[Concept] The Ultimate Dual E-Switch UI

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Lux-Perpetua
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[Concept] The Ultimate Dual E-Switch UI

Hello everyone,

As some of you may have noticed, I am very much interested in multi-emitter flashlights using different LEDs. For instance, flashlights like Wurkkos WK30 using white, red and ultraviolet light or Sofirn's IF25 using SST20 2.700K and 6.500K for tint ramping or Acebeam's X10 using 1x XHP35 HI for throw and 9x LH351D for flood light. Most of these lights have something in common: With more complexity of utilizing different emitters a single switch somehow limits the manufacturer to offer a convenient and comprehensible user interface. I tried different approaches like...

  • electronic side-switch + mechanical tail-switch
  • magnetic ring + mechanical tail-switch

They all have their downsides. In the end, the sexiest and most anticipated solution might be using two electronic side switches just like Fenix is doing for years already. Unfortunately, Fenix's UI is not something I would recommend, wasting so much potential of having two switches in place. I talked to ToyKeeper if Andúril can somehow be made compatible with two e-switches but that is not the case. After all, I racked my brains to designing a new UI that reflects the most desired features but remains as simple as possible. This new UI should also fit to a whole series of new flashlights, so consistency throughout different models is a key point as well.

 

Please have a look at two examples I want to present here. Feel free to express your thoughts and I will try my best to improve this UI. I have talked to some manufacturers already and it seems there's a serious interest in such a design concept. Smile

Thanks a lot!

Cheers,

Thomas

 

Example #1

 

 

Example #2

 

Edited by: Lux-Perpetua on 10/07/2020 - 07:02
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thefreeman
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So basically it’s a classic one switch UI with extra functions moved to a second button : led change, tint ramping, bat check, lockout etc..

I like this because it the main UI is familiar, this is just a classic ramped/stepped UI like baton, thrunite, Unicorn, Anduril.

For the main switch UI I would prefer to be able to ramp up from moonlight. I also like the ability to have a permanent memory for the level at which the light turns ON, like with Anduril, something that is usually lakcing from manufacturers who just propose last mode memory.

For the functions mode UI, I don’t have much to say, but with the second example I would suggest to be able to be able to ramp between 2700K and red, this would allows to get warmer than 2700K, In practice I would see that during ramping to warm the ramp would pause at 2700k (and maybe blink) and if the button is still held then it would continue ramping to red.
Personnaly this would make the red led usefull, as I find red on its own to be completly useless.

Toykeeper could make this as an 2 button Anduril UI.

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Robin Dobbie wrote:
[...] I think on my regular walking light, I'd like a second button for instantaneous 100% maximum momentary turbo.

Momentary turbo is something I would also like to use but I am not sure how it could be implemented in a useful way. Maybe Click + Hold? But then again, there's a risk that it is being triggered accidentally.

Quote:
Or maybe just have it stay on, but be brought back to normal levels by pressing the first button. Also maybe a click combination that would smoothly dim turbo back to sustainable levels so I don't blind myself.

Actually, a doubleclick from Turbo will always take you back from where you started. I think that's a good compromise. Smile

Quote:
For a light with multiple color temps or functions I dunno, maybe a third button. I just like the idea of a panic, all hands on deck brightness "defense" mode button.

I see what you mean. Wink But we need to be careful thinking about too many features. A third button is an option for sure - Fenix has a light with three side switches. But for smaller lights using one battery only a third switch would make things difficult.

 

thefreeman wrote:
[...] For the main switch UI I would prefer to be able to ramp up from moonlight.

That is part of the plan. When ramping mode is being used, brightness should be adjustable between the lowest firefly submode (e.g. 0.05lm) to turbo mode. The stepped mode UI however should have dedicated brightness steps of Low - Medium - High, only. Moonlight/Firefly would still be available from OFF by holding the switch button. I have adopted some goods ideas from Manker's UI here, choosing from multiple Firefly modes.

Quote:
I also like the ability to have a permanent memory for the level at which the light turns ON, like with Anduril, something that is usually lakcing from manufacturers who just propose last mode memory.

Do you mean a fixed level that is being used when power was interrupted and restored again, e.g. physical lockout or battery replacement? That's a valid point, I agree.

Quote:
For the functions mode UI, I don’t have much to say, but with the second example I would suggest to be able to be able to ramp between 2700K and red, this would allows to get warmer than 2700K, In practice I would see that during ramping to warm the ramp would pause at 2700k (and maybe blink) and if the button is still held then it would continue ramping to red. Personnaly this would make the red led usefull, as I find red on its own to be completly useless.

So, you are asking for mixing 2.700K and red light all together in order to make the beam appear warmer, correct? Well, that might work nicely with some flashlights using a frosted/microlensed optic or glas lens but it will not work in all cases. In my example #2 from above it would require the TIR optic to be at least medium-frosted as otherwise you would propably get a red-tinted hotspot with a warmwhite corona. I don't think that (deep) red only is useless as it would have its purpose for not attracting any insects or in order to maintain a certain degree of night vision capability. Anyway, I am not committed to a red LED here. The UI should leave enough room for ultimate flexibility (e.g. using a throw LED in the center and flood light around it).

Quote:
Toykeeper could make this as an 2 button Anduril UI.

No, I asked her already. She said that there was no plan to let Andúril work with two e-switches (triggering different functions). That's why I stepped up with this individual approach.

 

thefreeman
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Lux-Perpetua wrote:

 

thefreeman wrote:
[...] For the main switch UI I would prefer to be able to ramp up from moonlight.

That is part of the plan. When ramping mode is being used, brightness should be adjustable between the lowest firefly submode (e.g. 0.05lm) to turbo mode. The stepped mode UI however should have dedicated brightness steps of Low - Medium - High, only. Moonlight/Firefly would still be available from OFF by holding the switch button.

Sorry what I meant by ramping is for both stepped and stepless mode, so being able to cycle from moonlight to the main levels.

 

Quote:

Do you mean a fixed level that is being used when power was interrupted and restored again, e.g. physical lockout or battery replacement? That's a valid point, I agree.

Here is the description of Anduril’s manual memory :

The "automatic" vs "manual" memory modes change the level the light goes 
to with 1 click from off.  In automatic mode, it uses the last 
brightness the user ramped to.  In manual mode, it uses the brightness 
the user explicitly saved with 5 clicks.

Personnaly I prefer a light that always turns on at a mid level, so I like anduril manual memory as I can set this level at which the light turns ON.

 

Quote:

So, you are asking for mixing 2.700K and red light all together in order to make the beam appear warmer, correct? Well, that might work nicely with some flashlights using a frosted/microlensed optic or glas lens but it will not work in all cases. In my example #2 from above it would require the TIR optic to be at least medium-frosted as otherwise you would propably get a red-tinted hotspot with a warmwhite corona. I don't think that (deep) red only is useless as it would have its purpose for not attracting any insects or in order to maintain a certain degree of night vision capability. The manufacturer could also exchange the colored LED by a dedicated thrower LED like Osram's CULNM1.TG. There are many options and my two examples are just a small selection.

 

Ah yes I didn’t think about potentially different beam profile. Well scratch that.

Quote:

No, I asked her already. She said that there was no plan to let Andúril work with two e-switches (triggering different functions). That's why I stepped up with this individual approach.

 

 

As far as I undertood what she said is that a two switch UI would not be integrated into Anduril, which makes complete sense, it’s a one button UI. What I meant here is that your proposed UI being very close to a classic stepped and stepless UI with extra functions moved to a second switch, Anduril could be adapted to this 2 button UI, named ”Anduril 2 buttons” or something else.

AEDe
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For tint change I would prefer something like scroll bar. Ideal flashlight for me also would has flood/throw ramping). So it need 1 main buttons, 2 “scrollbars” and additional button for auxiliary leds(red, uv and so on)

id30209
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I certainly like Example 1 and upcoming WK30 with this option (i hope)

WTB Titanium 4sevens 2xAA tube

Tom E
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I've been wanting a custom dual switch for a long time as well. Realistically I don't think there's one solution but several configurations that would be preferred - it's all a matter of what action you want to prioritize for the 2nd button. Therefore, the best solution is custom configuration settings to assign what you want where.

The FSM/Anduril support for the more advanced MCU's with more program space and I/O pins is finally here now and makes the ideal core of the driver to support dual, or even more, e-switches. Dual dual on-state switch support is even possible.