black

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luminarium iaculator wrote:
My vote goes to aluminum pill with retaining ring for MCPCB & Driver. That is pure perfection IMHO, and modding is the most friendly even for total beginner same as for pro(no soldering, easy repairable). Only problem is that just quite few flashlights have this kind of pill…

My understanding is some of the more advanced modders occasionally solder things to the pill, in which case I think brass is preferred to aluminum.
MascaratumB
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contactcr wrote:
MascaratumB

Did your OTR ever come in? Mine’s still in transit but I did find this, which worries me a bit:

http://kaidomain.com/Flashlight-DIY-and-Tools/diy-flashlight-shell-or-flashlight-host/DIY-Zoomable-LED-Flashlight-Host-116mm-x-32mm-Black

My light is already in Portugal, but it wasn’t posted to me yet! Things are taking too long in customs or “international reception” departments Facepalm

I am not sure why you are worried about that light! It is not the same as the one produced and sold by OTR.
Look at the host size and you’ll see that the one from KD is longer.

I hope mine arrives in the next week(s) Facepalm

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What’s the largest zoomie you can get nowadays for $20-30? I was looking at the UF1504 but I haven’t seen one available for under $40ish (host from mtn is a $$ pain to ship to Canada).

I’m mainly looking for a host to try seeing if I can project a Batman logo at a long distance.

I saw this thing with a head diameter of 54mm, probably a lens diameter of 45mm or so for $16 shipped to Canada. Any better options?
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000276730652.html

I’d be willing to buy an old zoomie from someone here if the price is alright but I understand the shipping to Canada usually makes it impractical.

luminarium iaculator
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Scallywag wrote:
luminarium iaculator wrote:
My vote goes to aluminum pill with retaining ring for MCPCB & Driver. That is pure perfection IMHO, and modding is the most friendly even for total beginner same as for pro(no soldering, easy repairable). Only problem is that just quite few flashlights have this kind of pill…
My understanding is some of the more advanced modders occasionally solder things to the pill, in which case I think brass is preferred to aluminum.

I don’t think even advanced modders like to do this because difference is negligible. It should be tested… But what can be easier than above mentioned setup? You have retaining ring for driver, retaining ring for MCPCB, aluminum pill is 5x lighter than brass pill…

This is truly modders heaven (when we talk about single emitter, 17mm drivers/MCPCB lights). Done in 5 minutes Thumbs Up

luminarium iaculator
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Convoy has zoomie light!

It is called Convoy Z1 zoomable flashlight

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Looks really nice, 21700 sisze and good blacking out inside the head.
Could probably get 250kcd with an LED swap, or 500+ with a collar…

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I’m waiting for someone with a Jaxman Z1 to compare the lens and pill. It seems like a good value though. Especially when you can get 375-400kcd with white flat 1mm2 Jaxman Z1 (no collar)

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contactcr wrote:
I’m waiting for someone with a Jaxman Z1 to compare the lens and pill. It seems like a good value though. Especially when you can get 375-400kcd with white flat 1mm2 Jaxman Z1 (no collar)

If you want to send me the Convoy Z1, well… Wink
I’m joking, though I do have a spare CULNM1 to match my Jaxman Z1. I just Corona seem to find the funds for new lights right now…

FWIW though, the Jaxman measures 53mm at the head, and Simon claims a 52mm diameter on the Convoy. Not going to be much difference here. My Jaxman gets me 5500mAh with the 26650, and the Convoy should be good for 5000 with a 21700. shrug
Hopefully the lens is nice, and it will be a cheaper way to get that kind of quality in a zoomie for people.

Enderman wrote:
Looks really nice, 21700 sisze and good blacking out inside the head.
Could probably get 250kcd with an LED swap, or 500+ with a collar…

Yeah, like Enderman said, White Flat should get you 350kcd+ without a collar. Although with the 6A driver stock, 2mm^2 may be the simpler swap. And Simon actually carries 3030 gaskets, would just need some Sharpie…
luminarium iaculator
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Simon follows, and Simon listens… I am sure he will make 4,5-5A driver with White flat 1mm (CSLNM1.TG)…

Flashlight looks nice, old school style but there is always but… I would really want/need freaking 25.4mm(1”) 1×18650 tube version of this light… Facepalm

Freaking hell 26650 and 21700 bats… I just wish they disappear…

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luminarium iaculator wrote:
Simon follows, and Simon listens… I am sure he will make 4,5-5A driver with White flat 1mm (CSLNM1.TG)…

Flashlight looks nice, old school style but there is always but… I would really want/need freaking 25.4mm(1”) 1×18650 tube version of this light… Facepalm

Freaking hell 26650 and 21700 bats… I just wish they disappear…

For a light with a head this large, I don’t mind the larger battery size. I don’t find anything using 21700/26650 to be comfortably “pocketable” though.

I don’t object to either battery form factor on any sort of principle, and I definitely see the value in 21700 since the EV market seems to be focusing some innovation on that battery size. The discharge rates on 40T and 30T are pretty impressive!

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Scallywag wrote:
I don't find anything using 21700/26650 to be comfortably "pocketable" though

Amutorch E3 - 21700, triple LED TIR optic, 95 mm long, 25.4 mm batt tube width. Head is a bit wide - worse spot at 29 mm, but it's not a standard round shape. It's about as compact you can get for a 21700. Quadrupel layed out a FET+1 driver for it - I uploaded it in OSHPark here: https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/4p0UsWYK. I got 3 of these boards ordered, wait'n.

On BG here. Neals' site here.

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Tom E wrote:

Scallywag wrote:
I don’t find anything using 21700/26650 to be comfortably “pocketable” though

Amutorch E3 – 21700, triple LED TIR optic, 95 mm long, 25.4 mm batt tube width. Head is a bit wide – worse spot at 29 mm, but it’s not a standard round shape. It’s about as compact you can get for a 21700. Quadrupel layed out a FET+1 driver for it – I uploaded it in OSHPark here: https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/4p0UsWYK. I got 3 of these boards ordered, wait’n.


On BG here. Neals’ site here.


If I ever have disposable income again, I really need to try a couple of Amutorch’s lights. In my eyes, they’ve really been trying to innovate, even if (last I checked anyway) they wouldn’t know a good UI if it bit them on the nose.
luminarium iaculator
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Scallywag wrote:
luminarium iaculator wrote:
Simon follows, and Simon listens… I am sure he will make 4,5-5A driver with White flat 1mm (CSLNM1.TG)…

Flashlight looks nice, old school style but there is always but… I would really want/need freaking 25.4mm(1”) 1×18650 tube version of this light… Facepalm

Freaking hell 26650 and 21700 bats… I just wish they disappear…

For a light with a head this large, I don’t mind the larger battery size. I don’t find anything using 21700/26650 to be comfortably “pocketable” though.

I don’t object to either battery form factor on any sort of principle, and I definitely see the value in 21700 since the EV market seems to be focusing some innovation on that battery size. The discharge rates on 40T and 30T are pretty impressive!

Larger form bat factor gives more juice… But why we should go in that direction?Larger bats and flashlights? We should strive to as smaller form/performance factor possible.
There will come day when we will have low current draw emitters(diodes) which will give give max performance at lets say 1A current draw with surface brightness cd/mm2 over 500…

That is already happening in 850 IR spectrum with technology called VCSEL laser (on Samsung INR 30 Q and linear 7135 driver I have around 3 hours of runtime with 1A draw, and more than 1 kilometer of IR throw with 20mm lens zoomie over night vision equipment).

And of course when that technology appears it will happen what I predicted years ago. Zoomie form lights will become no. 1 light. Cause we will have extreme thrower/flooder in right pocket of our T-shirt.

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Agro wrote:
Yet another 18650 zoomie with USB and side switch: !https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/H8c73b2a748f740e097fc61813c1027ebB.jpg! https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001094842422.html This one has a powerbank: !https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/H250e97512e4c4e1a92e464cd8c04af52d.jpg! https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000387164348.html I found another source for SK58-clone with 18650. This time without USB...but they offer it for sale only in bulk. Nevertheless I asked whether they'd sell me one. !https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1rAPFGVXXXXcQXVXXq6xXFXXXK/201039559/HTB1r...! https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32252349528.html I really like this compact 18650 light. It even accepts 3xAAA so it should take 20650 stock and seeing how thick it is it may accept even larger cells. !https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1rl1bUMHqK1RjSZFkq6x.WFXal/IPX66-strong-li...! https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33015159572.html I don't like this light but the styling is unusual so I thought I would show it as well: !https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB135RAcgb.PuJjSZFpq6zuFpXae.jpg! https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32831303636.html 

Agro original post here: http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1664810#comment-1664810

 

 

Ok, there's a lot goin in this post, but, I ordered the first listed "Pocketman" zoomie for under $8 at the time and it finally arrived today! Only took ~7 weeks, but for under $8. Overall look is ok. As expected, classic cheapy/cheezy 5 modes, nice blue tint, but it puts out a lot of light. Finish and optics is decent, but the tailcap - major issues. The threading doesn't match up well - the tailcap is bigger, gotta play with it to get a good lock down, but it's do-able. Bought it more for mod potential so the driver and LED would go. Fully zoomed out I get a nive cross pattern for the cheap/clone XHP50, so I think the focus is ok, and it's got a pretty wide flood mode which is good.

Price went up from $7.nn to $10.nn. I find that happens  a lot after I order one. I think it's something that's a common practice - first few order are dirt cheap, and if it sells, then bump up the profit.

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Agro wrote:
I’ve got my Skywolfeye B18 (the 14500 version). I expected it to be just as good as B16 (10440) but it’s not.
1. The zooming action is not as smooth, rocking makes it get stuck sometimes. Not surprisingly zoom travel is larger and requires more force.
2. Flood is quite narrow, too narrow for my liking
3. B16 has a very clean throw beam. TBH I don’t understand why is it so, it shouldn’t be so good. B18 is very very ringy. A part of the difference is the plastic holder. With B18 it stays deeper, so LED illuminates it from the sides. B16 has the top of the LED dome just barely over the edge of the holder, so its white surface receives no direct illumination. B18 clearly shows the surface of the area that surrounds the LED. B16 doesn’t and I don’t know why. Die image has equally sharp to my eyes.
4. B18 has no lanyard hole
5. I’ve had a few misclicks with B18 shortly after I took it off but later it felt OK
6. I don’t know how is it with B16 but B18 doesn’t accept flat top cells

I’ll EDC it for a while to get a better idea of how it feels.

Does the Skywolfeye B16 take only AAA or also 10440 or NiMH?

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It works with all these chemistries.

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Thanks Agro! Smile That’s great news. Just returning the Led Lenser P3R due to ring artefacts in beam both zoomed in and out. Let’s hope the B16 does a better job at 1/20th of the price Silly

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Agro wrote:
It works with all these chemistries.

P.S. what 10440 do you use with it? Apparently button top (protected?) due to earlier uncertainty on whether it takes flat tops?

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1) Lumintop Zoom1 doesn’t seem to be in the list on the first page yet? Uses XPL-HD, takes in 21700 or 18650 battery, with built-in USB charging port.

2) Nicron B22W doesn’t seem to be listed: it uses 2xAAA, although the zooming is quite small, and low lumens. I think the LED is LH351B.

3) Sofirn S11-B (uses XPL-HD LED?? need to be verified) and Sofirn S11 v2.0 (supposedly uses LH351D), uses 18650, built-in USB-C charging port, twist head to zoom, cylindrical shape body (including the head)

4) Convoy Z1 (SST40) doesn’t seem to be listed yet. I think it uses 21700 battery.

5) Wuben L60 appears to be the exact same flashlight as the Wuben LT35, same LED, similar UI (very slight difference in UI between the LT35 and L60: LT35 includes SOS in regular cycle, whereas on the L60, SOS mode is not part of regular cycle, but instead accessed via double-half-press. Otherwise, physically and performance appear to be exactly the same.

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I’m looking into the Convoy Z1. My interest is as a semi-floody walking light with throw capability in one unit.

The only throw figures I can find are on Gearbest, which shows 150 metres. Does that sound right? My 18650 tube light has half the power and more throw.

It comes in 4 mode or 12 group versions. The 12 group (biscotti?) is advertised with thermal regulation. Is that new? I thought it was limited to the 4 mode only.

Also, does anyone know if it’s a push-pull or twist zoom?

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tcglog wrote:
Agro wrote:
It works with all these chemistries.

P.S. what 10440 do you use with it? Apparently button top (protected?) due to earlier uncertainty on whether it takes flat tops?


I use PKCELL 10440, button top. IDK if flat top works but I think it should.

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