Trustfire TR-J12 measurements (5 x XM-L)

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2100
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Update for benckie

I even got a customer service email to ask if the order is correct and everything is working in order. Great!

hugob
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Hi 2100,

Is the Tr-J12 a flooder or thrower??

2100
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Hi Hugob,

The TR-J12 has a somewhat floody beam with its pretty big hotspot, but in that bit hotspot there is a lot of light hence it also throws pretty ok.  For example, if you compare this to the Fenix TK35, this one would have a slightly brighter hotspot of about 20% more intensity.

hugob
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Thanks 2100, cannot wait I also order one from Manafont, hope so see it around 20 - 25 January...

Kokopelli
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I also got mine from the same seller. Left a positive feedback on that page to. Mine doesn't have a plastic cover or a brass piece on the driver, though. Didn't matter for me so its as good as 2100s. I measured something like 2.2A with 3x18650 at 4.1V. Not bad I guess. Definitely brighter than my 3xXML I got recently. Tailstands perfectly. It will be a great ceiling bounce worklight for my dark, confined parking space. 

oatmanutd
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I think you need some good batteries for this light.

JohnnyMac
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If I am understanding this correctly, if 4A is going to the LED's, then each LED is only seeing 800mA for about 300 lumen each.  All together the torch is putting out about 1500 lumen and that seems to match the numbers you are coming up with in your tests.  This light is remarkably underdriven.

How much room is in the pill for a different driver?  If you could put a 10A SST90 driver in it running the LEDs in parallel you could easily have it pumping out over 3000 lumen OTF.  Of course I would only run such a beast on 3*26650 cells.

Kokopelli
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I guess it is more like 4.1 cell voltage x 3 cells x 2.2 amperes x .90 efficiency / 5 LEDs / 3.4 Vf = 1.42 A per led in my measurement. Makes over 500 lumens per emitter easily.
ergotelis
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Guys, just got mine. First comments:

The bad ones, Silly PWM,silly disco modes, i don't like the button in the back, wish it was on the side. no UCL, can't find either one!

The good ones, excellent quality for the money and for a trustfire, too many battery configs available, good heatsink design,excellent square threads, generally nice design.

As for performance, see everything else and last one the trustfire:

 

 

OTF lumen, white empty room, 30sec measurements:

 

Itp xp-g S2 eos A3: 67 lumen

Fenix LD15: 96 lumen

Zebralight H51: 155 lumen

Olight i1 eos(cr123): 242 lumen

Nitecore ife2: 256 lumen

Jetbeam BC20(17670): 266 lumen

Zebralight SC60: 288 lumen

Armytek Predator: 343 lumen

Olight Baton S35: 382 lumen

Defier XT: 500 lumen

Defier X3: 600 lumen

Thrunite Catapult V2 XM-L: 740 lumen

Eagletac M3C4: 780 lumen

Fenix TK60: 790 lumen

Fenix TK35: 860 lumen

Trustfire 3*T6: 1470 lumen

Skyray 3*T6: 1610 lumen

Fenix TK70: 2290 lumen

Trustfire TR-J12: 2386 lumen! WTF?????? (was a bit more and dropped@30sec!)

My new lumen leader! I posted the others for comparison, to show how other flashlights perform in the same test method. Trustfire tested on 3 AW 2900, 2,17amp draw. Are you kidding me? I will redo and redo the test to be sure, but this is sick, what can i do more?

The flashlight starts@1sec@ 2430 lumen and gradually falls. Middle level is 1460 lumen and the lowest 310.

ergotelis
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Well to be honest i don't know why am i getting so high measurements. I don't know if there is anything wrong, but the readings on it are really really high. 2386 OTF means 477 per emitter, which is really high for about 1,5amp@emitter, Armytek predator gives 1,5amp to the emitter,with UCL and with a good xm-l U2 i got ~473 lumen OTF.
Almost all of the other measurements i have posted, agree with what others have posted too, except very few. What if i had a UCL? i would be over 2500 OTF???? THis is sick!!!
(The UCL from M3x does not fit, needs 1mm less.)
Something more, my sample came from Kaidomain.
xed888
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Well maybe we can do a group buy of UCL lenses (kinda like what mitro wanted to do) Big Smile

 

And i hope all production models are the same cause im getting mine from MF.

ergotelis
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xed888 wrote:

Well maybe we can do a group buy of UCL lenses (kinda like what mitro wanted to do) Big Smile

Good idea!!!! I will talk to flashlightlens! The same lens would fit the Fandyfire STL V2 thrower, the M3X copy. Should i open an interest thread?

xed888
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Depending on price, I would be interested! and Im sure 2100 will be to

 

ergotelis
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Sent them an email regarding quantity they need and price they offer.

Pok
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IMO TR-J12 lens looks like coated glass lens (compared with my flashlights e.g.M2XC4 ), It's clearly than stock lens from many flashlights

From MF : Lens: Vacuum Plated Coated Glass Lens <<< ???

xed888
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Pok wrote:
IMO TR-J12 lens looks like UCL (compared with my flashlights e.g.M2XC4 ), It's clearly than stock lens from many flashlights From MF : Lens: Vacuum Plated Coated Glass Lens <<< ???

Good point: How can we tell UCL from other lenses? Any ideas?

ergotelis
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The glass is not UCL. Just confirmed this. Did some tests, did not measure output directly, just measured the difference in performance between no lens, stock lens, and a 73mm ucl. Then added the difference to the first 2386 lumen reading. It is being done in this way, because the bezel has some loss too.

So, here, with the bezel hypothetically on:

             Stock glass: 2386 lumen

               UCL lens:    2471 lumen

                 no lens:    2507 lumen

Here, with the bezel off:

Stock glass: 2444 lumen

    no glass: 2570 lumen

 UCL glass:  2532 lumen

xed888
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ergotelis wrote:

The glass is not UCL. Just confirmed this. Did some tests, did not measure output directly, just measured the difference in performance between no lens, stock lens, and a 73mm ucl. Then added the difference to the first 2386 lumen reading. It is being done in this way, because the bezel has some loss too. If i don't have to take into account the bezel, just only reflector and thermal losses, the real output of the flashlight is 2580 lumen.

So, here: Stock glass: 2386 lumen

               UCL lens:    2471 lumen

                 no lens:    2507 lumen

Glad you did the test! But is it worth getting UCL for ca. 90 lumens extra?

Pok
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Sorry I mean Coated glass lens not UCL lens :bigsmile:

fnsooner
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I just got mine and loaded it with 4Sevens 4000mah 26650s. I am very impressed.

I am also interested in a UCL lens.

ergotelis
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xed888 wrote:

Glad you did the test! But is it worth getting UCL for ca. 90 lumens extra?

 

It depends on the price and there is another matter: The stock glass,because it is not that transparent, it might create a like diffuser phenomenon. THe stock glass may have higher loss in lux readings than the loss in total lumen, in comparison to a UCL. I will try later to measure the difference in Lux. If the difference is higher than in lumen, then i would definitely suggest you to buy one. Except if the total price is really high, then in that case it might not be worth!

fnsooner
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I am interested in having a spare lens. If it is UCL, then all the better.

mitro
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Wow... that a lot of lumens. Smile  I have a hard time convincing myself that 1400+ lumens can be a "medium". LOL

I agree on the tail switch. A side switch would have moved this light up a notch on the must-have list. Unfortunately that PWM knocks it way down the list. What do we have for driver options? As good as this light is, I can't tolerate the PWM. I would love to use med and low, but it makes my head spin.

Thanks for the report ergo. Smile

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ergotelis wrote:
It depends on the price and there is another matter: The stock glass,because it is not that transparent, it might create a like diffuser phenomenon. THe stock glass may have higher loss in lux readings than the loss in total lumen, in comparison to a UCL. I will try later to measure the difference in Lux. If the difference is higher than in lumen, then i would definitely suggest you to buy one. Except if the total price is really high, then in that case it might not be worth!

This is one reason why coated AR glass is commonly used in multi-element lenses in the photo/video realm over un-coated UCL.

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

War Dogs, Making it Home - Rescue Dogs for Returning Vets

xed888
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eagerly waiting your report, ergotelis Smile

 

oh and as a side note: Any one wanna buy my Trustfire 3T6? Big Smile

2100
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JohnnyMac wrote:

If I am understanding this correctly, if 4A is going to the LED's, then each LED is only seeing 800mA for about 300 lumen each.  All together the torch is putting out about 1500 lumen and that seems to match the numbers you are coming up with in your tests.  This light is remarkably underdriven.

If this TR-J12 light is remarkably underdriven to 1500 lumens, then all my other lights are also remarkably underdriven.  Smile   (stuff like T40CS/M3X/V60C/TK70)

Actually, the current doesn't matter, note that i rarely put any amperes or what nowadays. What we look at is not only the lumens, but the OTF lumens. That is number 1.  Number 2 is the candelas.  Number 3 which folks might be interested in is heatsinking ability.  That would be 48 deg C in 12 mins  (28 deg C ambient), sag of 6.1%.  This is very good.  However this is beaten by the XTAR S1 (triple XM-L) which has literally the same output.  It takes 24 mins to hit 49 deg C.

 

The tailcap amps only come in when i want to calculate the runtime for a certain set of battery (such a big range for this light, from 2200-4500mAh), and even then it is a guesstimate because this is fully regulated so it would vary according to cell discharge.

 

Oh...forgot that i should put a figure on this light.  This is about 2200 lumens OTF.

 

You are technically correct that this light is underdriven, because the potential is that this light can hit 4000 lumens OTF.   Someone needs to do up a 5X DRY.  But the thing is this is no XTAR S1, at 4000 lumens OTF this 62mm HD light would run pretty hot at time 1 minute point. Same as the DRY.  Folks would say that that's what the medium is for....yep they are correct, but this is no SWM or Fenix, 124Hz PWM is no fun.

2100
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ergotelis wrote:

Fenix TK70: 2290 lumen

Trustfire TR-J12: 2386 lumen! WTF?????? (was a bit more and dropped@30sec!)

Bro, was there any doubt in the first place?  LOL!  Sealed (the others can check out my first post again).

Your TK70 seems a little high but that's no problem at all, we all believe in relative figures.  As you can see, your TR-J12 is 4.1% brighter than TK70, and my TR-J12 is 3.2%. brighter.   To be honest, my TK70 is getting 218 lux bounce (but i rounded it up to 220) and TR-J12 is 225 lux bounce.

 

I mean, we all should be conservative.  2200 lumens OTF / Out The Front is very belivable and achieavable.

2100
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mitro wrote:

Thanks for the report ergo. Smile

Thanks to ergo as well.

So, what's the next step.  8x XM-L?

PS.  The TR-J12's middle is about 1300-1400 lumens OTF thereabouts.  Over here it is practically neck-to-neck with the Trustfire TR-3T6 on max.

PPS.  5% cut in the glass is pretty decent, same as most other budgetlights. But for my XTAR S1, that one cut 10%.  Hence that is why i purchased 2 x 72.6mm UCLs to change.

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2100
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Ok new measurement. This cell regulates by boosting to a certain point and then goes into direct drive, so it shifts into a lower output.  After that even in low mode it manages to trip the cell's protection circuit.    I got about 4.6V at the tail (2.3V per cell) before the PCB cuts.  I have TF Flames unprotected but it's not really needed as i guess it'd just run the cell down to 0V.  

So this light easily digs the cells to below 2.5V.  Just another of the lights in which it really uses everything in the cell.  (most of my lights have low voltage cut offs way below 2.8V per cell).  So yet another example in which testing cell discharges to below 3.0V is needed.

So it's the same behaviour as the TR-3T6.  Not the Sky Ray's hard cut-off.

 

Double confirmed - it can run on 1 x 18650 @ 3.9V, there is still light.

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