Future development of the maximum luminance of LEDs

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luminarium iaculator
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Texas_Ace wrote:
led4power wrote:

.

Any numbers with this LED yet?

Peak could be anywhere between 8-10A but it will easily pull over 13A without exploding on fet driver Smile

I did some classic redneck style test here

I like it. Wide screen TV 16:9 format LED emitter Smile

Texas_Ace
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Wow, it pulled 13A with a single cell? That is an impressively low Vf, even the 219C 90cri only pulled around 10-11A.

How does it compare to the flat black / flat white in throw?

luminarium iaculator
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Same or even better in throw than white flat 1mm with more lumens and wide screen tv die projection Smile

Edit: Why I said it may be better than white flat 1mm? Because I can not measure that with mine fet driver configuration since it pulls a lot of current and thus generates a lot of heat which could have influence on performance.

Some regulated configuration in multi cell lights with better cooling potential will show real nature of this emitter.

If I would have to place a bet who would win between 1mm or 2mm White Flat I would place a bet on this new White Flat 2 mm.

Since it is not suitable for my fet driver single 18650 light configuration I am really looking forward for real builds BLF members will bring with this new White Flat 2mm.

Comparison pic between new White Flat 2mm(sorry I really can’t remember full name) and XP-G2 S4 2B DD

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It’s the same LED technology but with just a bigger die.
Since the physical size is the same it will always perform worse than the smaller emitter because it has a larger die area and therefore requires more wattage to achieve the same cd/mm^2
More watts and same cooling pad area = worse performance as you increase the current.

The boost HX aka CULPM1.TG which has a physically larger size has the chance to perform better.

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The datasheet says the die is 1.59:1.25, (1.272:1) which is 12.72:10. Much closer to 4:3 regular tv aspect ratio (1.33:1) than 16:9 widescreen. (1.77:1)

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Smile
led4power
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Enderman wrote:
I'm still waiting on my CSLNM1 LEDs to arrive Sad

Maybe reason is this?:

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/63638

 

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I am not able to keep up with the latest developments in LED tech now days. If ya’ll find the “perfect throw king” LED let me know.

I have a few lights that might work well with a super thrower LED like these if they pan out.

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led4power wrote:

Enderman wrote:
I’m still waiting on my CSLNM1 LEDs to arrive Sad

Maybe reason is this?:


http://budgetlightforum.com/node/63638


 


Yeah probably.
Some of my international packages came in, others no.
It will just take a long while, not your fault.
luminarium iaculator
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Enderman wrote:
More watts and same cooling pad area = worse performance as you increase the current.

Yes that happens in mine host. But for couple of seconds mine tested White flat 2mm at 9-10A has same or slightly better performance as tested White flat 1mm driven at 5.8A.

There is still that 10% of lux variations that can happen between emitters so if you got worse 1mm and better 2mm wf could actually win imho.

So this is obviously emitter for someone like you Enderman. Better cooling methods etc… Really don’t know why you don’t have wish to try it. You will have to wait for a long time until HX appears Smile

Enderman
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luminarium iaculator wrote:
Enderman wrote:
More watts and same cooling pad area = worse performance as you increase the current.

Yes that happens in mine host. But for couple of seconds mine tested White flat 2mm at 9-10A has same or slightly better performance as tested White flat 1mm driven at 5.8A.

There is still that 10% of lux variations that can happen between emitters so if you got worse 1mm and better 2mm wf could actually win imho.

So this is obviously emitter for someone like you Enderman. Better cooling methods etc… Really don’t know why you don’t have wish to try it. You will have to wait for a long time until HX appears Smile


The transient temperature response will be completely different for both LEDs.
The reason the 1mm is getting worse performance is probably because 5.8A is past the peak of the output curve, while the 2mm is still not at its peak at 9-10A.
The proper way to compare them is to put them on a proper CPU heatsink, make current-output curves to find the peak of the curve (at steady state obviously, not only after a few seconds), and then compare the peak luminance at those peaks.

Once the post strike in canada finished I will immediately buy a few CSLPM1.TGs to test and I’ll show you what I mean.

luminarium iaculator
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XP-E2(the best version is torch i think) is beaten by larger brother XP-G2?

Imho there are plenty of stuff that can strike us like bad re flow, bad emitter pick, thermal path, so you never can be 100% sure…

I will place bet on 2mm version anyway. Thumbs Up Looking forward for your test.

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I have added the new Osram LEDs. The thermal resistance of the Boost HX shows why it will probably be way better than all the others.

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I have no idea how this project product compares to crystals, sintered phosphor, etc. PDF claims it has taken 445nm laser powers up to 30W/mm2 on metal and on glass substrates. Has 96CRI at 5500K tint option. Seems like it would be handy for replacing damage phosphor layers on flip chip LED’s.

https://phosphortech.com/datasheets/datasheet-phosphor-sheets.pdf

Enderman wrote:
The crystals have basically no drop in output till 300C This means you can have a pretty intense laser directed at it without damage. One university tested up to 14W of blue laser and got 4000lm but it was spread over a large 5mm crystal IIRC, not all in a concentrated spot. The crystal was not heatsinked to anything either. These are my main resources: https://www.osapublishing.org/oe/abstract.cfm?uri=oe-24-2-a215 http://jss.ecsdl.org/content/5/10/R172.full
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Does anybody have anything on the Boost HX recently?

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Any one going to add the info on the SST20?

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The_Driver, could you please add Lumileds Luxeon CZ to the table?
It seems to have the lowest thermal resistance of any 1 mm² LEDs that I’ve seen. Though I’m not sure if they mean real or electrical resistance, the datasheet is unclear about that. If that’s electrical – it’s still very good but no longer special.

Though then there’s a tiny thermal pad which will spoil performance for sure. If indium solder really brings actual improvements, these are going to be relatively high with this LED.

ADDED: This Luxeon C document (not CZ) makes me believe they mean electrical resistance. I’m not really surprised….still, resistance is good and I think this LED should easily get intense enough to deserve a its place in the table on the first page.

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I have added it, maybe you can help me fill some of the data fields.
I’m very sceptical regarding the maximum performance.

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I don’t expect it to play in the same league as automotive LEDs really.
But:

  • very small footprint may be good for tight packing multiple LEDs
  • it goes up to CRI90 Smile

And I think it’s likely to be the throwiest LED on the market with CRI>70. Smile

Area of the heat conducting solder pad:
1.08 mm²
max. rated LED temperature Tj:
135°C

Other fields need testing. Sad

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Luminus SST-20 CRI95 seems to be over 100 cd/mm² though the precision of my calculations is too low to call it definitive:
http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1508827#comment-1508827

CRI70 variant is over 100 for sure. I’m sure I’ve see it tested somewhere but can’t find it now….

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.

contactcr
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Boost HX or colored flat?

Agro
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Looks like 1 mm²!!??
Haven’t heard about it before but CULNM1.TG is a thing:
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/kw-culnm1.tg-z8pf5-ebvffcbb46-65g5/osr...
ADDED:
And Osram is phasing it out:
https://www.mouser.com/PCN/Osram_Opto_Semiconductor_1_cip_OS_NFND_2018_0...
Big Smile

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4040-size and 1mm2 die, hmmm Flat Stare

luminarium iaculator
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Throw the bone to the dogs L4P Evil

It looks like 2mm2 led to me… But lets wait and see what will L4P say.

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1 mm², CULNM1.TG aka Boost HL. And it’s already tested:
http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1509652#comment-1509652

luminarium iaculator
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Than it seems we spammed The Drivers thread Innocent

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 I already added it and linked to the test.

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I’m guessing this is nothing too interesting:

https://www.samsung.com/led/automotive/automotive-leds/i-series/3w-white/

I’m not too adept at reading datasheets to determine such things though.

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contactcr wrote:
I’m guessing this is nothing too interesting:

https://www.samsung.com/led/automotive/automotive-leds/i-series/3w-white/

I’m not too adept at reading datasheets to determine such things though.


I’m not that great at Datasheets either. But it seems to have package size just a bit bigger than XP, and die size about the same as OSRAM White Flat. It is rated for 385lm from 3.0V and 1.0A current. I’d like to see djozz test it! Party

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