Finally the XHP70.2 emerges!

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Enderman
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EasyB wrote:

Yes, this is what happened, as I noted when I first talked about this issue on the previous page.


AH i see now.
JaredM
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A method I like to use to determine actual current in setups that I can’t get a good measurement otherwise is a two step approach and does require a power supply and a bit of time, but results are as real as you can get when currents are as high as they are with the 70.2 and triples, quads, etc.

1.) Ideally while installed in the light/host, generate a Vf vs I curve. Do this by soldering on long temporary leads to the LED connected to a PS. For most accuracy record values at multiple times, for example: turn-on, 3sec, 10sec, 30sec, and 120sec. This will result in 5 different tables/graphs.
2.) Reconnect driver and then just record your voltages. You now have a look-up table to determine your current. Remember that LED temp will play into these numbers so make sure you match it to the right table.

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JaredM
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Does anybody have a generic Vf to I curve for the 70.2?

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Tom E
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JaredM wrote:
Does anybody have a generic Vf to I curve for the 70.2?

Besides the one in the CREE specs? No, not that I'm aware of. Sorry, no time for setting something like that up, besides not knowing WTH I'm doing to accomplish that.... frown

Enderman
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Ollie wrote:
Enderman, OK, we come at this from different perspectives. However, I do have a theoretical question for you, or for anyone. Let’s say I want an outside dog-walking light. This is really what got me into this hobby in 2010. It was a lot cheaper for me to build what I needed, and at the time I had access to a well-equipped shop (I’m now retired). If you were to build a light, suggest to me a design that would be convenient to carry, and with decent runtime. I jumped on Magl*tes because I have a few of them, but I’m open to suggestions (L2 ?) what I see as the limiting factor is wattage. I have several lights at the 40W level, but I not sure that much more than 50W is practical. You see, no matter what we build, at some point the heat becomes a problem. Or the light becomes so massive or unbalanced that it becomes clumsy. So after a few “Wow!” sessions, it becomes a shelf queen. I think the obvious answer is going to be a multi-emitter light, because the light output per watt will be higher. The problem, from my perspective, is that I don’t want a floody light. My quad XM-Ls with Carlco optics are floody. I like them, I use them, but since I’ve got that base covered, I want something different. I also don’t want a light with no spill. I fell in love with the CREE XP-L HIs, and then fell out of love. The throw was great, but the spill was not bright enough to be useful. I don’t blind my dogs with the hotspot; I illuminate them with the spill, and use the spot to see further, as needed. This is why an OP reflector doesnot meet my needs. I want well-defined zones of luminosity. Perhaps 3 XP-L HIs in series, driven by 3 26650s, with a narrow spot optic would be my ultimate weapon. Or perhaps I’m full of condensed apple pie. Without dwelling upon that, what do you think would be the best light for my application? Ollie
This is why I bought a led lenser flashlight for EDC. I can choose between spot and throw and not have to deal with inconveniences of both at the same time. This probably isn’t for you though, it’s far from cheap. If you want more suggestions, instead of discussing it in this thread just make another topic Smile
djozz
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@Jason:
*expensive does not neccessarily equal accurate, as I have found many times, and also the opposite I have often found: cheap and simple can be very accurate. Sometimes you can not get around an expensive component though Sad
*with these high currents, a (even well bypassed) tailcap can lead to significantly lower current than a thick copper loop, although I would be surprised if that is the 5 amp difference we are looking for to explain our differences.

JasonWW
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djozz wrote:
@Jason:
*expensive does not neccessarily equal accurate, as I have found many times, and also the opposite I have often found: cheap and simple can be very accurate. Sometimes you can not get around an expensive component though Sad
*with these high currents, a (even well bypassed) tailcap can lead to significantly lower current than a thick copper loop, although I would be surprised if that is the 5 amp difference we are looking for to explain our differences.

I agree.

Maybe we should measure emitter temperature when we measure amp load and lumen output?

Maybe your emitter is getting much hotter as someone mentioned. Adding a temperature curve to the results might explain the drop in output your getting.

I forgot, did you reflow your 70.2 onto the mcpcb yourself? If not, maybe it wasn’t done well and there is too much solder paste in there with the emitter floating on top? Was this already discussed?

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djozz
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I reflowed it myself, and re-did it for the second set of measurements, I believe I did it well, there was enough solder and not a huge excess, and earlier tests did not find a measurable effect of thicker/thinner layers of solder between led and PCB.

Measuring MCPCB temperature would be a very nice addition to my test set-up, but it would add to the work-load of doing emitter tests. In practice that will lead to less emitter tests because I’m limited in hobby time and also the extra work will raise my treshold for doing tests, which is already higher than when I started doing them Wink

thijsco19
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Djozz, you are measuring the current at the led? Right?
The others at the tailcap before a driver?
Maybe that can explain something.
With these high currents weird things can happen.

djozz
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thijsco19 wrote:
Djozz, you are measuring the current at the led? Right?
The others at the tailcap before a driver?
Maybe that can explain something.
With these high currents weird things can happen.

It is the same current here or there, you would somehow notice a 5A current leak between battery and led, right?

But I will order another led eventually and do another test with an undisputable good mounting.

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The best dog walking light will vary by person but there are a lot of options. At the top of my list would be an L6 / S70s if you want something you can knock someone over the head with if needed. The Q8 is also a great option for this.

In smaller packages an X6 or X7 triple makes for a great overall light with some good output.

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Just updated my MT07 with a XHP70.2 (same P2 3B), but from KD. I did make resistor mods, but had somewhat disappointing results with updated to a XHP70 P2 1C - now I'm not even sure it is what I thought it was....

Anyways, the results:

7,480 lumens @start, 7,280 lumens @30 secs, 198 kcd at 5m (890 meters)

 Before on the XHP70 I got:

5,710 lumens @start, 5,250 lumens @30 secs, 140 kcd at 5m (748 meters)

Significant gains. The boost in throw is very encouraging. The MT07 has an OP, but it's a big head for sure at 86 mm, and 72.5 mm I.D. Sorry, didn't measure amps.

 

 

 

Anthon
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Tom E wrote:

Just updated my MT07 with a XHP70.2 (same P2 3B), but from KD. I did make resistor mods, but had somewhat disappointing results with updated to a XHP70 P2 1C – now I’m not even sure it is what I thought it was….


Anyways, the results:


7,480 lumens start, 7,280 lumens 30 secs, 198 kcd at 5m (890 meters)


 Before on the XHP70 I got:


5,710 lumens start, 5,250 lumens 30 secs, 140 kcd at 5m (748 meters)


Significant gains. The boost in throw is very encouraging. The MT07 has an OP, but it’s a big head for sure at 86 mm, and 72.5 mm I.D. Sorry, didn’t measure amps.


 


 


 

with a 2000lm gain and 60.000cd I wouldn’t be disappointed Cash

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I’m a bit lost in all that led’s Blushing

Can I put this 70.2 in Convoy L6 without modification?
Or if not what should I mod?

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XXX-Man wrote:
I’m a bit lost in all that led’s Blushing

Can I put this 70.2 in Convoy L6 without modification?
Or if not what should I mod?


Yes you can!
JasonWW
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XXX-Man wrote:
I’m a bit lost in all that led’s Blushing

Can I put this 70.2 in Convoy L6 without modification?
Or if not what should I mod?


If your using the stock driver this 70.2 would fit just fine.

If your using a FET driver, then it may pull excessive amps.

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XXX-Man
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Thank you so much! Big Smile

I’m using driver from Kaidomain, but it’s almost the same as original, only different firmware.
http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S025253.CF-FX-30-30mm-5_5V-9V-5-Mode-Driver-C...
Also did resistor mod, added R100 resistor.

Got to order 70.2 then Smile
It should be great in L6 with SMO reflector I have Smile

“The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom.” - Isaac Asimov

 

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."

 

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JasonWW
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XXX-Man wrote:
Thank you so much! Big Smile

I’m using driver from Kaidomain, but it’s almost the same as original, only different firmware.
http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S025253.CF-FX-30-30mm-5_5V-9V-5-Mode-Driver-C...
Also did resistor mod, added R100 resistor.

Got to order 70.2 then Smile
It should be great in L6 with SMO reflector I have Smile


Did you get the driver that has the 3 modes plus standby?

Texas Ace Lumen Tube and JoshK Sphere calibrated with Maukka lights

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solRNY
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djozz wrote:
XXX-Man wrote:
I’m a bit lost in all that led’s Blushing

Can I put this 70.2 in Convoy L6 without modification?
Or if not what should I mod?


Yes you can!

can you dedome it too?

JasonWW
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solRNY wrote:
djozz wrote:
XXX-Man wrote:
I’m a bit lost in all that led’s Blushing

Can I put this 70.2 in Convoy L6 without modification?
Or if not what should I mod?


Yes you can!

can you dedome it too?


I don’t know about removing the dome, but you can easily slice it off.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube and JoshK Sphere calibrated with Maukka lights

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djburkes
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Digikey has the XHP70.2 in stock now.

JasonWW
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Has anyone sliced the dome off one of these yet?

I’m curious if the color gets warmer, how much output you lose and if it still has the yellow corona.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube and JoshK Sphere calibrated with Maukka lights

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Enderman
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So far everyone that’s shaved the dome on one of these ‘new phosphor’ emitters has gotten reduced intensity and lumen output.
I think ONE person managed to dedome one? Can’t remember for sure.

XXX-Man
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JasonWW wrote:
XXX-Man wrote:
Thank you so much! Big Smile

I’m using driver from Kaidomain, but it’s almost the same as original, only different firmware.
http://www.kaidomain.com/p/S025253.CF-FX-30-30mm-5_5V-9V-5-Mode-Driver-C...
Also did resistor mod, added R100 resistor.

Got to order 70.2 then Smile
It should be great in L6 with SMO reflector I have Smile


Did you get the driver that has the 3 modes plus standby?

Yes, same as you got.

“The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom.” - Isaac Asimov

 

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."

 

My reviews:

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Fasttech has the XHP70.2 P2 1A in stock too for $13.16
https://www.fasttech.com/products/1609/10036285/7908500-cree-xhp70-2-p2-...

I’ll wait for the 3A tint though.

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How hard are they to reflow? Would the P2 bin 1A be big improvement to a stock Acebeam K60?

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Enderman wrote:
So far everyone that’s shaved the dome on one of these ‘new phosphor’ emitters has gotten reduced intensity and lumen output. I think ONE person managed to dedome one? Can’t remember for sure.

Member MEM was able to truly dedome the xpg3 and other new emitters. But it was his trade secret and he’s been absent from here for 8-9 months.

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AlexGT wrote:
How hard are they to reflow? Would the P2 bin 1A be big improvement to a stock Acebeam K60?

With driver mod, there should be a similar improvement as on the MT07: http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1136635#comment-1136635
XXX-Man
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Jerommel wrote:
Fasttech has the XHP70.2 P2 1A in stock too for $13.16
https://www.fasttech.com/products/1609/10036285/7908500-cree-xhp70-2-p2-...

I’ll wait for the 3A tint though.


Is that dtp or just copper board?
https://www.fasttech.com/products/1609/10036285/7908401

“The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom.” - Isaac Asimov

 

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."

 

My reviews:

Sofirn SF36 /// Thorfire VG10S /// Sofirn C8F /// Zanflare F1

Jerommel
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XXX-Man wrote:
Jerommel wrote:
Fasttech has the XHP70.2 P2 1A in stock too for $13.16
https://www.fasttech.com/products/1609/10036285/7908500-cree-xhp70-2-p2-...

I’ll wait for the 3A tint though.


Is that dtp or just copper board?
https://www.fasttech.com/products/1609/10036285/7908401

DTP by the looks of it.
You can see the round cornered rectangular thermal slug stick through the dielectric layer.

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