LED FOR SURGICAL GLASSES

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luce1912
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LED FOR SURGICAL GLASSES

Hi, I'd try to create a good LED lighting system for my surgical glasses

My goal is to create a LED similar to the top of the range, there is a few links here to understand its characteristics:

 

1) https://www.orascoptic.com/products/headlights/spark

2) https://www.zeiss.com/meditec/us/products/neurosurgery/loupes/eyemag-light.html#technical-data

3) https://www.univet.it/en/product/eos-wireless/

 

These instead are images of one of these disassembled LED systems:

https://bb.co/album/wms8xj

 

I bought a LED spotlight from Aliexpres, whose base structure is good but I would like to strengthen it because the LED, which seems to me to be 12 mm, is not too strong, maybe it's a CREE XP-G2.

Spotlight structure:

 

Battery in my possession with 3W intensity adjustment (fundamental there is the intensity adjustment)

 

 

 

This is the light that makes me, with a spot with a perfect circle and the right size, a little greater than an open mouth:

First of all to upgrade this led system, I bought a Samsung LH315D with 5700K and 90 CRI with a 10mm MCPCB, hoping to be able to fit it into the 12mm Cree housing.

From what I understand, it should improve but not by much, so I would like to understand what I can change again, from what I know I should change now:

- the lens
- battery driver

Is it easy or is it complicated?
Would I have much better results similar to the led systems of leading companies, or would it change little?

If anyone knew how to guide me in this choice by advising me what to buy I would be grateful. Thank you

Edited by: luce1912 on 04/24/2021 - 13:34
luce1912
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if anyone want more photos, i will be happy to send them, thanks everyone

Sunnysunsun
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If those are photos of the light on, the beam pattern looks good and you’ll just need to change the driver. Is the light’s brightness controlled by the battery pack? The driver will probably be in there.

It sounds like you’re a bit out of your depth and there probably won’t be any off the shelf parts that will work and be an exact fit. I do recommend sending what you have now to a blf member who lives nearby and is familiar with modding for them to mod it for you.
luce1912
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
If those are photos of the light on, the beam pattern looks good and you’ll just need to change the driver. Is the light’s brightness controlled by the battery pack? The driver will probably be in there. It sounds like you’re a bit out of your depth and there probably won’t be any off the shelf parts that will work and be an exact fit. I do recommend sending what you have now to a blf member who lives nearby and is familiar with modding for them to mod it for you.

The power of the light looks good, but in reality it is not, that’s why I’m waiting for the new led to arrive, in your opinion what could I have difficulty modifying?

yes the light’s brightness is controlled by the battery pack

I don’t understand much about driver and battery, should I just change the driver inside the battery? could you recommend one?

However, I would entrust the work to someone more experienced than me, but I don’t know how to find one nearby

Sunnysunsun
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So the driver controls how much power the batteries deliver to the LED. The driver allows you to change the light’s brightness and should manage the charge of the batteries. Just changing the led probably won’t increase the light’s brightness by much. You’ll have to change the driver as well.

I suspect, with it being an aliexpress light, that the driver and batteries are probably not very good.

It is unlikely that a readily available driver will work in that light without significant modifications. Where abouts in the world are you? Maybe someone nearby would be willing to pick this up as a fun project.

Robin Dobbie
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Also think about heat. Sure, you can go brighter, but for how long?

luce1912
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
So the driver controls how much power the batteries deliver to the LED. The driver allows you to change the light’s brightness and should manage the charge of the batteries. Just changing the led probably won’t increase the light’s brightness by much. You’ll have to change the driver as well.

I suspect, with it being an aliexpress light, that the driver and batteries are probably not very good.

It is unlikely that a readily available driver will work in that light without significant modifications. Where abouts in the world are you? Maybe someone nearby would be willing to pick this up as a fun project.

I am Italian, it is a fun project, I hope it will come true.

So there are no standard drivers and batteries that are compatible? What does compatibility depend on?

Another thing I would like to avoid is the overheating of the light, even now without i having changed anything, it heats up after a few minutes.

luce1912
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Robin Dobbie wrote:
Also think about heat. Sure, you can go brighter, but for how long?

Exactly I don’t know how to avoid the heat, how long what do you mean?

Are there any methods to avoid overheating? What does it depend on and how can it be avoided?

Sunnysunsun
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From the looks of your battery pack, it’s likely 2 batteries welded together in a 1S 2P formation. The issue is that most drivers likely won’t fit into the space, and also the brightness of flashlight drivers are usually controlled by a push button rather than what looks like a potentiometer.

Overheating the LED module likely isn’t too big a deal. You probably only need 3-6w to the led for its brightness to be usable. The led pill will get hot to the touch but it won’t damage the led. It would feel pretty hot if you touch it though.

I’d do it but shipping to Canada might be a painful.
Anyone in the EU wanna take on this project?

Quadrupel
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Long story short: the host looks cheap and not made for powerful output. Have to be redesigned from scratch. And we did not saw a driver
.. …

Robin Dobbie
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The candle that burns twice as bright burns half as long.

If this is going to be used in an actual surgical scenario, this may have to overcome the brightness of the existing lights, which could be incredible. I don’t think that host can dissipate 6 watts from a “cool” led, much less one that’s high CRI.

Looking at past topics, someone suggested a bicycle light as a starting point. Much larger, but if sustained high-brightness is desired, it’s a starting point. But even then, bicycle lights are designed to be, you know, moving through the air. So even though there’s greater surface area for heat dissipation, it’s not going to be incredibly better considering it’s in comparably stagnant air.

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Well something like an S2+ overheats at 8*7135 but 6*7135 isn’t too bad. There’s also the fact that the driver isn’t by the led in this light so the LED tube only needs to dissipate the wasted heat created by the LED itself. 2A at 3V shouldn’t be a stretch to dissipate in a tube light. It’ll get hot, probably 40-50c but that’s not the end of the world even if you touch it accidentally.

luce1912
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Quadrupel wrote:
Long story short: the host looks cheap and not made for powerful output. Have to be redesigned from scratch. And we did not saw a driver .. …

By host you mean, the structure of the spotlight? according to my idea it shouldn’t be a big deal a simple piece of plastic to fit with stronger light and driver.

luce1912
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
From the looks of your battery pack, it’s likely 2 batteries welded together in a 1S 2P formation. The issue is that most drivers likely won’t fit into the space, and also the brightness of flashlight drivers are usually controlled by a push button rather than what looks like a potentiometer.

Overheating the LED module likely isn’t too big a deal. You probably only need 3-6w to the led for its brightness to be usable. The led pill will get hot to the touch but it won’t damage the led. It would feel pretty hot if you touch it though.

I’d do it but shipping to Canada might be a painful.
Anyone in the EU wanna take on this project?

I would gladly entrust the work in your hands, you seem very experienced, but in canada, I am afraid to see the project ready in a long time.

In case no one in Europe could do it, would it be so difficult to make it on your own? Maybe I could inquire about how to build it or ask for advice, I just need to know what to buy specifically.

Quadrupel
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Sunnysunsun
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What kind of connector does the light plug into the battery pack with? Is the black body, where the LED is, made of plastic? If you can swap the LED pcb on your own, and there’s no extra circuitry in the LED host, I could probably make you a new battery pack with the driver included.

Or you could do it on your own. I would buy something like these DIY battery cases and connect a driver to it with an output that fits your current headlight plug. This would result in usb charging, higher brightness, and probably a longer lasting battery.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33025605201.html

Robin Dobbie
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I would maybe stick with a name-brand pre-made bank, at the very least.

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Robin Dobbie wrote:
I would maybe stick with a name-brand pre-made bank, at the very least.

Except you’ve got to put a driver somewhere in line with that and premade ones are optimized for space saving. Something better quality would be ideal, but in the end it’s just a case to put batteries in.

luce1912
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Quadrupel wrote:
Led Heatsink

if you mean the led with its MCPCB, I bought a new Samsung LH351D

luce1912
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
What kind of connector does the light plug into the battery pack with? Is the black body, where the LED is, made of plastic? If you can swap the LED pcb on your own, and there’s no extra circuitry in the LED host, I could probably make you a new battery pack with the driver included. Or you could do it on your own. I would buy something like these DIY battery cases and connect a driver to it with an output that fits your current headlight plug. This would result in usb charging, higher brightness, and probably a longer lasting battery. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33025605201.html[/quote]

 

Yes, the black spotlight is made of plastic, I am attaching a photo of the cable connection here, the wheel on the left allows on / off and the adjustment of the intensity.

 

In the case of the DIY battery, would the driver be inserted inside the case? in what position? Thank you

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you want more info about the spotlight this is the Link:

 

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/4000256953900.html?srcSns=sns_WhatsApp&spreadType=socialShare&bizType=ProductDetail&social_params=60058376112&aff_fcid=00efd62028404f18b607531ec9ac69e0-1618953888403-08680-_vWztfH&tt=MG&aff_fsk=_vWztfH&aff_platform=default&sk=_vWztfH&aff_trace_key=00efd62028404f18b607531ec9ac69e0-1618953888403-08680-_vWztfH&shareId=60058376112&businessType=ProductDetail&platform=AE&terminal_id=f6caa745eee7494e894c1c733796d993

 

 

The only thing wrong is that the battery is of 3W and not 5

Robin Dobbie
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luce1912 wrote:
Yes, the black spotlight is made of plastic

Gotta agree with quad on this one. This is not worth messing with.

Sunnysunsun wrote:
Robin Dobbie wrote:
I would maybe stick with a name-brand pre-made bank, at the very least.

Except you’ve got to put a driver somewhere in line with that and premade ones are optimized for space saving. Something better quality would be ideal, but in the end it’s just a case to put batteries in.

From experience with cheap battery holders, I would get a separate case held together with screws.

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Yeah with the led host being made of plastic, it’s probably not worth modding. Plastic is more of an insulator and will keep the heat inside from coming out.

You could probably still run at at around 1A but I wouldn’t increase the power by much above that.

Quote:
From experience with cheap battery holders, I would get a separate case held together with screws.

Thanks, appreciate the advice Thumbs Up

luce1912
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
Yeah with the led host being made of plastic, it’s probably not worth modding. Plastic is more of an insulator and will keep the heat inside from coming out.
Quote:
From experience with cheap battery holders, I would get a separate case held together with screws.

Thanks, appreciate the advice Thumbs Up

So have I lost hope of making it more performant?

If you notice this 1000 euro Orascoptic led, it is also made of plastic

https://ibb.co/album/wMS8xJ

If I bought an aluminum spotlight, could it be done?

Robin Dobbie
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To be clear, the whole thing is plastic?

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It can be modded but you can’t increase its power by too much otherwise the plastic might melt. I’d be willing to have a go at it, but chances are it’ll take at least 2 months to get it shipped to me and back unless you want to pay a lot for faster shipping.

Quadrupel
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You have to learn how to make things better. Read this forum for a month or a year to understand what is all about

Robin Dobbie
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Sunnysunsun wrote:
It can be modded but you can’t increase its power by too much otherwise the plastic might melt. I’d be willing to have a go at it, but chances are it’ll take at least 2 months to get it shipped to me and back unless you want to pay a lot for faster shipping.

Plastic melting is the least of the concerns if the emitter gets above 85C which could easily happen if plastic is hot, much less melting. This was already being pushed beyond the capabilities of the host to dissipate.

luce1912
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Robin Dobbie wrote:
To be clear, the whole thing is plastic?

!https://i.ibb.co/XsKJ5T9/srtksrekt.jpg!

I’m happy to tell you I was wrong, Facepalm I was 100% sure it was plastic, but it’s actually metal, I don’t know exactly what if aluminum or steel or whatever

What was talking about about a separate battery with screws?

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Yay, so there is some potential to get the heat out.

The screws bit was about making a new battery pack. I’d probably throw away the old one because it’s likely no good with Chinese manufacturers cutting margins as tight as possible.

luce1912
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Robin Dobbie wrote:
Sunnysunsun wrote:
It can be modded but you can’t increase its power by too much otherwise the plastic might melt. I’d be willing to have a go at it, but chances are it’ll take at least 2 months to get it shipped to me and back unless you want to pay a lot for faster shipping.
Plastic melting is the least of the concerns if the emitter gets above 85C which could easily happen if plastic is hot, much less melting. This was already being pushed beyond the capabilities of the host to dissipate.

 

 

is this risk avoided by being made of metal? or is there still a risk even with metal?

The plastic part starts from the support, from the blue arrows

 

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Yes, there is still a risk of overheating with metal if you give a light too much power, but you probably won’t need that much power for this light.

The metal will help dissipate the heat outwards from the LED.

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