Lumintop FW21 Pro (10,000 lumen) vs Nightwatch NSX3 (9,900 lumen)

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BurningPlayd0h
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The decent/honest manufacturers often list a estimated time until stepdown + output after stepdown on their FL1 runtime charts. Even the FL1 standard has it’s own issues though, like how Maglite games it to massively inflate their runtime numbers without making any mention of the huge stepdowns.

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mizou51 wrote:
What a strange race we are facing in 2019/2020….the more lumens possible in a lowest possible time ?
It started with imalent flashlights 3 years ago…

i would like to see a small light that can sustain 3000lm for 10min.





Sorry for my poor english.

Sunnysunsun
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I found the answer: not the FW21 PRO. Cooked the domes and phosphor off
I was tempted before, but no longer

Rockenrooster
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Oh wow!!!!
FYI 1st thing I did after turning the light on was configure the Thermal limit and calibrate the temp sensors. Set the limit to 40C. By default it’s set to 45 I think and it thought the ambient temp was sub 15C (room temp around 22C).
I could see how it could cook itself at default settings… Good thing I like messing with settings lol

Also, another thing I noticed is that the temp sensor doesn’t update the readings often enough for this light.
Toykeeper mentioned that it updates every 6-7 seconds, which is fine for running Turbo from a “cold” start. But if you turn it back to turbo after it steps down, it will stay at turbo for at least 6-7 seconds before it starts stepping down gradually again, rinse repeat and now you have a dead light…

This light needs a temp sensor that is more “realtime” that updates every second and more aggressively steps down depending on how much over the limit it is

Scallywag
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I wonder where the BLF Q8 lands for sustained output (and then, modded with 50.2s, what it can sustain)? Or lights like Convoy L6/Sofirn SP70

Rockenrooster
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I know for sure that my convoy L6 can stay on turbo indefinitely, it doesn’t get that warm….

icpart
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mizou51 wrote:
What a strange race we are facing in 2019/2020….the more lumens possible in a lowest possible time ?
It started with imalent flashlights 3 years ago…

i would like to see a small light that can sustain 3000lm for 10min.


For that reason I decide to order SST40 variant of Nightwatch with 5k lumens because want turbo for longer times and its have better heat dissipation design compared to FW21Pro.
DHart
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I have a stock FW21 Pro. Does anyone know what the color temp is with the XHP50.2 emitters in this? 5000k? Or 6500k?

The color temp is ok for me, but my only quibble with the XHP50.2 is the green corona around the hotspot is a little irksome, though it isn’t terribly bothersome – generally only noticeable when white wall hunting. But I do appreciate minor improvements, when I can get them.

Is there another emitter option, to mod this light with, to get rid of the green corona, but still retain reasonably high, cool white, lumen levels? Would XP-L emitters work well in place of the XHP50.2 emitters?

I don’t care if I can’t hit 10,000 lumens on turbo. For the most part, I would use the light within the ramp range, only using turbo very briefly on occasion.

icpart
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Probably 6500K is original FW21Pro emitters. 5000K version of XHP50.2 are difficult to find and manufactured only by special order. Good replacement for XHP50.2 is SST40.

mortuus
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why not XHP70.2 ? they exist in neutral and warm white tints…

...where Frugal meets with Flashlight!

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DHart
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I’ve read that the SST40 has a greenish tint shift at med to low levels?

DHart
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mortuus wrote:
why not XHP70.2 ? they exist in neutral and warm white tints…

Good question! Do these have a greenish corona around the central beam, as the XHP50.2 does?

If not, I’m sure I’d be thrilled with moving to XHP70.2 in neutral tint.

mortuus
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DHart wrote:
mortuus wrote:
why not XHP70.2 ? they exist in neutral and warm white tints…

Good question! Do these have a greenish corona around the central beam, as the XHP50.2 does?

If not, I’m sure I’d be thrilled with moving to XHP70.2 in neutral tint.

No idea, i dont own any light with that emitter sadly.. but i just placed order for the FW21 from neals.. need this light haha Big Smile

...where Frugal meets with Flashlight!

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ch1ir
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What is the best battery for this light (NightwatchNSX3) for Max output? Samsung 30t? 40t? Button top, flat top, both?

I have a sofirn 21700 40a
and an ijoy 20700 40a

I don’t know if they are enough to do the job. Thanks for the input!

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

Rockenrooster
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ch1ir wrote:
What is the best battery for this light (NightwatchNSX3) for Max output? Samsung 30t? 40t? Button top, flat top, both?

I have a sofirn 21700 40a
and an ijoy 20700 40a

I don’t know if they are enough to do the job. Thanks for the input!

Max output bar none: Samsung 30T
Best all around 21700: Molicel P42a and/or Samsung 40T

I have 2 molicells and 2 40Ts.
I’ll see if I can do a full charge output test

I don’t think the type of top matters unless you arent getting contact…

ch1ir
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Rockenrooster wrote:
ch1ir wrote:
What is the best battery for this light (NightwatchNSX3) for Max output? Samsung 30t? 40t? Button top, flat top, both?

I have a sofirn 21700 40a
and an ijoy 20700 40a

I don’t know if they are enough to do the job. Thanks for the input!

Max output bar none: Samsung 30T
Best all around 21700: Molicel P42a and/or Samsung 40T

I have 2 molicells and 2 40Ts.
I’ll see if I can do a full charge output test

I don’t think the type of top matters unless you arent getting contact…

do you have a suggestion on where to buy in the states

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

Rockenrooster
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Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

ch1ir
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Rockenrooster wrote:
Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

Thank you!
Is there any harm is trying the ijoy or the sofirn? They are both rated at 40 max amps

Link to ijoy I have
https://www.elementvape.com/ijoy-20700-3000mah-40a-battery

I appreciate your help!

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

Rockenrooster
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ch1ir wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

Thank you!
Is there any harm is trying the ijoy or the sofirn? They are both rated at 40 max amps

Link to ijoy I have
https://www.elementvape.com/ijoy-20700-3000mah-40a-battery

I appreciate your help!

No harm, you might not even be able to “see” the difference.

DHart
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ch1ir wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

Thank you!
Is there any harm is trying the ijoy or the sofirn? They are both rated at 40 max amps

Link to ijoy I have
https://www.elementvape.com/ijoy-20700-3000mah-40a-battery

I appreciate your help!

40 amps is plenty – IF you can trust the rating.

ch1ir
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Rockenrooster wrote:
ch1ir wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

Thank you!
Is there any harm is trying the ijoy or the sofirn? They are both rated at 40 max amps

Link to ijoy I have
https://www.elementvape.com/ijoy-20700-3000mah-40a-battery

I appreciate your help!

No harm, you might not even be able to “see” the difference.

I just didn’t know if there was any chance of harming the battery or light I’m still noob

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

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Rockenrooster wrote:
ch1ir wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

Thank you!
Is there any harm is trying the ijoy or the sofirn? They are both rated at 40 max amps

Link to ijoy I have
https://www.elementvape.com/ijoy-20700-3000mah-40a-battery

I appreciate your help!

No harm, you might not even be able to “see” the difference.

This is incorrect. Those are fake rating and usually top out at 15 amps or so

ch1ir
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
ch1ir wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
Flat top.
Imrbatteries.com is where I bought mine.

Thank you!
Is there any harm is trying the ijoy or the sofirn? They are both rated at 40 max amps

Link to ijoy I have
https://www.elementvape.com/ijoy-20700-3000mah-40a-battery

I appreciate your help!

No harm, you might not even be able to “see” the difference.

This is incorrect. Those are fake rating and usually top out at 15 amps or so

Well damn, I guess it Samsung 40T time

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

mortuus
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40T is the best battery if u want decent runtimes and plenty of amps to run this kind of lights.

...where Frugal meets with Flashlight!

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Rockenrooster
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Ok I just tested my fully charged 40T against one of my Molicell P42a in my FW21 Pro (turbo of course).
My homemade lux meter box results (highest @ turn on using):
P42a: ~16,600 lux
40T: ~13,800 lux
(Note that these results are relative to me only)
I am not able to detect a visual difference in regular usage (dark room or outside), but the difference is measurable with a meter.

I’ve decided to reserve my Molicells for my FW21 Pro and use the 40Ts when I get my E07.

raccoon city
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mortuus wrote:

40T is the best battery if u want decent runtimes and plenty of amps to run this kind of lights.

In my research, I prefer the Molicel INR-21700-P42A, which is pretty similar to the 40T.

I haven't bought any 21700 cells yet, however.

ch1ir
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Rockenrooster wrote:
Ok I just tested my fully charged 40T against one of my Molicell P42a in my FW21 Pro (turbo of course).
My homemade lux meter box results (highest @ turn on using):
P42a: ~16,600 lux
40T: ~13,800 lux
(Note that these results are relative to me only)
I am not able to detect a visual difference in regular usage (dark room or outside), but the difference is measurable with a meter.

I’ve decided to reserve my Molicells for my FW21 Pro and use the 40Ts when I get my E07.


Thanks man! I grabbed a 30t and a 42a, I reckon I’m covered. Now to wait and see who arrives first!

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

Rockenrooster
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Sunnysunsun wrote:

This is incorrect. Those are fake rating and usually top out at 15 amps or so

Incorrect in the rated mah and amps? Or incorrect in saying that they would work?

Because, They would technically work, but depending on the quality of the cells, you just won’t be using the full potential of the flashlight. And the voltage would sag more and maybe trip the LVC and step down sooner.
Also, I am able to use super old 18650s from old laptop batteries just fine in a FW21 Pro, I just can’t use Turbo mode at all, because it instantly trips LVC.

It’s my understanding that the drivers in these flashlights don’t “force” X amount of amps regardless of battery, they “ask” and then the battery gives what it can provide (depending on internal resistance, the lower the better).

In any case IMR/INR cells are better with the 30T for “max amps/output regardless of runtime”, P42a and 40T for “all around Amperage/Output and Runtime” (with the Molicell slightly better in my testing).

ICR cells will work (samsung 50E), but voltage will sag a lot and won’t provide maximum ouput like IMR/INR batteries can, but they will last much longer in all modes besides turbo.

Considering my personal experience I would first go for Molicel P42a, if those aren’t available, then Samsung 40T. I don’t really see the point of the 30T as it has much lower capacity with only marginally better output only when fully charged.

Go check Mooch’s and HKJ’s battery reviews, They are well respected by flashlight/vape enthusiasts and agrees that 30T is for “max output” and the Molicell P42a is slightly better than the 40T.
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/threads/bench-retest-results-molicel-p...
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/66004

Sunnysunsun
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Rockenrooster wrote:
Sunnysunsun wrote:

This is incorrect. Those are fake rating and usually top out at 15 amps or so

Incorrect in the rated mah and amps? Or incorrect in saying that they would work?

Because, They would technically work, but depending on the quality of the cells, you just won’t be using the full potential of the flashlight. And the voltage would sag more and maybe trip the LVC and step down sooner.
Also, I am able to use super old 18650s from old laptop batteries just fine in a FW21 Pro, I just can’t use Turbo mode at all, because it instantly trips LVC.

It’s my understanding that the drivers in these flashlights don’t “force” X amount of amps regardless of battery, they “ask” and then the battery gives what it can provide (depending on internal resistance, the lower the better).

In any case IMR/INR cells are better with the 30T for “max amps/output regardless of runtime”, P42a and 40T for “all around Amperage/Output and Runtime” (with the Molicell slightly better in my testing).

ICR cells will work (samsung 50E), but voltage will sag a lot and won’t provide maximum ouput like IMR/INR batteries can, but they will last much longer in all modes besides turbo.

Considering my personal experience I would first go for Molicel P42a, if those aren’t available, then Samsung 40T. I don’t really see the point of the 30T as it has much lower capacity with only marginally better output only when fully charged.

Go check Mooch’s and HKJ’s battery reviews, They are well respected by flashlight/vape enthusiasts and agrees that 30T is for “max output” and the Molicell P42a is slightly better than the 40T.
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/threads/bench-retest-results-molicel-p...
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/66004

I’m saying sofirn and ijoy cells have a 40A manufacturer’s discharge rating but when tested are only good for 15 or so amp discharging. It’s outright fraud.

The P42A is the best high discharge+capacity 21700, with the 30T being the absolute high drain cell with the trade off being capacity.

40T would be an alternative for the P42A if they’re not available or too expensive.

ch1ir
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
Rockenrooster wrote:
Sunnysunsun wrote:

This is incorrect. Those are fake rating and usually top out at 15 amps or so

Incorrect in the rated mah and amps? Or incorrect in saying that they would work?

Because, They would technically work, but depending on the quality of the cells, you just won’t be using the full potential of the flashlight. And the voltage would sag more and maybe trip the LVC and step down sooner.
Also, I am able to use super old 18650s from old laptop batteries just fine in a FW21 Pro, I just can’t use Turbo mode at all, because it instantly trips LVC.

It’s my understanding that the drivers in these flashlights don’t “force” X amount of amps regardless of battery, they “ask” and then the battery gives what it can provide (depending on internal resistance, the lower the better).

In any case IMR/INR cells are better with the 30T for “max amps/output regardless of runtime”, P42a and 40T for “all around Amperage/Output and Runtime” (with the Molicell slightly better in my testing).

ICR cells will work (samsung 50E), but voltage will sag a lot and won’t provide maximum ouput like IMR/INR batteries can, but they will last much longer in all modes besides turbo.

Considering my personal experience I would first go for Molicel P42a, if those aren’t available, then Samsung 40T. I don’t really see the point of the 30T as it has much lower capacity with only marginally better output only when fully charged.

Go check Mooch’s and HKJ’s battery reviews, They are well respected by flashlight/vape enthusiasts and agrees that 30T is for “max output” and the Molicell P42a is slightly better than the 40T.
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/threads/bench-retest-results-molicel-p...
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/66004

I’m saying sofirn and ijoy cells have a 40A manufacturer’s discharge rating but when tested are only good for 15 or so amp discharging. It’s outright fraud.

The P42A is the best high discharge+capacity 21700, with the 30T being the absolute high drain cell with the trade off being capacity.

40T would be an alternative for the P42A if they’re not available or too expensive.


I appreciate you guys taking time out for me to make the safest/best choice

Emisar D⁴, Astrolux C8, BLF A6, Sofirn sp36aV2, Reylight Mini Pineapple, BLF 348 KillZone, Lumintop IYP07, Emisar D18, Boruit D10, Manker e01, Ultrafire z1, Massdrop titanium AAA, Astrolux HL01, Armytek Wizard Pro Nichia, Tacklife LFL3A, Astrolux FT03, Zanflair T1

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