Luminus SST-40, a N4 BA bin tested

377 posts / 0 new
Last post

Pages

DavidEF
DavidEF's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 2 days ago
Joined: 06/05/2014 - 06:00
Posts: 7699
Location: Salisbury, North Carolina, USA
everydaysurvivalgear wrote:
DavidEF wrote:
edsg – How did you kill them in petrol trying to de-dome them?

The Silicone stays on and takes the bonding wires with it. No matter how long you leave it.

I have 3 more that i sliced the performance difference isn’t to much between the two.


I’ve heard of that happening with some emitters. I wonder if slicing most of the silicone off first, then soaking, might work. Have you tried that?

Do you mean the performance between sliced and full dome isn’t much difference or the performance of sliced versus fully de-domed?

The Cycle of Goodness: “No one prospers without rendering benefit to others”
- The YKK Philosophy

Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 24 min ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 12786
Location: nyc

That’d concern me, because with bare phosphor (and nekkid bond wires), any — I believe it’s called “schmutz” — could stick to it and burn when powered up.

At least if sliced, it could be wiped off.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

degarb
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 6 days ago
Joined: 07/02/2012 - 14:28
Posts: 109
Location: Just south of the future ice sheet

This led gets my attention. I read through this thread and have more questions than answers.

My objective, in a nutshell, wearable on head worklight 400 lumen 4000 candela 12 deg Hotspot, 10 hours of cc, not green tint: I am interested in building more work headlamps that can get me 200 lpw for 10 hours, using 2s18650 and the buckpuck 700, 700 mA, with a dial dimmer. I use a 31mm,prefer 36mm aluminum smo, because I need a bare minimum 4000 lux at 1 meter. My last build was rain resistant, 2 series 18650 at rear of headband with buckpuck, the head pivoted (one build used thin copper pipe on aluminum with elastic) the led was an Cree XP-L v6 4000 Kelvin thermal epoxy mounted to a flat aluminum avid with finger spikes that epoxied to the aluminum reflector. This thermally epoxied to an old fashioned computer heatsink with thermally attached copper pipe for pivot. The open bezel design allows hyper cooling, with the aluminum reflector (thermally epoxied to pcb) as a huge part of the cooling. This allows a very low led junction temperature. I recall under 40C using mm probe and ir. At 700 mA I measured 373 lumens, over 4000 lux, which I could sustain 9.5 hours. My last build like these was in 2016. I have seen led technology marching backwards, chasing lumens and allowing spectrum filters for higher cri….. I might be interested in 80 cri, but I do not do photography, I only need to see subtle color differences, which even 65 cri metal halides do excellently—(cri+gai+luminance equals color, not just cri). I did attempt to build some 2x amc7135 lights but I really felt the drop in efficiency from 92% to 70% made the lights useless for my jobsite purpose. I really can’t do anything with a runtime much less than 10 hours.

From reading this thread, it looks like this led might bump up the runtime, while allowing the same throw/lux in a 31 mm at 700 mA. However, I am reading that the color will be unacceptable green at 300 to 700 mA. I am thinking that the sbt 70 would offer poor lux at the max allowed mah for a wearable worklight, which is 700 mA. (yes a 3s 1850, or 2s 21700, would allow 1 amp for near 10 hours, however, weight, charge time, and number of bays for 3 to 6 workers, gets messy).

The XP-L2 has lower forward voltage, but it has lower output at 700 mA, which is a big deal since 31 mm is available, while 36 is not. I do not like 40 mm Hotspot size. And at 31mm, my XP-L v6 barely got 4000 lux (minimum acceptable 2meter 1000 lux, for inspection). So, I am thinking the tradeoff of runtime for lower lux with 700 mA, not worth going that route.

I am also thinking that this led might not cut it either. (seriously, no advancement in leds in 4 years, other than wow factor and filtered spectrum to better cri, lower output? However, if output same, lower fV, longer runtime is a great plus since I am still struggling to get 4000 candela for 10 hours. But I hate green tint. I am happy with the 4000 Kelvin XP-L V6 70 cri, tint-although I would like to bump up to 80 cri, if I could without significant output loss. … I have purchased 3 95 cri lights in the last 3 years, including on fixed metal halide, but apart from the tint novelt, I am not really happy with loss in output tradeoff. I use them more as reference lights for my main work lights. )

Now, my un edited questions and notes that arose from reading this long thread, if anyone cares to read and answer:

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/54947?page=5

1. What is the binning? (Flux : N4, Color : BA, Voltage: VK?)
2. Lpw at 1 or 2 watts? At 350 ma and 700 ma?
3. Gallery comparing color rendering v. Xpl v6 at same color temperature.
4. I take it that the fV is 15% lower than the xp-l v6. People are reporting it runs at same due heat as the xp-l v6 at same current. So, I am guessing a 15% longer runtime until the 7135 linear driver cuts out. This correct? Then, what about a 700 ma buckpuck, 92% efficienct buck driver v. A 70% efficient linear driver?
5. Having butchered every led I attempted to dedomed with razor and gasoline, I would rather buy a predomed sbt-40 that has been certified with a bin rating, above the xp-l v5.
6. I don’t understand why the sbt-90.2 is not smaller than the xp-l, 3030 v 3535, at a glance on spec sheet.
7. I don’t understand how the second generation of the sbt-90.2 fits in with the sbt-40: how much lower is the lux per watt as compared to the sbt-40 ; why am I not seeing the sbt-40 having a second generation like the sbt-90.2?
8. Are there any 2s18650 buck driver lights with ramping, which are headlamps?
9. Apart from the buckpuck with dimmer, are there any affordable buck drivers out there that target useful full workday runtime off 2 cells?
10. Do the dome defects and inconsistent suppliers make the led not worth ditching Cree? Is baking at a low temp for a while able to drive out humidity and avoid reflow bubbles?
11. Kaidomain.com, banggood, intl-outdoor, digikey? Aliexpress safe seller , RMM and IOS?, arrow? Mouser, mtnelectronis. Shenzhen Great Technology Co.,Ltd.?
12. Reflow onto same star as xpl? Lead solder paste Best, still in 2020?
13. Ring artifacts?
14. Any fixed lighting using the led?
15. What washer (thickness) could be used to dedomed, by protecting the die? Single edge, razor, scalpel, or beard razor, would work best? Detail Scissors? And, if I don’t get all of the dome off does it ruin the throw? Is it a really thin line between nicking the die and getting a dedomed led that is an improvement?… Toluene better than gas, xylene, lacquer thinner, acetone? (toluene is 5 minutes. Vinh stopped fully removing SST-40 domes, now he shaves them. He says it gives him the same throw, but better output.)
16. Best place to buy 36 mm or 31 mm smo reflectors? 26 mm, maybe for a dedomed version?
17. If I reflow myself, how to avoid creating bubbles, as is the case with most of these?
18. Tint lottery?
19. How badly does the tint shift during amp/mA change? It would suck if green if not slamming with pwm to highest current!! (twisted raven wrote: My SST-40 gives me a brilliant cool white with little green at max output, but at lower outputs on a non PWM driver, it gets rather green. My Quark 2AA-X does that. On turbo, it’s not too bad. On moonlight, greeeeeeeeeen. )
20. Voltage bin? VH, 2.5 VOLT, only good bin to beat the xp-l? (vj 2.7v, vk 2.9v,vl 3.1)
21. If a fet is a dd, with no resistor as mnt electronics claim, why would I pay $20 for a wiring bypass. Mnt can not be correct in what a fet driver is.
22. This is lower than the Cree v6 xpl version 1: Nw only 310 lm typical at 700 mA 170 lm/W typical at 700 ma. Why so much lower? VH and n5 bin in only 6500k?
23. Is this true?: “the die is larger than XP-L or XM-L2, so you either need large optics or a lot of power (or both) to get impressive throw numbers.” (The die is maybe slightly larger. I measured about 10% less throw than dedomed XPL V6 at the same current).
24. Has luxeon or Cree improved in the last 3 years. How about a xp-l v6 in 80 cri? (green tint in a useful =<.1C drive level makes the led useless, other than search and rescue and ocd pursuit).

Hank noctigons from hank, kd, VK from Ali, reflowed on noctigon, Kaidomain.com KD DTP copper MCPCB-s., or aluminum
https://m.aliexpress.com/item/32804792539.html?trace=wwwdetail2mobilesit...

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/10PCS-100PCS-Luminus-SST-40-10W-LED-1100lm-Cool-White-7000K-instead-of-CREE-XML2-XM/1966839_32819284669.html

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10PCS-100PCS-Luminus-SST-40-10W-LED-1100lm-Cool-White-7000K-instead-of-CREE-XML2-XM/32819284669.html
Funny, it appears renamed to “GreatLED Store” from shenzen

Like KDlight DTP Mcpcb is 1.5mm thick, Noctigon is 1.6mm thick and SinkPAD-ii is 1.65mm thick. (Is there anymore available DTP Mcpcb’s out there?)

( Vinh uses VTC5A)

KD has VH Voltage binned SST-40’s now.
Has higher brightness bin too.
http://kaidomain.com/Flashlight-DIY-and-Tools/LED-Emitters-or-LED-Star-on-PCB/High-Power-Luminus-SST-40-Voltage-VH-N5-BC-White-6500K-LED-Emitter?sort=p.date_available&order=DESC
Nw only 310 lm typical at 700 mA 170 lm/W typical at 700 mA

https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/Luminus-Devices/SST-40-WDS-F50-N3501
https://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine?Keyword=sst-40

Runtime=Usefulness

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 3 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 13561
Location: LI NY

Good luck. I looked over the list and don't think I can answer anything properly, and I thought I know a lot bout LED's.

Some of the questions don't make any sense - like "tint lottery?", "Ring artifacts?".

"tint lottery?" - I thought tint lottery is par for the course with LED's - every brand/model/spec, it's all a matter of binning, both tint and lumens output.

"Ring artifacts?" - I though it was more from the optics, not the LED.

Just fyi, I do like the 5000K tint in the SST-40's, and with KD offering them in bin N5, best of both worlds! I haven't tried one yet, but this is probably the best SST-40 available, maybe for a while, maybe forever.

degarb
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 6 days ago
Joined: 07/02/2012 - 14:28
Posts: 109
Location: Just south of the future ice sheet
Tom E wrote:

Good luck. I looked over the list and don’t think I can answer anything properly, and I thought I know a lot bout LED’s.


Some of the questions don’t make any sense – like “tint lottery?”, “Ring artifacts?”.


“tint lottery?” – I thought tint lottery is par for the course with LED’s – every brand/model/spec, it’s all a matter of binning, both tint and lumens output.


“Ring artifacts?” – I though it was more from the optics, not the LED.


Just fyi, I do like the 5000K tint in the SST-40’s, and with KD offering them in bin N5, best of both worlds! I haven’t tried one yet, but this is probably the best SST-40 available, maybe for a while, maybe forever.

Well, some leds have more of a tiny lottery and ring artifacts. The xre had unacceptable ring in a smo, for example. Luxeon has a reputation for consistent tint. I am a little concerned that luminus, a Chinese company, might not think twice about qc, tint lottery control. I could be wrong. I am not a fan of any optics other than smo, because I am trying to squeeze out every lumen, Hotspot lux, and spill lux, as possible over a 10 hour runtime.

I do think I like anything from 4000k to 5800 Kelvin, depending on my mood and color that I am inspecting. 5000k (+-300),seems most logical, intellectually, at least. I have 70 cri lights that are 6500k that seem acceptable, and others, same 70 cri and 6500 that I absolutely hate the tint. So I, probably keep under 5700k, just to be safe. I have had green tints, that I would not use, especially back in 2008. Green, and purple, and too far blue tints, which I have encountered, must die.

I apologize for lack of editing, as I am more interested in answers than letting these notes age further on my computer. Thanks for the answers.

Yes, kd, as I recall, had some of the best parts at the best price. Unfortunately, I must order from like 12 suppliers to get all the parts I need for one light. My basement flooded and ruined my 31mm reflectors I had stocked. 36 mm have better spill throw ratio for an XP-L or xml. So, I assume these too… A 26 mm I reserve for the XP-L hi in a single cell, single amc7135. I have no use for a 20 mm reflector….. And, I think the 40 mm too small of a Hotspot. 36 mm smo are hard to find.

Runtime=Usefulness

djozz
djozz's picture
Online
Last seen: 13 min 38 sec ago
Joined: 09/07/2012 - 17:04
Posts: 17312
Location: Amsterdam

Luminus is an american company as far as I know.

You could answer your own questions and order one or a few SST-40 leds, for most people they do not cost a year’s salary.

What I found about beams produced by the SST-40 is that they produce nice, even tinted hotspots without ugly corona’s.

degarb
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 6 days ago
Joined: 07/02/2012 - 14:28
Posts: 109
Location: Just south of the future ice sheet

My biggest concern, I guess, is my low current, by this community standards. Would they be green at 150, 350, 700 mA? I am not talking 150 ma, by slamming the led with high current of like six amc7135, then pwm down to 150 ma. (Actually, I would be pwm 700 mA, or just going a straight 340 ma, using one amc7135, on a single cell build).

Runtime=Usefulness

Lightbringer
Lightbringer's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 24 min ago
Joined: 08/30/2016 - 14:12
Posts: 12786
Location: nyc

Consider a TIR? 20mm is most common, but people who did off-road lights got some narrow-spot TIRs in >30mm sizes.

Most come with or at least have available, a “shoe” which keeps the lens perfectly placed over the LED. Most even have mounting holes to hold the lens to the (usually 20mm) mcpcb as well.

09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

degarb
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 6 days ago
Joined: 07/02/2012 - 14:28
Posts: 109
Location: Just south of the future ice sheet

A 30 mm with low loss gets my attention—-My tir experience is that

1. I can use the aluminum reflector as part of the heat sink. (rather than using a centering ring, I lift the aluminum reflector into place with my avid fingers, then use thermal epoxy to bridge the reflector onto the pcb, then epoxy the electrical contacts for water proofing. the bezel has plenty of air inside to cool the inside of the “bezel” and reflector”

2. My tir (limited manufacturer) experience is: yes they can throw a bit more than an smo, but coronal spill is less and a lumen absorption, beyond an aluminum smo and ar lense (I am fighting to get every bit out of 700 mah, aka my .1C drain goal…… Before the xpg, I was a fan of tir and focusing lights because the 3 aa and efficiency wasn’t enough. After the 4aa and xpg and 2× 18650, I didn’t want lpw trade for just throw. however, in single cell xpl v6, a 30 mm tir, at .1C sounds like a winner. Not sure it would beat an xpl hi v5, in a 26mm. I have no use for even 20 mm tirs, at least for work lights, with limited capacity of the 18650 and 21700s (I suppose an xpl hi at 700mah off 2s 18650, but no point, as in a single cell where tir makes sense, .1c is 300 mah to 420 mah with amc7135 loss.

I haven’t met a single cell light I like yet—driverer loss, limited mah batteries, small optic on the right angle lights. I liked the imalent hr20, but even it falls about 3.5 x short of anything more than a belt emergency light, when I forgot the real work lights.

Runtime=Usefulness

garrybunk
garrybunk's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 hours 48 min ago
Joined: 10/31/2011 - 09:25
Posts: 6098
Location: Johnstown, PA

TLDR – Can someone tell me a synopsis of the SST40 LED. I see it’s got a low vF and better output than an XM_L2 (and darn close if not better than an XP-L), but how does it compare in actual use? Does it throw better than an XM-L2? Is throw and beam width about the same as an XM-L2? Does it throw less but have a wider beam? Beamshot comparisons between other emitters (LEDs at same current levels and same TIR’s or reflectors preferred) would be great! I’m interested in trying out some emitters in a dual LED bike light (20mm optics – probably 10º) and looking to maybe try SST40’s and SST20’s (right now I’m not too impressed with SST20’s, but that’s seeing them in a Sofirn IF25A quad). I’m not looking to direct-drive them for max current; they’ll probably be running at about 2.4A each.

Thanks!
-Garry

My Bike Lights Thread, Optics (TIR) Comparison Beamshots, Diffusion Techniques

, MTBR’s Lights & Night Riding Forum
NOTE: Now hosting my photos from my Google account. Post up if you can’t see them. Older photos hosted on Photobucket or Flickr may disappear (PM me if you want access to them).
Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 3 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 13561
Location: LI NY

The 5000K SST-40 is one of may favorite LED's now - lots of power, nice consistent beam pattern - no crazy tint shifting.

Not aware of any head-to-head compares, but in throw, it's probably about the same as an XM-L2 for the same lumens output. Of course you can slice SST-40's to get more throw, close to double the kcd if done well. I don't think it's an advantage over XM-L2's or XPL's (same really) of output per amp, just that you can get more amps out of them because of the low Vf.

djozz's test in the OP shows they perform similar, but all depends on binning of the LED's being compared I'm sure.

garrybunk
garrybunk's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 hours 48 min ago
Joined: 10/31/2011 - 09:25
Posts: 6098
Location: Johnstown, PA

Thanks Tom! In bike light use I’m very interested in the low vF yielding higher output for longer.

-Garry

My Bike Lights Thread, Optics (TIR) Comparison Beamshots, Diffusion Techniques

, MTBR’s Lights & Night Riding Forum
NOTE: Now hosting my photos from my Google account. Post up if you can’t see them. Older photos hosted on Photobucket or Flickr may disappear (PM me if you want access to them).
garrybunk
garrybunk's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 hours 48 min ago
Joined: 10/31/2011 - 09:25
Posts: 6098
Location: Johnstown, PA

Oh, quick question – does the SST40 fit in typical XML sized optics without any modding or anything? What about using the SST20 in the XML optics – does that work out okay (with spacers or something) or should XPG sized optics be used instead?

Thanks!
-Garry

My Bike Lights Thread, Optics (TIR) Comparison Beamshots, Diffusion Techniques

, MTBR’s Lights & Night Riding Forum
NOTE: Now hosting my photos from my Google account. Post up if you can’t see them. Older photos hosted on Photobucket or Flickr may disappear (PM me if you want access to them).
Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 3 min ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 13561
Location: LI NY

Yes - I've never had SST-40 problems on 5050's. Dome sure looks the same size/shape as XM-L or XM-L2.

For 3535's, SST-20's have same issue as XPL's, 351D's, and all other 3535's. I can usually get away with the 45 deg thing to position a 3535 LED in a 5050 reflector centering piece. Other optics may need a 3535 to 5050 converter, which they sell (somewhere), maybe on KD.

I prefer 351D's over SST-20's mostly, but SST-20's throw better. The high CRI SST-20's don't throw all that good though - lower output as well. All the classic tradeoffs - for high CRI, lose lumens and throw.

3535 to 5050 adapter: http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_82&product_id=242

 

Sirstinky
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 40 min ago
Joined: 11/02/2018 - 17:07
Posts: 880
Location: Vancouver, WA

I agree. Sst40 is one of the best currently out for flashlights. Great output, efficient, cheap, fits into lights with xm-l and xml2 and xm-l optics and reflectors, and has nice tint in 5000k (and no tint shift or corona). No high cri though…

Agro
Agro's picture
Online
Last seen: 12 sec ago
Joined: 05/14/2017 - 11:16
Posts: 6302
Location: Ślōnsk

But only low CRI so far. Sad

Pages