Accidental turn on protection (electronic or mechanical)

YuvalS · 2018-09-26T15:13:32.000Z

Hi all,
I am new to this form so I shortly introduce myself:
I am a Caver and started to build my own lights.

My Last project was my main caving headlamp in a homemade aluminum body:
Spot: xml2 u2 with Ledil 11937 optic.
Wide: xml2 u2 with no optic.
Driver: TaskLED DualFlex.
Switch: APEM ICR3SAD2.
Batteries: 1P2S 18650.

NOW, I want to build a backup light running on the same battery packs (1P2S 18650).
I really don't want to find out that the light turn on accidentally inside my bag and run out of batteries.
The TaskLED drivers prevent accidentally turn on by requiring 3 fast clicks in order to turn the light on but this drivers cost a lot 30$ while I I want to use simple (cheaper driver) do you know driver with similar protection or waterproof momentary switch with mechanical protection ?

Thanks a lot.

Pablo_de_Llama · 2018-09-26T15:58:47.000Z

If the threads are anodised, mechanical protection is easy, just unscrew a little bit so that there is no electrical contact. :)

YuvalS · 2018-09-27T07:40:10.000Z

Body is sealed, only waterproof USB charging port and 1 or to switches will be available to the user.

aswang · 2018-10-21T15:31:05.000Z

Just saw your post. Not much response. I guess caving headlamps and piezo switches are outside everybody’s budget.

I know Narsil or Anduril UI has electronic lockout (4 clicks) among other things. Lexel sells drivers with Narsil. They work with momentary switches (I think piezo switches are momentary but I might be wrong).

If you want to drive one 3V led with 2s you would need a buck driver which are a bit more expensive at 21$.

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Or you can use 6V XHP50 and 2S TA Narsil (7135+FET) driver if you don’t mind direct drive (a lot of lumens and heat) at higher modes.

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Would you mind sharing photos of the caving headlamp you built? I want to build mine in the future. I use a modded armytek and a modded nicron at the moment.

YuvalS · 2018-10-21T15:41:33.000Z

Here is a facebook post about my caving light https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=860602017448780&id=100004969696221 more photos in the comments.

I changed my configuration to 2s1p pack and ordered two A17DD-L FET + 1 drivers I will try write new firmware for momentary switch and use one free attiny terminal to connect another FET for the spot led (no need for low current channel for it)

aswang · 2018-10-21T19:21:20.000Z

Nice build. Kinda looks like a smaller Phaethon that one of my richer caving buddies bought. Hope to see more photos when you finish.

But why xm-ls? I think high cri nichias, SST-20s or LH351Ds would make it lovier and would make those scurion beams look very ugly in comparison. Just a thought from a tint snob.

YuvalS · 2018-10-21T19:51:33.000Z

It is already finished, what kind of photos are you interested in?

It was my first built and I didn't had a lot of knowledge about LEDs and bins and it seems like XM-L2 are very common.

Also I thought that Nichias cannot output ~1000 Lm and couldn't find tight spot lens for the Nichia 219.
Are there any tight spot lenses for 219 or 351D?

Lightbringer · 2018-10-21T20:03:03.000Z

How much current is going through the power-cable?

Or alternatively, is there an “enable” wire anywhere?

If possible, a magnetic-reed switch (mercury-wetted for lower contact resistance) could be completely sealed, and a magnet stuck near one end of it would “turn it on”.

Either get one with enough current-handling capacity to handle power from the battery, else a smaller one could be used for an “enable” pin.

Niko · 2018-10-21T20:28:59.000Z

You can find more tight lenses for nichia than for xm-l.
Nichia is smaller die and you can use any xpg/l optic.

If driver not have lock option you can add latching switch or inline waterproof switch like:

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Niko · 2018-10-21T20:33:15.000Z

Are you sure for a17dd-l driver and your configuration 2s1p ???

YuvalS · 2018-10-21T20:47:09.000Z

Lightbringer:

How much current is going through the power-cable?

One XM-L2 or three nichia 219 as Aswang recommend, so I guess about 3 Amps?

Lightbringer:

If possible, a magnetic-reed switch (mercury-wetted for lower contact resistance) could be completely sealed, and a magnet stuck near one end of it would “turn it on”.

Magnets are very bad for cave survey (using magnetic sensors for azimuth), so I want to avoid any magnets.

It also need to be waterproof and these switches are quite expensive so I prefer to use only one switch for UI and locking, this is why I want electronic lock.

YuvalS · 2018-10-21T21:01:00.000Z

Niko:

Are you sure for a17dd-l driver and your configuration 2s1p ???

sorry my bad, it is 2P1S

Niko:

You can find more tight lenses for nichia than for xm-l. Nichia is smaller die and you can use any xpg/l optic.

I was wondering about it. Is any 3535 optic is compatible with any 3535 LED Cree/Nichia/Samsung can I use XP-G optic for XP-L2 LEDs?

Niko:

If driver not have lock option you can add latching switch or inline waterproof switch like:

Where can I buy these switches? Do you trust chinese counterfeits are they really IPX7?

Currently I am using APEM switches which are super reliable but expensive as well

Niko · 2018-10-21T21:25:29.000Z

Yes you can use any 3535 optic. Degree depemds on each emitter die size.
Apem switch also have manufacture in china. This switch avalilable on aliexpress (topshall) and on other supplier. Is very good and is ip68!

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Lightbringer · 2018-10-21T21:33:23.000Z

Lightbringer:

If possible, a magnetic-reed switch (mercury-wetted for lower contact resistance) could be completely sealed, and a magnet stuck near one end of it would “turn it on”.

YuvalS:

Magnets are very bad for cave survey (using magnetic sensors for azimuth), so I want to avoid any magnets.

Open magnets, no doubt.
If you “close the circuit”, you all but eliminate any stray magnetism. (That’s why toroidal inductors/transformers have almost zero stray field.)

So instead of, say, just taking a small Nd “pill” magnet and tacking it onto one end, you can take a thin magnetised rod, and put it in parallel with the magswitch so that the field “shorts” through the magswitch itself.

So unless you’re resting surveying equipment right on top of the magnet+switch, it should have no effect.

YuvalS:

It also need to be waterproof and these switches are quite expensive so I prefer to use only one switch for UI and locking, this is why I want electronic lock.

You initially said “electronic or mechanical”, so…

Anyway, by just snipping one lead to put the magswitch inline, then sealing the exposed leads, and having, say, heatshrink tubing on top of the whole mess (eg, also sealed with hotglue), you can make it impervious to water.

Lightbringer · 2018-10-21T21:40:07.000Z

Oh, and don’t forget, 3A through a power cable will generate a small but looong magnetic dipole, unless you twist the cable (“twisted-pair”).

YuvalS · 2018-10-21T22:18:40.000Z

Niko:

Yes you can use any 3535 optic. Degree depemds on each emitter die size.

While I am searching for optic at Ledil or Carclo website some XP-G optics are missing from the XP-L2 search results, for example XP-L2 or Nichia 219 are not written as compatible with Ledill Tina-RS https://www.ledil.com/data/prod/Tina/10887/10887-ds.pdf

Niko:

Apem switch also have manufacture in china. This switch avalilable on aliexpress (topshall) and on other supplier. Is very good and is ip68!

Somehow their website (and certificates) looks really suspicius

YuvalS · 2018-10-21T22:23:23.000Z

Lightbringer:

You initially said “electronic or mechanical”, so…

At first I was thinking about this option but electric lock seems simpler and more reliable, I also want to avoid accidental lock

Lightbringer:

Oh, and don’t forget, 3A through a power cable will generate a small but looong magnetic dipole, unless you twist the cable (“twisted-pair”).

This is really good idea. I will use it!

aswang · 2018-10-22T01:05:04.000Z

Nice to see post has become more active. Nice inputs which could help me later on. With regards to optics does it have to be a specific size (diameter and height)? You can try also yajiamei optics for more options.

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My experience with optics is that its best if you get a few different types and see for yourself the beam it produces and choose what you like or need. Optics designed for XML works for any 5050 or 3535 leds with 3535 leds producing a tighter beam. Personally I prefer beaded optics to produce nice beam with no artifacts. Clear tight optics gets you more throw but many times produce artifacts on the edges. For my caving lights I like the beam produced by 60° beaded combined with 20° beaded optics. 60° beaded + 20° clear also looks ok for me if more throw is needed.

I have a few 17mm and 20mm Yajiamei and a few more coming and I can test them if you like. I know I have some output and beam distance stats somewhere written I’ll try to look for them.

Barkuti · 2018-10-22T08:26:15.000Z

There are inexpensive, good, fully regulated buck drivers like the LD-29, or check here if in the USA for other options. No pulse width modulation crap and constant brightness on all modes independently of battery SoC (State of Charge).

At last and not really wanting to start a :-D fire, XM-L2 U2 emitters? Typical cool white low CRI stuff? :facepalm: In the darkness of a cave I think it is of primordial importance to have light of the highest quality. High CRI emitters of low to moderate (warm - neutral, 3000K - 4500K) temperature. Your more or less darkness adapted eyes will enormously thank the light temperature and color rendition to appreciate the details of your surroundings. Some CRI90+ candidates: Samsung LH351B 3000K and LH351D 4000K in this thread from AEDe (CRI90+ LH351D 4000K here in MTN Electronics too), CRI95+ Luminus SST-20 3000K & 4000K, Nichia 219C (various offerings in MTN Electronics too), and of course Clemence's shop, high CRI paradise.

Cheers :-)

Mon, 10/22/2018 - 03:34/06:17

aswang · 2018-10-22T02:22:50.000Z

I totally agree with Barkuti on light quality in cave environments. I learned about this when I used my little manker e03h as backup light and mini lantern while caving and since then fell in love with high cri leds (except CREEs). I highly recommend Clemence’s shop and his expertise in High CRI nichia leds. The E21As he sells have the best light quality I’ve ever experienced in an led light. His quad e21a setup would be lovely for your flood (mule) light. 3535 nichias are ok for spot/throw but SST-20s might be better (haven’t tried yet). I know Vinh at Skylumen uses the low cri 6500K version as an option for his GT mini build and his measurements show they out-throw xpl-hi for this setup.