Manufacturer request - 18650 Tube Light, Tail Switch, Anduril 2 (modern BLF A6)

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stephenk
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Manufacturer request - 18650 Tube Light, Tail Switch, Anduril 2 (modern BLF A6)

18650 tube lights, with single emitters, and tail switches are quite possibly one of the most popular flashlight formats available. Convoy S2+ and the BLF/Astrolux A6 being good examples. Yet, when it comes to 18650 tube lights running Anduril, it is pretty much just side switch options (due to ease of electrical engineering). There is only really one option in this class, the FW1A/FW1A Pro which Lumintop have just stuffed up with a new driver that doesn’t match the firmware and sub-optimal reflector (and it also had pretty poor heat handling anyway). The Noctigon KR1 and KR4 are fantastic, but are too obese and multi-emitter respectively.

Why am I looking for this type of flashlight – 1) there is a huge gap in the market here, and I think this concept would be very popular; 2) there are currently no decent budget flashlights for light painting photography (where direct access to constant frequency strobes from off, single emitter, <28mm diameter, and tail switch are essential).

So I ask if a manufacturer can made the following:

  • 18650 Tube Light Format (approx. 25mm diameter tube, no wider than 28mm diameter at any point so that it can fit in all light painting connectors, could even be 21700 if it can fit within these dimensions).
  • A side clip is essential, a reversible clip would be desirable.
  • Tail e-switch only (Yes, this would require an inner-tube).
  • Anduril 2 (with all blinky modes, double-click from any ramped/stepped mode to turbo enabled, strobes running at 5A).
  • Throwy optics e.g. deep smooth reflector, emitters such as SST-40, XP-L HI, CSLPM1.
  • 5A + FET driver (I would be happy with just 5A and no FET, with ramp max at 5A, but I’m sure others would like a FET turbo).
  • Decent heat handling.
  • Internal USB-C charging desirable, but not essential.
  • Approx. US$50 or less.

Hopefully a manufacturer will see this and make it a reality. Interested to know thoughts on this concept from others. Group Buy anyone?

Edited by: stephenk on 10/17/2021 - 00:50
raccoon city
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Sounds very interesting.

What do you think of the XHP70.2?

Is it too floody?

(My brightest flashlight has an XHP70.2 and I'm a bit of a lumen wh0re.)

stephenk
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raccoon city wrote:

Sounds very interesting.


What do you think of the XHP70.2?


Is it too floody?


(My brightest flashlight has a XHP70.2 and I’m a bit of a lumen wh0re.)

XHP70.2 is way too floody for this use case. Needs to be throwy – at least to S2+ with 5A driver or original FW1A standards.

raccoon city
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I don't know emitters that well.

Which single emitter is the brightest, and is also quite throwy?  (and also doesn't create a ton of heat.)

stephenk
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raccoon city wrote:

I don’t know emitters that well.


Which single emitter is the brightest, and is also quite throwy?  (and also doesn’t create a ton of heat.)

For light painting purposes, the light has to get as much light as possible through either a 20mm or 25mm aperture in a (flashlight to light painting tool) cone shaped connector, or sit within a 29mm tube depending on the light painting system. Thus peak beam intensity is possibly more important than lumens. I’ve had the best results with XHP35 in the Klarus XT2CR, XP-L HI in FW1A/S2+/SP31 V2.0, CSLNM1.TG in S2+, and SST-40 in KR1. Sadly the KR1 is too big for one light painting system (which has a max diameter of 28mm), and due to the head size most of the lumens in the spill beam are lost in the cone shaped connectors. A KR1 like light but in 25mm (ish) 18650 tube format would be perfect.

A link to my flashlight buying guide for light painting is in my signature. It’s about to get a re-write in the next few weeks, with some lights added and others removed. Now a 1×21700 format XHP70.2 flooder that could sustain 2,000 lumens would also float my boat (the max is currently around 1,500lm in the Convoy M21D, Thrunite T2, and Zebralight SC700D) for illumination purposes, but that’s a whole different thread.

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:BEER: 

Oli
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Size matters for most people. I knew the fw1a would be my primary carry for a long time when it was first announced. If it’s going to be the size of an S2+ then it’s not really going to deal with heat any better than the fw1a now. A good bit of what made the S2+ so popular is the reliability. Try to put a tube in it and most people aren’t going to buy in.

You can't compare the big flashlight in the sky to the little flashlight in your hand.

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Oli wrote:
Size matters for most people. I knew the fw1a would be my primary carry for a long time when it was first announced. If it’s going to be the size of an S2+ then it’s not really going to deal with heat any better than the fw1a now. A good bit of what made the S2+ so popular is the reliability. Try to put a tube in it and most people aren’t going to buy in.

The S2+ can sustain approx. double the lumens of the FW1A, so it has much better heat handling. There are plenty of reliable lights with inner tubes – Noctigon KR1, KR4, Klarus XT2CR, XT11GT (after gen1), etc. Get the design right and the inner tube isn’t a problem.
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It sounds a bit like wishing for incompatible aspects mashed into one light.

Compact + throwy
Compact + on board charging
On board charging + inner tube
Compact + on board charging + good heat dissipation

You might be able to mix 1 or 2 aspects but not all of them

  

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pinkpanda3310 wrote:
It sounds a bit like wishing for incompatible aspects mashed into one light.

Compact + throwy
Compact + on board charging
On board charging + inner tube
Compact + on board charging + good heat dissipation

You might be able to mix 1 or 2 aspects but not all of them

I don’t think it’s too incompatible. Compact and throwy (for EDC size) – plenty of lights manage that – original FW1A, XT2CR, even the S2+ with some emitters. On-board charging is optional, didn’t know it was an issue with inner tube, but regarding size it only adds to length, not width if well designed.

And if all of this is too difficult, just an S2+ with the Biscotti/12-Group alternating frequency strobe reverted back to constant frequency would solve the lack of budget lights suitable for light painting issue, but sadly Simon hasn’t listened to that request.

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So really, a modified driver for either the s2+ or fw1a or xt2cr would satisfy most of your want list…?

  

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pinkpanda3310 wrote:
So really, a modified driver for either the s2+ or fw1a or xt2cr would satisfy most of your want list…?

Ideally it would run Anduril for adjustable strobe frequency, which would require an inner tube for a tail e-switch. But to some extent I’m looking for a Convoy S2+ like light with Anduril, or a slimmer KR1.
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How about a modified kr4 – remove quad, install single emitter Question

  

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pinkpanda3310 wrote:
How about a modified kr4 – remove quad, install single emitter Question

I’m suggesting a production light, not a mod. There are quite a few excellent >$100 lights for light painters, but nothing decent below $50 that fits all systems. The KR4 is 1mm too wide at 29mm, but if it was 1mm narrower and had a single emitter it would be perfect.
Oli
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stephenk wrote:

The S2+ can sustain approx. double the lumens of the FW1A, so it has much better heat handling.
I recall seeing test results with the temperature calibration cranked up to 60C [EDIT zeroair was measuring 38C external in the link below] and 600 lumens sustained with a FW1A. I don’t have mine cranked up that high but I’ll compare the fw1a and S2+ (biscotti) both with a SST4000k. Visual with an infrared thermometer and the same batteries. I predict similar output and temperatures at 5 and 10 minutes. Do you know if the light dancing tubes help or hurt heat dissipation?

You can't compare the big flashlight in the sky to the little flashlight in your hand.

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Oli wrote:
stephenk wrote:

The S2+ can sustain approx. double the lumens of the FW1A, so it has much better heat handling.
I recall seeing test results with the temperature calibration cranked up to 60C and 600 lumens sustained with a FW1A. I don’t have mine cranked up that high but I’ll compare the fw1a and S2+ (biscotti) both with a SST4000k. Visual with an infrared thermometer and the same batteries. I predict similar output and temperatures at 10 minutes.

That’s not a like for like test though. With my FW1A XP-L HI 6500k calibrated and set to 55C (which I think is the same as the S2+ and around “real world” comfortable holding limits anyway) it is at approx. 250lm at 10 mins. With a 90CRI LH351D 5700k in a 5A/12 group driver S2+ it is running at approx. 500lm at 10 minutes. The S2+ has surprisingly good thermal mass and handling for it’s class. Interestingly though, the FW3X with Lume1 driver seems to be able to sustain much higher lumens than the FW3A.
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https://zeroair.org/2019/10/14/lumintop-fw1a-flashlight-review/ FW1A run times before and after calibration.

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Not sure why it ‘needs’ to be a production light but okay. Good luck with it Smile

  

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pinkpanda3310 wrote:
Not sure why it ‘needs’ to be a production light but okay. Good luck with it Smile

1) I have lots of light painters asking me for a good budget light, and there aren’t any.
2) Tail switch 18650 tube lights are hugely popular with flashlight enthusiasts and muggles, and yet there isn’t a decent one with Anduril.

Anyway, it seems there isn’t much interest going by this thread.

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The more you explain it the more it makes sense but like you said there doesn’t appear to be much interest in this thread

  

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Maybe this thread isn't that popular because the flashlight is being made for light painters, and most people on BLF don't do light painting.

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Random curiosity, how popular is light painting these days? If someone were to put the effort into making a light like this would they be looking at selling a few hundred, couple thousand? If numbers are that low it would probably be a losing operation considering the time needed to develop it. If $50 is a reasonable target then that leaves some leeway for low production volume but still I think most mfrs look at minimums of 10,000 and go from there.

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raccoon city wrote:
Maybe this thread isn’t that popular because the flashlight is being made for light painters, and most people on BLF don’t do light painting.

Naw, mention of an XHPanything turned me off. Hideous beams, at least as far as angular tint-shift.

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raccoon city wrote:

Maybe this thread isn't that popular because the flashlight is being made for light painters, and most people on BLF don't do light painting.

Lightbringer wrote:

Naw, mention of an XHPanything turned me off.

The suggestion of using a XHP70.2 got shot down immediately due to its floodiness, so your point is moot.

Even if the light were available in XHP70.2, it would be available with other emitters as well.

I mean, your point is so incredibly weak, it's hard to take seriously.

Lightbringer wrote:

Hideous beams, at least as far as angular tint-shift.

The tint-shift doesn't bother me in the least, but like I said, the point is moot.  :THUMBS-UP:

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XHP35 HI isn’t too bad. Looking forward to trying the XHP50.3 HI.

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Correllux wrote:
Random curiosity, how popular is light painting these days? If someone were to put the effort into making a light like this would they be looking at selling a few hundred, couple thousand? If numbers are that low it would probably be a losing operation considering the time needed to develop it. If $50 is a reasonable target then that leaves some leeway for low production volume but still I think most mfrs look at minimums of 10,000 and go from there.
Well there is one light painter with over 500k followers on social media for starters. An RGB light had over 1000 backers on Kickstarter. This light wouldn’t just be for light painters but a modernised 18650 tube light, which as we know is a popular format.