the newest craziness 9x XM-L U2

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r1derbike
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Hikelite
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The CSM-360 with an aspheric will look like this:

2100
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Hikelite wrote:

The CSM-360 with an aspheric will look like this:

I admit it, actually i wanted to get that feilong when i first got into the hobby! 

yavi
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The one I like most from that manufacturer is the flydragon, with an aspheric and also a regular reflector head, but it is far from a budget light I could assume to buy.

 

2100, I believe the problem of this huge thing is using a single reflector, surely one small reflector for each die would throw much better, but it would need a huge head..

yavi
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Hikelite wrote:

The CSM-360 with an aspheric will look like this:

De-focussing it a little bit to get all emitters on the same area should throw quite well, did anyone try it?

dthrckt
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I really like aspherics, but even though it is impressive, I'm not fan of that beam profile.

defocusing would probably help a lot though

anyway, as for this 9xml - i can't figure out why they crammed the emitters together.  if it is going to flood you might as well space them out in smaller reflectors like the current 3 and 5xmls.  

That would also leave quite a cavern for adding more mass - although a 5 or 6 lb light is a little impractical (for most of my purposes anyway).

yavi
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Yes Dthrckt, I agree with  you 100%, but in the other hand it is good to see companies taking the risk of doing different models even if they are not that good Smile

Buwuve
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You want more pic - take a look at this forum (english translation link included):

http://de.babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=b...

Light up the darkness.

dthrckt
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agreed - I don't think it is that bad, actually.  I mean, if you have the money to spend on lots of emitters, there's nothing wrong w/ underdriving xmls...

I don't care about the throw figures - if you wanted throw in a light this size you'd go HID, right?

let's hope they're reaching the point where they realize they'll have to begin to use some active cooling if they want to continue to push the envelope.

2100
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yavi wrote:

The one I like most from that manufacturer is the flydragon, with an aspheric and also a regular reflector head, but it is far from a budget light I could assume to buy.

Yep, fei long in chinese is actually Fly Dragon directly translated.  Smile

2100
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dthrckt wrote:

agreed - I don't think it is that bad, actually.  I mean, if you have the money to spend on lots of emitters, there's nothing wrong w/ underdriving xmls...

I don't care about the throw figures - if you wanted throw in a light this size you'd go HID, right?

let's hope they're reaching the point where they realize they'll have to begin to use some active cooling if they want to continue to push the envelope.

 

I was hoping someone do some XR-Es in this bugger.  Holy !@$!@#@ it'd be awesome.  HIDs radiate quite a lot of heat via the front glass though.  LEDs do not, it's via the back.   LEDs hate heat, HIDs love heat.  It is not until about 400W in a 7" portable host that do you need forced air cooling.  Yeah, that is like WOW.

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viffer750
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some provocative measurements Smile

 

1

 

2

 

unique engrish language... Smile

 

dthrckt
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2100 wrote:

I was hoping someone do some XR-Es in this bugger.  Holy !@$!@#@ it'd be awesome.  HIDs radiate quite a lot of heat via the front glass though.  LEDs do not, it's via the back.   LEDs hate heat, HIDs love heat.  It is not until about 400W in a 7" portable host that do you need forced air cooling.  Yeah, that is like WOW.

when a couple similar lights popped up on DX I thought it over Smile   I think it could work really well but it is low on my list of projects (but mostly just because so many other projects already have time and money invested).

2100
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Viffer, actually that particular MF 35W is a well known under-performer.   Smile   Measured many times to be in the 50k cd region.  Check out tatjamagic's comments in CPF section (and my dialoug with him).   

But yes, the 20/24W HIDs are actually even more inefficient.  You'd want to go high power with those flashlight host type of HIDs.  But don't mix up with those 35W automotive ballasts, those are really different animals....esp after putting them into the big hosts.  The Microfire 35W has OP, the SMO ebay/aliexpress 35W gets you slightly over 100k cd actually.

His XTAR S1 figures seem a little low, but anyway that really puts to rest my doubts and i hope the others too!

WOW!

Where do i sign up for it man?   Big Smile   I mean the flashlight looks cool looking anyway.

Seems to be in the 5000 lumens OTF region.  

Throw is a mix.    The microfire 35W is measured by many members to be in the 50-55k cd range. Its getting quite high here, and the S1 + SR92 are quite low.

But anyway one thing i can't make sense of is that in the first photo it clearly shows the throw of the 2D80 9 XML to be lower than the SR92.    (1) operator error in that first photo  maybe?

 

Still some questions unanswered. Yeah provocative measurements....plus pictures.  LOL!

 

 

2100
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Interesting!  And provocative!   Just occurred to me that it migth not be a good idea to measure even at 3 metres, which they seem to be doing due to the small spot size.

 

asd 

This would be more indicative of throw.  Many metres away.

asd 

 ds

 

yavi
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2100 wrote:

yavi wrote:

The one I like most from that manufacturer is the flydragon, with an aspheric and also a regular reflector head, but it is far from a budget light I could assume to buy.

Yep, fei long in chinese is actually Fly Dragon directly translated.  Smile

Haha, so I was just telling about the brand not the model then, How many languages do you actually speak 2100?

I only know spanish and a not that good english Sad

I think it was called MS2010 the one with the aspheric lens.

 

joe1512
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Meh. They probably run each emitter at 1 amp.   It seems like a huge waste of money.   3x XM-Ls at 3 amps already produces a good 36 or so watts of power.   That is already pretty difficult to heat sink.

Plus, the XM-L curve of wattage to lumen output is pretty linear up thru 3 amps too.   So doing 5 XM-Ls at 2 amps isn't really THAT much better than 3 XM-Ls at 3 amps each from an efficiency standpoint. 

Putting 9 of them in a light, especially right next to each other seems like a terrible, awful idea. 

Tecmo
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Don't xpg put out about the same amount of light as xml up to about 1.5A? Why didn't anyone ever do anything like this with them? A few less lumens for a lot more throw. Or 9 1a xre. It seems the multi-emitter single-reflector would throw much better than the multiple small reflector setups.

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cool monster for the positions of the LEDs I'm wondering if it don't use a Peltier's cell but probably not, wouldn't be efficient

Chicago X
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Tecmo wrote:
Don't xpg put out about the same amount of light as xml up to about 1.5A? Why didn't anyone ever do anything like this with them? A few less lumens for a lot more throw. Or 9 1a xre. It seems the multi-emitter single-reflector would throw much better than the multiple small reflector setups.

In every multi-LED app that I've seen in a single reflector, throw is compromised.

I have made (or purchased) several in varying sizes, all the way down to twin XPGs in a single P60 reflector ("Linger Special")

Due to packaging, none of the LEDs are optimally positioned in the reflector.  This is seen in the relative lack of collimation compared to the S1. 

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2100
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joe1512 wrote:

Meh. They probably run each emitter at 1 amp.   It seems like a huge waste of money.   3x XM-Ls at 3 amps already produces a good 36 or so watts of power.   That is already pretty difficult to heat sink.

Plus, the XM-L curve of wattage to lumen output is pretty linear up thru 3 amps too.   So doing 5 XM-Ls at 2 amps isn't really THAT much better than 3 XM-Ls at 3 amps each from an efficiency standpoint. 

Hi Joe,

It seems that they are driving each at about 1.8A thereabouts, to do 5000L out-the-front (calculated using the excel LED output calculator that you can find here on BLF).  That's from my calculated guess on the  ceiling bounce on the lux meter.

Also look at the temperature rise, even with the high mass of 1kg for the light/fins, we are doing a delta of 31 deg C or 16 deg C rise to 47 deg C for a run of 10 minutes.  XTAR S1 is 18 deg C delta and SR92 is 19 deg C.   I have seen the Xtar S1 in detail, no way that it or the SR92 has a lousy thermal path from the MCPCB to 6061 host.

 

You mentioned 2A vs 3A.  For info : 1.8A = 658 lumens @ emitter (cold), and 3A = 937 @ emitter (cold).   5 LEDs x 1.8A = 9A = 3290L emitter and 3 LEDs x 3A = 9A = 2811L emitter.     That's a 17% difference.  I guess it's not a lot but that's not insignificant as well. Esp if you are pushing the envelope....

I just want it to be cheaper....   Money Mouth

 

 

2100
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yavi wrote:

Haha, so I was just telling about the brand not the model then, How many languages do you actually speak 2100?

I only know spanish and a not that good english Sad

I think it was called MS2010 the one with the aspheric lens.

Haha...nah i just know 3 languages. English, Chinese and the Cantonese dialect.  I know a bit of Hokkien, that's all.

 

Yes, the range is MS2010...they have several hosts like 2D60 and 2D80 (probably denotes the head diameter).

 

HKequipment.net used to carry flydragon but they stopped.  Here's another one : http://www.ebay.com.sg/itm/Flydragon-Fei-Long-MS2010-SST-90-SST90-LED-Flashlight-/110830649774?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19ce0581ae

If you ask me, it's too expensive though.  Check out the GB in shoudian for the China folks, it's not very expensive.

 

I guess if anyone is really interested they can ask HKE.  HK is a good place to start, they are so near to Shenzhen.  It's like our country here crossing over to Malaysia's....just over a bridge. City centre to City centre is just like 30km.

2100
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Tecmo wrote:
Don't xpg put out about the same amount of light as xml up to about 1.5A? Why didn't anyone ever do anything like this with them? A few less lumens for a lot more throw. Or 9 1a xre. It seems the multi-emitter single-reflector would throw much better than the multiple small reflector setups.

That's a good idea.  If we swap out the 5 x XM-L in the TR-J12 to 5 x XP-G i'd estimate that as maybe 35k cd range and calculated @ 1.5A you'd get 2000 lumens OTF, just a slight drop in lumens.   TR-J12 is 24k cd.  

There is a 3 x XP-G budgetlight, you can see it in ebay, but it's not very popular.   The reason is probably just that, XP-G does not sound impressive for the general folks/beginner flashaholics.

dthrckt
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I kind of agree w/ you bobk - I mean, when you walk outside in daylight, you're not shocked...so how shocking can a flashlight be.

on the other hand, maybe you could try taking your big 'guns' back out and standing down range from 1, then down range from both and the difference would be more noticeable Wink

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unique engrish language... Smile

 

2100
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viffer750 wrote:

now it's available at intl-outdoor.com, the price is ridiculously high

Most of you probably would not be able to see the characters unless you have chinese support, but they had an offer for the first 10 guys in each 4/5/7/9 XM-L category, think it's a special price and free battery.  The next 10 guys would be special price but no free battery. After than full price and no free battery.

http://www.shoudian.com/thread-235304-1-1.html

They have U2 and T6 3C options.

 

9V protection and 6.2V protection for 3D and 2D respectively. 

  

 Anyway I'll just post there webby here.  http://www.feilong.us/

For more pictures, pls go to shoudian and see post 2 by Feilong.  I am posting just 1 pic here from my gallery as I think they don't want people to hotlink direct from their site.  (bandwidth probably)

asd

asd

 asd

 ads

 

 

My parents will be in Shenzhen/Zhuhai/Guangdong next week but I don't think it is cheap over there even with the help of my relatives.     LOL! 

For me i'll be in Beijing the week after next....but i think nothing much to buy as far as flashlights/lxxxx are concerned.

 

 

 

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lol. You would not see me having 9 18650 batteries in that light! And some people are afraid of 2-4 18650s in one light.

Since it at has 15A max current.  That would be 1,67A to each led. So theoretically it should be about 600 lumen on each led. 600*9:5400 lumens.

Probably a nice light if you want 5000 lumens from three 32650 batteries paired with long lasting LEDs. Very expensive tough.. Way too expensive! Altough it is probably the sickest XM-L lights out there! So with no opponents it kinda can justify its price.. Only people with way too much money will buy it tough. Lucky ba...  Wink

 

btw.. would it not be better to just buy a 55/65w HID if looking for a 5000+ lumen light in that price range?

(no clue about HIDs, or what price range decent lights are.)

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2100
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RaceR86 wrote:

 

btw.. would it not be better to just buy a 55/65w HID if looking for a 5000+ lumen light in that price range?

(no clue about HIDs, or what price range decent lights are.)

Probably it has low 5000 lumens OTF.   My 65 watters gets me approx 3800-4000L OTF.  (difficult to measure because there is an optimised burn position which is not vertical, so a ceiling bounce gives you a reading that slides down).   The 85W might not even touch 5000 lumens OTF....still plenty bright though.

Don't bother with the wattage though. Measurements are better. One thing is that it's extremely difficult to get a current reading for those aluminum flashlight host HIDs that you see on Ebay/Aliexpress.

 

A 100W ballast @ 24V input with 100W bulb (just for measurement's sake, coz 24V it has higher efficiency) can net you about low 7000 lumens OTF on a 6" reflector with the thick glass lens intact (cuts about 11%).   

 

To look at this from a more different perspective, I have a total of about 37000 lumens OTF from the HIDs.  Sealed (conservatively speaking, > 30000 lumens OTF, confirmed).

 

 

 

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http://www.intl-outdoor.com/feilong-2d80-9xml-u2-80009000lm-flashlight-p-337.html 

$569

Be fun to review something that outrageous.  I guess they got any heat issues sorted, right?  I can turn this thing on high without losing an arm?

Damn . . . . nine XM-Ls.

 

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yavi
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2100 wrote:

RaceR86 wrote:

 

btw.. would it not be better to just buy a 55/65w HID if looking for a 5000+ lumen light in that price range?

(no clue about HIDs, or what price range decent lights are.)

Probably it has low 5000 lumens OTF.   My 65 watters gets me approx 3800-4000L OTF.  (difficult to measure because there is an optimised burn position which is not vertical, so a ceiling bounce gives you a reading that slides down).   The 85W might not even touch 5000 lumens OTF....still plenty bright though.

Don't bother with the wattage though. Measurements are better. One thing is that it's extremely difficult to get a current reading for those aluminum flashlight host HIDs that you see on Ebay/Aliexpress.

 

A 100W ballast @ 24V input with 100W bulb (just for measurement's sake, coz 24V it has higher efficiency) can net you about low 7000 lumens OTF on a 6" reflector with the thick glass lens intact (cuts about 11%).   

 

To look at this from a more different perspective, I have a total of about 37000 lumens OTF from the HIDs.  Sealed (conservatively speaking, > 30000 lumens OTF, confirmed).

 

 

 

The "problem" I see is the throw is not apparently huge for that power consumption, and I feel a big part of it is not usable for flood either, with much less lumen output you get a more than usable light dimmer but enough.

I would like to see a light with 3-5 XM-L with deep and not very big in diameter, it might be a better compromise between flood and throw  (at least in my head).

 

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