Vapcell INR18650 K31 3150mah 18A/35A new arrival!!

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d_t_a
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Vapcell, can you check my order?

I ordered 1lot(8pcs) Vapcell K64 from Vapcell/AliExpress store last April 3, 2021.

I was given this tracking number, but later changed to another tracking number: RB635245138TW & RB753931767TW,
but both these tracking numbers do not show any infomation on tracking websites.

Tom E
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Tom E wrote:

move wrote:
@vapcell Dennis Any update on *Samsung50S* or *Vapcell T50* @Tom E, How is K64 if you compere to Vapcell T50 I think you have it too

Hhmm, don't think I have a head to head. Should do one.

Did some simple tests last night, but not long timed testing. Just in initial amps on a FT02S (quad XHP50.2's) w/mods, all cells charged to 4.21V:

Shockli 5500: 22.8A

Vapcell K64: 26.4A

Samsung 40T: 30.5A

Vapcell T50: 31.0A

 

On a MF01 Mini, brass w/mods:

Vapcell K64: 24.1A

Vapcell T50: 27.2A

 

On a HK4S (quad SST-40) w/mods:

Vapcell K64: 21.2A

Shockli 5500: 18.0A

 

So the T50 is much it's superior, but the K64 does well against the Shockli. This is just turn on amps, somewhat indicative of what it can do, but an initial 30 sec test, plus a full timed run would be a better comparison.

 

Funtastic
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Lux-Perpetua wrote:

K64 is not available to order anymore. On TLF I noticed another member reporting that two out of two K64 batteries were dead on arrival with 0.7V and 0.74V. 

After my issue with the Vapcell K30 I’ve been put right off.

120pcs were fine and 39pcs had high self discharge. Charged all 39pcs and after just 5 days some were just 4.12v, a cell from the 120pcs was still sitting at 4.192v.

Very decent performance at a good price so it’s rather disappointing

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Funtastic
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Tom E wrote:
Samsung 40T: 305A

Has that 40T also been modded Silly

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Lux-Perpetua
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Tom E wrote:

(…)

On a MF01 Mini, brass w/mods:

Vapcell K64: 24.1A

Vapcell T50: 37.2A

(…)

37.2 amps? Shocked Jeez…that one must have become pretty hot within a blink of an eye.

Now, I will regret for the rest of my life that I ordered two pieces of the T50, only. Big Smile

Tom E
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Crap!! Will update - rushing at work... Those erroneous quotes will live forever! frownsmile

Yikes! There seems to be lots of bad cells around lately

 

Dennis: Please, if you could, explain a bit of what going on with quality as of late? What's the testing process?

supreme
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I had a sneaking suspicion the K64 would have QC problems. Especially since 1. Vapcell does not own their own factory 2. Nobody else is producing a battery with these specs.

To their credit, it has to be tough to design and manufacture a new high discharge cell with increased capacity.

The F14 doesn’t seem to have the same problems probably because only capacity increased. Probably easier to rework existing technology to increase capacity but not both at the same time (high discharge + increased capacity).

Hopefully the F14 stays around, great for Convoy lights since they can’t pull more than 3A.

XXX-Man
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I ordered some batteries from Vapcell 101 days ago and still not received…last tracking number update was 47 days ago…

And they still want me to wait Angry

“The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom.” - Isaac Asimov

 

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."

 

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Funtastic
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XXX-Man wrote:
I ordered some batteries from Vapcell 101 days ago and still not received…last tracking number update was 47 days ago…

And they still want me to wait Angry

Fair enough if you chose the cheapest shipping option, maybe chose an alternative for a higher cost

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with maukka lights

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XXX-Man
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Funtastic wrote:
Fair enough if you chose the cheapest shipping option, maybe chose an alternative for a higher cost

They don’t offer any alternative for me, only $6 option.

“The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom.” - Isaac Asimov

 

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."

 

My reviews:

Sofirn SF36 /// Thorfire VG10S /// Sofirn C8F /// Zanflare F1

CR888
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Lux-Perpetua wrote:

K64 is not available to order anymore. On TLF I noticed another member reporting that two out of two K64 batteries were dead on arrival with 0.7V and 0.74V. 


Interesting, I had a bunch of Vapecells arrive yesterday 2 of which were K64’s and they were perfectly ‘storage’ charged. 3.76v & 3.84v. I drained one down to 2.8v then charged it and got well over 6k mAh’s like 6250mAh. The vapecelll INR21700 4200mAh cells which are the Mollicel 4200 30A continuous discharge had a clear wrapping over the cells which I thought was clever protecting the contacts. But so far I like those K64 cells and the little 18350’s with 1400mAh tested well (T14), I measured over 1400mah when charging but are only 4A. But to be honest I’ve been pretty happy with Sofirns cells like their 4K/5K 21700 and I have a bunch of their 18650’s which have been decent. Much cheaper too.

CR888

Funtastic
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Having unequal storage voltage shows there’s still a voltage instability problem. Every single Samsung, Panasonic, Sony, and Molicel have been exactly the same voltage across 500+ cells.

Roughly 40 of the 120pcs Vapcell K30 that were okay in my order were a solid 3.71v, the other 80pcs were 3.68v+, and the remaining were even as low as 1.78v (got a refund on 20pcs of the worst)

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with maukka lights

New Zealand store – https://www.piercingthedarkness.co.nz (NZ customers only)

YouTube channel – https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUWi2vYp4CWrRkOJM70t_w/videos (Demos for my customers, and reviews)

Lux-Perpetua
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I guess the best we can do is:

  1. Measure internal resistance (requires some equipment to compare between resting voltage and voltage under load) and compare against other batteries of the same make and model and/or against the datasheet (if there was one available).
  2. Measure internal impedance (requires an impedance meter like Vapcell YR1030/1035 or SM8124A) and compare against other batteries of the same make and model.
  3. Charge the battery to a certain value (maybe "storage voltage" around 3.6V - 3.8V would be best?) and observe any sagging in resting voltage over the course of let's say 14 days or 30 days. Cells of good quality should keep their voltage rocksolidly stable. Those with a quickly dropping voltage may have some issues concerning their electrodes inside but I can only guess.
  4. Batteries below a certain resting voltage (IDK, 3.0V or maybe lower than this) should not be charged at all and considered as defective?

I wonder how safe it is to run lithium-ion batteries with a high self-discharge rate. I know that some chemistries have a rather high self-discharge rate but I only saw these in NiCd or NiMH cells before. A lithium-ion battery is a whole different thing, I guess.

BTW, I have (among other batteries) six K64 batteries incoming. They are probably still en route to Europe or being checked by customs (who knows). I will be happy to carry out steps 2 and 3 and report about their status as soon they have arrived.

supreme
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CR888 wrote:
But so far I like those K64 cells and the little 18350’s with 1400mAh tested well (T14), I measured over 1400mah when charging but are only 4A.

Do you mean F14? I can’t find a T14

Hopefully Vapcell reworks the K64. I don’t need it but I want it.

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Tom E wrote:

Tom E wrote:

move wrote:
vapcell Dennis Any update on *Samsung50S* or *Vapcell T50* Tom E, How is K64 if you compere to Vapcell T50 I think you have it too

Hhmm, don’t think I have a head to head. Should do one.



Did some simple tests last night, but not long timed testing. Just in initial amps on a FT02S (quad XHP50.2’s) w/mods, all cells charged to 4.21V:


Shockli 5500: 22.8A


Vapcell K64: 26.4A


Samsung 40T: 30.5A


Vapcell T50: 31.0A


 


On a MF01 Mini, brass w/mods:


Vapcell K64: 24.1A


Vapcell T50: 27.2A


 


On a HK4S (quad SST-40) w/mods:


Vapcell K64: 21.2A


Shockli 5500: 18.0A


 


So the T50 is much it’s superior, but the K64 does well against the Shockli. This is just turn on amps, somewhat indicative of what it can do, but an initial 30 sec test, plus a full timed run would be a better comparison.


 

Wow the K64 is incredible! Thanks for sharing!

CR888
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supreme wrote:
CR888 wrote:
But so far I like those K64 cells and the little 18350’s with 1400mAh tested well (T14), I measured over 1400mah when charging but are only 4A.

Do you mean F14? I can’t find a T14

Hopefully Vapcell reworks the K64. I don’t need it but I want it.


Yes they’re Green, F14 is right.

CR888

Funtastic
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Lux-Perpetua wrote:

K64 is not available to order anymore. On TLF I noticed another member reporting that two out of two K64 batteries were dead on arrival with 0.7V and 0.74V. 

Any idea where they were purchased?

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Lux-Perpetua
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If I am not mistaken they were bought from Vapcell‘s AliExpress store.

maba
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K64 sucks.. After ~two weeks of non-use have 2.04V and 0.20V!!! Facepalm

Funtastic
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maba wrote:
K64 sucks.. After ~two weeks of non-use have 2.04V and 0.20V!!! Facepalm

Sitting inside or outside a device?

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with maukka lights

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pennzy
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Too bad. I had high hopes for this cell.

Funtastic
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pennzy wrote:
Too bad. I had high hopes for this cell.

It certainly sounded decent, but unstable voltage isn’t good. First on my K30’s and now hearing this, their QC sounds like a real issue at the moment

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maba
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Funtastic wrote:
Sitting inside or outside a device?

Outside
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maba wrote:
Funtastic wrote:
Sitting inside or outside a device?
Outside

Are you able to get a refund?

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maba
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Funtastic wrote:
Are you able to get a refund?

I hope so, but I just opened a dispute Big Smile
Tom E
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Oh boy, might have missed this since I've not been keeping track of usage and level. I'll check mine same way, assuming your non-use means you had them sitting loose, not in a flashlight or charger.

I used mine in testing, not sure when, at least couple days ago. They read 3.92V and 4.18V now, and probably not re-charged after use. Recorded the values and time now - will see how they do over the next week on the shelf.

 

Tom E
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So far after 54 hours, 1 cell no change at 4.18V, the other dropped from 3.92V to 3.71V. Not sure how much usage each got though - wasn't keeping track, but neither got much usage except for high current drain in tests. I'll continue to monitor these 2.

Seems like I may have the same problem maba has above, but for me in just one cell for now.

This is bad news, can't trust these K64's frown. They disappear from the Ali store, and Dennis doesn't respond here or post what's going on at least. 

 

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This is beyond pathetic. I see Dennis has been online several times recently to read and ignore our comments about all the failed cells. So sad that he decided to tuck his tail between his legs and ignore the problem. This has happened at least a few other times with Vapecell, which is why I dont own any of their cells and likely never will.

Don’t forget to file your AliExpress disputes to get your money refunded. If that fails, file a charge-back through your credit card company. Also please leave appropriate negative feedback to warn others. For those who visit similar forums, spread the word so others can avoid this vendor and their disappointing non-existent customer service.

Its alright Dennis… I just did my part on your behalf to allow you to save face and continue hiding your shrunken head in the sand. Maybe you’ll be reincarcerated as a ostrich some day soon, so you can continue doing what comes naturally!

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Tom E wrote:

So far after 54 hours, 1 cell no change at 4.18V, the other dropped from 3.92V to 3.71V. Not sure how much usage each got though – wasn’t keeping track, but neither got much usage except for high current drain in tests. I’ll continue to monitor these 2.


Seems like I may have the same problem maba has above, but for me in just one cell for now.


This is bad news, can’t trust these K64’s frown. They disappear from the Ali store, and Dennis doesn’t respond here or post what’s going on at least. 


 

That doesn’t sound good.

I ordered a few pieces of K64 last April 3. Vapcell/AliExpress gave me a tracking number on April 8. But that tracking number doesn’t give any update at all using multiple tracking sites (17track, postal.ninja, track24, etc. sites) It’s been over 1 month since those K64 have been shipped out, so if they’ll discharge to low voltage, in case I receive the package, then several of them may have self-discharged to low voltages…

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Unless you have the ability to test your batteries, I would only buy from a trusted retailer/supplier for now. There’s only 1 US retailer I would buy Vapcells from because they perform their own QC and their QC is at a higher standard than Vapcells. I bought the F14 from them. I don’t have a need for the K64 unless I buy another flashlight and I don’t really want to.

Sad state of affairs.

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