Cree Flipchipping

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welight
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Cree Flipchipping

Updates on Cree changes
Cree XML-2


Cree XPL

cheers

Cutter Electronics Pty Ltd
Web: https://www.cutter.com.au

Edited by: welight on 05/08/2021 - 19:17
JaredM
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Interesting they are making this change to the older emitters. The XM-L3 will keep it’s bond wires?

Very interested in the changes in peak output current and overall overdriving capabilities. Hopefully they don’t suffer huge surface brightness losses like most flip chips. Much higher outputs should be possible though in 1S lights with the lower Vfs.

Scallywag
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.05V @1.05A -what can we expect at 3A+? Very curious how these will perform (and look) in our applications.

AlexGT
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Do you have a picture of the new XHP-50 Hi?

I wonder how that would look like

welight
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AlexGT wrote:
Do you have a picture of the new XHP-50 Hi?

I wonder how that would look like


Cutter Electronics Pty Ltd
Web: https://www.cutter.com.au

AlexGT
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Thanks! I like it! Does it come in 3v or just 12v?

gchart
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Those look like they could be interesting. Hopefully better than the tint-shift’ing XP-L2 and XP-G3 with the larger phosphor pour.

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Interesting. I imag8ne the power handling in the 3535 size will be a little better with lower vf, so more effociency and amps. I don’t know how it will effect the already outdated xm-l2 though. Glad to see the ded9med and de phosphored xhp’s though.

JaredM
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Relatively speaking I don’t think the XML2 is outdated. In fact, I think it aged remarkably well. If they had the current handling like they did originally (reaching 8-9A) before the bond wire change, they’d still be highly relevant IMO. This flip chip is super interesting for the XML2. Maybe 10A? 12?

Scallywag
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Sure XM-L2 lights can get an output boost from SST-40 or switching to 3535 you can get better CRI options, but my SC62/w are still plenty relevant.

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JaredM wrote:
Relatively speaking I don’t think the XML2 is outdated. In fact, I think it aged remarkably well. If they had the current handling like they did originally (reaching 8-9A) before the bond wire change, they’d still be highly relevant IMO. This flip chip is super interesting for the XML2. Maybe 10A? 12?

I’m a bit behind the times so i don’t understand what the bond wire change was.

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JaredM
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Oh man this was a loooong time ago. Back when XML2 was still king around here and just before XPL IIRC. Cree made unannounced changes to the XPG2 as well in the same era that made it less desirable (larger die /less throw)

Original XML2s could take 8+ amps and had lower Vf. At some point, right around the time either U2 or maybe it was the U3 release, they suddenly couldn’t take the amps. 5-6A would pop the bond wires. Granted, they still put out the lumens, but at much lower current and higher Vf. I don’t remember clearly, but somewhere n BLF there was a google doc spreadsheet that tracked voltage and current limits of them during the transition as people where trying to find the remaining old versions. Once the XPL was around shortly thereafter, many switched to that and then the XPL HI a little while later stole all the attention. Original T6/U2 XML2s where darn capable throwers when dedomed, which was possible easily in gas or when hot. Newer LEDs make it nearly impossible with their chemically resistant dome material or worse mixing the phosphor in with the dome silicone.

This is all from memory, so take the timeline with a grain of salt, but it went something like that.

Bort
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JaredM wrote:
Oh man this was a loooong time ago. Back when XML2 was still king around here and just before XPL IIRC. Cree made unannounced changes to the XPG2 as well in the same era that made it less desirable (larger die /less throw)

Original XML2s could take 8+ amps and had lower Vf. At some point, right around the time either U2 or maybe it was the U3 release, they suddenly couldn’t take the amps. 5-6A would pop the bond wires. Granted, they still put out the lumens, but at much lower current and higher Vf. I don’t remember clearly, but somewhere n BLF there was a google doc spreadsheet that tracked voltage and current limits of them during the transition as people where trying to find the remaining old versions. Once the XPL was around shortly thereafter, many switched to that and then the XPL HI a little while later stole all the attention. Original T6/U2 XML2s where darn capable throwers when dedomed, which was possible easily in gas or when hot. Newer LEDs make it nearly impossible with their chemically resistant dome material or worse mixing the phosphor in with the dome silicone.

This is all from memory, so take the timeline with a grain of salt, but it went something like that.


Bort has been away for a while.
I have an unused first generation XML-2 and XP-G2 chip mounted on noctigon for sale in my sales thread if anyone is interested Big Smile

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JaredM wrote:
dedomed, which was possible easily in gas or when hot. Newer LEDs make it nearly impossible with their chemically resistant dome material or worse mixing the phosphor in with the dome silicone.

I’ve accidentally dedomed XM-L2s during reflow. When they’re up around 200C, those domes really don’t want to be there anymore. Must be very careful.