Stupid question, but is that just the same led on a bigger die?
No such thing (edit: "no such thing as a stupid question" is what I meant here, I re-read this later and decided to clarify)
According to Led4Power earlier in the thread, essentially yes. There may be slight binning differences (flux and/or Vf) between them, or at least between the batches he got.
Bonus points: Boost HX is just the 2mm2 white flat, on the larger die.
Stupid question, but is that just the same led on a bigger die?
No such thing
According to Led4Power earlier in the thread, essentially yes. There may be slight binning differences (flux and/or Vf) between them, or at least between the batches he got.
Bonus points: Boost HX is just the 2mm2 white flat, on the larger die.
Thanks for your reply, maybe i should have asked earlier, not after ordering
That 4040 CULNM might be just what i was searching for
The 5000mA driver from Convoy gave me 4570mA on its highest setting while powering the 1mm white flat, so i guess it is not quite 5A driver which is perfect for the 1mm led.
I see two drivers on Simon his AE for SST40, one 20mm which should deliver max 6A and one 17mm which delivers 5A max.
Are you mentioning the 17mm driver?
(The L21a standard uses a 20mm driver, otherwise you need an additional retaining ring adapter for a 17mm driver)
The 5000mA driver from Convoy gave me 4570mA on its highest setting while powering the 1mm white flat, so i guess it is not quite 5A driver which is perfect for the 1mm led.
I see two drivers on Simon his AE for SST40, one 20mm which should deliver max 6A and one 17mm which delivers 5A max. …
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
BobbyMK if you want to push that a little bit more the math is easy. V = I × R = 4.57A × 10mΩ = 45.7mV sense. Stack an R100 on top of the stock R010 and you should get 10% extra maximum current, 5.027A.
Thanks for the info, its good to know that these are capable of more current by changing/stacking sense resistors.
Yokiamy wrote:
I see two drivers on Simon his AE for SST40, one 20mm which should deliver max 6A and one 17mm which delivers 5A max.
Are you mentioning the 17mm driver?
(The L21a standard uses a 20mm driver, otherwise you need an additional retaining ring adapter for a 17mm driver)
I use this driver in B158 and paired with the CSLNM.1 it has 370kcd throw, last time i measured without driver and NCR B battery to limit current it was about 380kcd. I think this is the sweet spot for this led.
… Thanks for the info, its good to know that these are capable of more current by changing/stacking sense resistors. …
I wouldn't go overboard with it. As you increase current the dissipated power at the MOSFET and driver increases too. Bear this in mind.
—
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
That is a Sofirn C8S host with Simon's 22mm SST-40 (max 8A) linear driver. Driver filed down to a tad less than ∅21mm and modified with an additional (slightly contact worn) R050 sense resistor. Measured 8.1A+ max current with power supply.
I am getting 132-133Kcd at 30s, 137-138Kcd peak, at close to 5 meters of distance using ceilingbounce app. Measured the same way I did with M1.
I measured ≈150Kcd for this build weeks ago, with an old reflector I swapped due to some minor damage. Driver was not modified at that point (I measured ≈7.63A back then).
Smartphone is a Lenovo Zuk Z2 Pro (Z2121 with custom Oreo 8.1 ROM). Do not know how good or accurate it is measuring illuminance, albeit I know it measures less than a Moto G 2013.
But heck, the intensity is way off I think. It should be getting at least 180Kcd… should be. The reflector's opening is ∅9mm, and is a little bit taller than the usual Convoy reflector (≈32.2mm).
Geez!
—
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
I agree, a C8 with a well-focused 2mm2 White Flat at 8A could reach 200 kcd.
I do not honestly know how well focused is the emitter in my C8S. I lowered the reflector gasket quite a bit, until the 5050 square gap surrounding centerpiece eroded and dissapeared. Did I go too far?
Concerning the M1 (@ 4.75A), it scores above 100Kcd cold start so that must be right, the M1 reflector surface looks to be about half of a C8. And its surface finish looks of higher quality (versus C8S).
—
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
I agree, a C8 with a well-focused 2mm2 White Flat at 8A could reach 200 kcd.
I do not honestly know how well focused is the emitter in my C8S. I lowered the reflector gasket quite a bit, until the 5050 square gap surrounding centerpiece eroded and dissapeared. Did I go too far?
Concerning the M1 (@ 4.75A), it scores above 100Kcd cold start so that must be right, the M1 reflector surface looks to be about half of a C8. And its surface finish looks of higher quality (versus C8S).
I used the smaller sibling of those gaskets, the XP-L version, on my CSLNM1.TG C8+ with 7mm bottom hole reflector. I sanded down the lip where the reflector rests on to about 0.5mm and it’s perfect. I could just about spot cattle and cattle herders at 600m away this weekend. I could see them moving on the hill. So I know it really performs well.
My previous gasket attempt was sanded down to about 0.2mm and it was worse. Looks like 0.5-0.6mm is a sweet spot.
—
Acebeam L18, Armytek Prime C1 Pro, Armytek Prime C2 Pro, Armytek Tiara C1 Pro, Astrolux MF01 Mini, BLF Q8, BLF A6, BLF FW1A, BLF FW3A, BLF FW3C, BLF LT1, Convoy L6, Convoy C8+ , Convoy S3, Emisar D4, Fireflies E07, Jaxman E2L, Manta Ray C8.2 long version, Olight S1R Baton II special edition series, S2R Baton II, Olight Baton 3, Olight Warrior Mini, Olight M2R Pro Warrior.
Thanks KevinZA1988, I think you answered my question. I went too far.
—
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
It shows in the hotspot if you are good, the NM1 in a quality smooth reflector (C8 reflectors are usually good) makes a very well defined evenly illuminated hotspot. Slightly off and everything goes assymmetrical and/or fuzzy.
I could of sworn I read earlier in this thread that the new 1mm 4040 CULNM can be reflowed onto a XP mcpcb 3535? Before I attempt another reflow and heat this poor led up for the 3rd time can somone confirm 3535 mcpcb’s works?
—
Sometimes being a newb is the best part of a hobbie.
I could of sworn I read earlier in this thread that the new 1mm 4040 CULNM can be reflowed onto a XP mcpcb 3535? Before I attempt another reflow and heat this poor led up for the 3rd time can somone confirm 3535 mcpcb’s works?
Here’s the catch: not every 3535 board has the exact same solder pad dimensions. Reflowing 4040 leds works reasonably well on boards with electrical pads that are a bit thinner and thus wider apart. The amount of solder must be fairly precise too, and make sure you position the led very very well!
But yes, confirmed, I succesfully soldered the 4040 CULM on the stock 3535 board of a Micro-GT and have a working flashlight.
I could of sworn I read earlier in this thread that the new 1mm 4040 CULNM can be reflowed onto a XP mcpcb 3535? Before I attempt another reflow and heat this poor led up for the 3rd time can somone confirm 3535 mcpcb’s works?
Here’s the catch: not every 3535 board has the exact same solder pad dimensions. Reflowing 4040 leds works reasonably well on boards with electrical pads that are a bit thinner and thus wider apart. The amount of solder must be fairly precise too, and make sure you position the led very very well!
But yes, confirmed, I succesfully soldered the 4040 CULM on the stock 3535 board of a Micro-GT and have a working flashlight.
Nice, awsome and thank you. YOU DA MAN!! So excited, it’s going into a 126mm aspherical lens super short FL, pre lens w/collaniator and a small waiven collar.
—
Sometimes being a newb is the best part of a hobbie.
I purchased two of the CULNM1.TG leds a while back from L4P and only today had some free time to reflow one for testing but one of them has this thing that is looking like some defect around the die, is this normal for this led or not? I hope it does not have impact on performance or lifespan of the led.
I've seen that partial circle "trench" on many white flats1/2, it seems it's from some kind of tool/mold which protects die during pouring "white stuff" over package surface, it shouldn't have any influence on performance.
I just threw this led in a C8, driven at only 4.85A, centering was very easy but height of the reflector will be an issue, at the moment i have the same centering gasket i had for the black flat but it turns out this led wants the reflector a bit higher than the black flat, i think that it will need similar height of the reflector as the xp-g2.
I just threw this led in a C8, driven at only 4.85A, centering was very easy but height of the reflector will be an issue, at the moment i have the same centering gasket i had for the black flat but it turns out this led wants the reflector a bit higher than the black flat, i think that it will need similar height of the reflector as the xp-g2.
Will test all this when it gets dark outside
It all depends on eachother, the thickness of different Mcpcb’s will differ , which allows more or less space in the head and that will affect the allowable thickness of the spacer and your focus, thus throw.
Focusing my white flat C8 took me more than an hour, but i eventually got it right.
Reaching over 200kCd on a standard Biscotti driver
It all depends on eachother, the thickness of different Mcpcb’s will differ , which allows more or less space in the head and that will affect the allowable thickness of the spacer and your focus, thus throw.
Focusing my white flat C8 took me more than an hour, but i eventually got it right.
Reaching over 200kCd on a standard Biscotti driver
Those are some excellent numbers, i hope that i will be able to hit that 200k number.
This C8 has slightly modified head and bezel, the reflector can sit and create enough pressure on the mcpcb without even needing of any type of gasket, before the mods the reflector outer lip was resting on the flashlight head and the reflector was not able to go all the way down, now without that problem i can play with the height of the reflector as much as i want, not looking forward to all that tho
Yup, not sure what the lens was originally used for. Guessing a big rear projection TV? With a Olsen Flat black at 600 LM it did 2.6 MIll. LUX measured at 9 meters. And heres the kicker,,2.6 mill with out the magical collar.
So you have some new friend called Olsen Flat who is black?
—
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
Thanks for your reply, maybe i should have asked earlier, not after ordering
That 4040 CULNM might be just what i was searching for
I see two drivers on Simon his AE for SST40, one 20mm which should deliver max 6A and one 17mm which delivers 5A max.
Are you mentioning the 17mm driver?
(The L21a standard uses a 20mm driver, otherwise you need an additional retaining ring adapter for a 17mm driver)
There's more:
I did not tried those.
Tried these: 17mm / 22mm dual ramping plus special mode max 8A N-channel MOSFET linear driver
Cheers
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
Thanks for the info, its good to know that these are capable of more current by changing/stacking sense resistors.
I’m talking about this driver.
I use this driver in B158 and paired with the CSLNM.1 it has 370kcd throw, last time i measured without driver and NCR B battery to limit current it was about 380kcd. I think this is the sweet spot for this led.
Olight i3s, Olight S1, Olight S Mini, JetBeam Jet-1, BLF 348, Astrolux S41S, UF SK-98, Convoy S2+ 3*XP-G2, Convoy S2+ 3*XPL, Convoy S2+ 219CT, Convoy M1, Convoy C8, Brinyte B158, Courui D01, Convoy L6, Noctigon M43
I wouldn't go overboard with it. As you increase current the dissipated power at the MOSFET and driver increases too. Bear this in mind.
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
When will the boost hx led be avaible?
"It wouldn’t be so bright if there wasn’t a shadow every once in a while." - Jason Mraz
No idea
link to djozz tests
That is a Sofirn C8S host with Simon's 22mm SST-40 (max 8A) linear driver. Driver filed down to a tad less than ∅21mm and modified with an additional (slightly contact worn) R050 sense resistor. Measured 8.1A+ max current with power supply.
I am getting 132-133Kcd at 30s, 137-138Kcd peak, at close to 5 meters of distance using ceilingbounce app. Measured the same way I did with M1.
I measured ≈150Kcd for this build weeks ago, with an old reflector I swapped due to some minor damage. Driver was not modified at that point (I measured ≈7.63A back then).
Smartphone is a Lenovo Zuk Z2 Pro (Z2121 with custom Oreo 8.1 ROM). Do not know how good or accurate it is measuring illuminance, albeit I know it measures less than a Moto G 2013.
But heck, the intensity is way off I think. It should be getting at least 180Kcd… should be. The reflector's opening is ∅9mm, and is a little bit taller than the usual Convoy reflector (≈32.2mm).
Geez!
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
Try getting the measurement at 10-20m.
My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547
I agree, a C8 with a well-focused 2mm2 White Flat at 8A could reach 200 kcd.
link to djozz tests
I do not honestly know how well focused is the emitter in my C8S. I lowered the reflector gasket quite a bit, until the 5050 square gap surrounding centerpiece eroded and dissapeared. Did I go too far?
If I recall it right the gasket was of this type: http://kaidomain.com/Flashlight-DIY-and-Tools/Misc-Parts/S024676-10mm-D-x-0_9mm-T-White-Plastic-Insulation-Gaskets-for-Cree-XM-L-10-pcs
Concerning the M1 (@ 4.75A), it scores above 100Kcd cold start so that must be right, the M1 reflector surface looks to be about half of a C8. And its surface finish looks of higher quality (versus C8S).
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
I used the smaller sibling of those gaskets, the XP-L version, on my CSLNM1.TG C8+ with 7mm bottom hole reflector. I sanded down the lip where the reflector rests on to about 0.5mm and it’s perfect. I could just about spot cattle and cattle herders at 600m away this weekend. I could see them moving on the hill. So I know it really performs well.
My previous gasket attempt was sanded down to about 0.2mm and it was worse. Looks like 0.5-0.6mm is a sweet spot.
Acebeam L18, Armytek Prime C1 Pro, Armytek Prime C2 Pro, Armytek Tiara C1 Pro, Astrolux MF01 Mini, BLF Q8, BLF A6, BLF FW1A, BLF FW3A, BLF FW3C, BLF LT1, Convoy L6, Convoy C8+ , Convoy S3, Emisar D4, Fireflies E07, Jaxman E2L, Manta Ray C8.2 long version, Olight S1R Baton II special edition series, S2R Baton II, Olight Baton 3, Olight Warrior Mini, Olight M2R Pro Warrior.
Most of them have been modded! =)
https://photos.app.goo.gl/JaJaDv4V838AEJf39
Thanks KevinZA1988, I think you answered my question. I went too far.
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
It shows in the hotspot if you are good, the NM1 in a quality smooth reflector (C8 reflectors are usually good) makes a very well defined evenly illuminated hotspot. Slightly off and everything goes assymmetrical and/or fuzzy.
link to djozz tests
Indeed
Acebeam L18, Armytek Prime C1 Pro, Armytek Prime C2 Pro, Armytek Tiara C1 Pro, Astrolux MF01 Mini, BLF Q8, BLF A6, BLF FW1A, BLF FW3A, BLF FW3C, BLF LT1, Convoy L6, Convoy C8+ , Convoy S3, Emisar D4, Fireflies E07, Jaxman E2L, Manta Ray C8.2 long version, Olight S1R Baton II special edition series, S2R Baton II, Olight Baton 3, Olight Warrior Mini, Olight M2R Pro Warrior.
Most of them have been modded! =)
https://photos.app.goo.gl/JaJaDv4V838AEJf39
I see that Mouser now has White 1 and White 2 in stock.
May be slightly cheaper than L4P for those in the USA but unknown bin…
I could of sworn I read earlier in this thread that the new 1mm 4040 CULNM can be reflowed onto a XP mcpcb 3535? Before I attempt another reflow and heat this poor led up for the 3rd time can somone confirm 3535 mcpcb’s works?
Sometimes being a newb is the best part of a hobbie.
M.O.B. I mean C
Here’s the catch: not every 3535 board has the exact same solder pad dimensions. Reflowing 4040 leds works reasonably well on boards with electrical pads that are a bit thinner and thus wider apart. The amount of solder must be fairly precise too, and make sure you position the led very very well!
But yes, confirmed, I succesfully soldered the 4040 CULM on the stock 3535 board of a Micro-GT and have a working flashlight.
link to djozz tests
Nice, awsome and thank you. YOU DA MAN!! So excited, it’s going into a 126mm aspherical lens super short FL, pre lens w/collaniator and a small waiven collar.
Sometimes being a newb is the best part of a hobbie.
M.O.B. I mean C
126mm aspheric? Is this a home made job?
I purchased two of the CULNM1.TG leds a while back from L4P and only today had some free time to reflow one for testing but one of them has this thing that is looking like some defect around the die, is this normal for this led or not? I hope it does not have impact on performance or lifespan of the led.
Olight i3s, Olight S1, Olight S Mini, JetBeam Jet-1, BLF 348, Astrolux S41S, UF SK-98, Convoy S2+ 3*XP-G2, Convoy S2+ 3*XPL, Convoy S2+ 219CT, Convoy M1, Convoy C8, Brinyte B158, Courui D01, Convoy L6, Noctigon M43
I've seen that partial circle "trench" on many white flats1/2, it seems it's from some kind of tool/mold which protects die during pouring "white stuff" over package surface, it shouldn't have any influence on performance.
led4power.com
Ah, it seems like its not a big deal then, cool.
I just threw this led in a C8, driven at only 4.85A, centering was very easy but height of the reflector will be an issue, at the moment i have the same centering gasket i had for the black flat but it turns out this led wants the reflector a bit higher than the black flat, i think that it will need similar height of the reflector as the xp-g2.
Will test all this when it gets dark outside
Olight i3s, Olight S1, Olight S Mini, JetBeam Jet-1, BLF 348, Astrolux S41S, UF SK-98, Convoy S2+ 3*XP-G2, Convoy S2+ 3*XPL, Convoy S2+ 219CT, Convoy M1, Convoy C8, Brinyte B158, Courui D01, Convoy L6, Noctigon M43
It all depends on eachother, the thickness of different Mcpcb’s will differ , which allows more or less space in the head and that will affect the allowable thickness of the spacer and your focus, thus throw.
Focusing my white flat C8 took me more than an hour, but i eventually got it right.
Reaching over 200kCd on a standard Biscotti driver
This was taken before final focusing
Those are some excellent numbers, i hope that i will be able to hit that 200k number.
This C8 has slightly modified head and bezel, the reflector can sit and create enough pressure on the mcpcb without even needing of any type of gasket, before the mods the reflector outer lip was resting on the flashlight head and the reflector was not able to go all the way down, now without that problem i can play with the height of the reflector as much as i want, not looking forward to all that tho
Olight i3s, Olight S1, Olight S Mini, JetBeam Jet-1, BLF 348, Astrolux S41S, UF SK-98, Convoy S2+ 3*XP-G2, Convoy S2+ 3*XPL, Convoy S2+ 219CT, Convoy M1, Convoy C8, Brinyte B158, Courui D01, Convoy L6, Noctigon M43
Yup, not sure what the lens was originally used for. Guessing a big rear projection TV? With a Olsen Flat black at 600 LM it did 2.6 MIll. LUX measured at 9 meters. And heres the kicker,,2.6 mill with out the magical collar.
http://imgur.com/gallery/3dsUjS3
Sometimes being a newb is the best part of a hobbie.
M.O.B. I mean C
My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547
Meanwhile my collar will continue collecting dust until a new flashlight comes out
So you have some new friend called Olsen Flat who is black?
Please avoid fully quoting lenghty posts, namely with nested quotes. Trim quotes down to the essential. Helps with neatness and legibility. Thanks.
The human mind, and its programming, is at the forefront of a particular battle of The Light vs evil dark forces. Nearly every human being on this beautiful planet “Earth” has some sort of negative mind programming in its mind. And you better take care of your mind programming, or someone else will in this wicked world.
Viruses DON'T cause diseases, they rather are a consequence of them. Read the book “Béchamp or Pasteur” by Ethel Hume for more information.
Pages