Manker versus Zebralight

kramer5150 · 2018-04-01T20:59:16.000Z

x2… the “long” click to turn off is not really that long… IMHO. Maybe 1/3 - 1/2 second at most.

jon_slider · 2018-04-01T21:14:47.000Z

Pablo de Llama:

Flicker index? Is there an easy way of capturing flicker?

not that I know of
there are basic PWM tests, photo closeups, and waving the light, and shining it at water in the shower
there is also an app, but I have not found it to produce any useful info, for me… Maukka has had better results: Very informative youtube review of UTorch UT02 - #4 by maukka

Here is another thread about the Flicker app

The way I can get some idea of Flicker is by extreme closeup of the LED
LAD:

Zebra:

but those photos dont mean the flicker is visible in actual use
I also test by waving the light. Neither of the above lights show dots when waved.

Maukka is the only one I know of that has complete details about Flicker, here is a post of his about a Zebra, I dont have one for a Manker

Zebralight SC64c (XP-L2) measurements or "why 2-step means squat" 18650 Flashlights

I tested some non Easywhite binned 4000K XP-L2s a while back and found the CRI90 versions to be green/yellow in tint while the CRI70 versions were quite alright. Both suffered from the tint shift within the beam i.e. the Cree rainbow. The 2-step CRI90 XP-L2 in the Zebralight SC64c should guarantee a nice tint, but several reports from users have indicated otherwise. Fortunately a fellow flashlight enthusiast loaned me his SC64c for testing. He has already decided to return it as he was spoiled …

kramer5150 · 2018-04-01T21:20:12.000Z

Pablo de Llama:

jon_slider:

Compare: both offer High CRI, (I dont know how the color and tint compare) both use “constant current” (I don’t know the Flicker index for the Manker compared to the Zebra) Both have similar mode options and Contrast: E03H Weight according to REVIEW MANKER E03H XPL 81 grams w battery and no headband (45% heavier than Zebra) Cost $30 Not potted? — H53c Weight according to http://www.zebralight.com/H53c-AA-Headlamp-Neutral-White-High-CRI_p_194.html 56 grams w battery and no headband Cost $59 (97% more expensive than Manker) Potted

E03H has a magnet, which could be a pro or con, and definitely contributes to higher weight.

Flicker index? Is there an easy way of capturing flicker?

The best way I have found to measure PWM is on a miltimeter. Set to AC Frequency/Hz. The DC PWM will behave like an AC square wave and the meter will display the oscillation in Hz. Its not an absolute way to measure, but for comparative analysis… one light versus another I have found it a a good way to evaluate how visible the PWM is. The lower the frequency, the more visible it is.

Pablo_de_Llama · 2018-04-01T21:45:08.000Z

I don't see any flickering at all with an iPhone camera.

WaylonJennings · 2018-04-02T01:31:30.000Z

I have an SC63w and I love it. But zebralight has that anoying little tint lottery that we have all heard so much about. I do not know of other companies with this problem.

BanglaBob · 2018-04-02T01:47:17.000Z

Anthon:

Long click to turn off. That’s enough to discard the manker (in my case)

Not really. On my U11, half a second press turns off the light :+1:
Compare that with 2 seconds (one eternity later !) with my Xtar H2 :rage: :rage:

ven · 2018-04-02T04:18:45.000Z

WaylonJennings:

I have an SC63w and I love it. But zebralight has that anoying little tint lottery that we have all heard so much about. I do not know of other companies with this problem.

Me to! I have found their xhp35 and xhp35 HI pretty safe tint wise, also their xhp50(not the .2). However the xp-l2 hi cri and 4500k can be overly yellow, the xhp50.2 i wont try out with the potential of too much yellow.

I dont care much for their AA lights really, not much point imho other than anyone who does not actually want to run 4.2v cells(just want to use nimh). Their 18650 lights are very compact, in fact close in size to typical 16340 size lights. So for me personally, no point in AA as the 18650 are compact enough with far more benefits(run times/out puts).

My sc5c mkII 4000k was not very nice on my eyes, i tried and tried to like it………………gave in. The sc53w which is also the xp-l2 but 4500k is tolerable.

My fav so far is the older sc62(like the design) with the luxeon T 85cri, super nice 5000k and dont care that it is only 320lm on H1. In fact , my most used is 145lm H2 and works well for most general tasks.

I dont care much for clip on clips(just hate them as they are usually junk) of the sc600’s, much prefer the secured sc62/63/64 design there.

Quite impressed with the xhp35 HI 4500k, liking that as quite a punchy little thing. Also the xhp50 5000k in the plus(both mk III as i dont want to chance the mk IV with odd little gremlins and even more potential yellow of the xhp50.2)

Some AA size lights for size comparison

18650 sc63w/16340 PK PR1 and 16340 HDS rotary hi cri

Little size line up, all 16340 up to the black D1, then 18650 till the sc5c mkII AA on the end

s2+ thrown in for size

all 18650

Overall ZL are pretty awesome, not much to not like for me. Very light(often the actual 18650 feels about the same weight as the light itself), UI i like, newer UI is better as you can program G6 and G7 to what you like of the 12 levels. So you can swap about or have all the same level to act like a single mode light. Its a way of getting around the pre flash when double tapping for the M1 /M2 levels, but flip side is it upsets the press/hold and advance through modes. Press/hold is low/med/high usually(G5), of course if you have a high level set in the L1 , then it will flow as programmed.
The PID is pretty trick, it manages heat like no other light i have experienced(inc the D4 clever UI but the D4 is 3x the lumens!!! so has to be aggressive ). The step downs are very hard to spot and the light never gets hot, just quite warm. Only when you step back up on a high level can I actually tell its ramped down! That is actually looking for it as well, not in actual use!

The ano is 2nd to none, its tough and seems actual HA unlike most chinese lights that claim it. It reminds me a little of the surefire of old HA. You drop it, hardly a mark compared to other so called HA III i have found.

Comments are all subjective, so please take with a pinch of salt, as what i like you may hate They are not perfect, but for a super light weight compact 18650 light, they come close in many ways. Tint lottery is real! By staying away from the horrid(subjective) xp-l2 of theirs, your in for a little more chance of a win

SKV89 · 2018-04-02T04:17:20.000Z

The only thing I don’t like about Manker is that the turbo mode is grouped with the blinkies. For me at least that is very annoying.

jon_slider · 2018-04-02T05:23:49.000Z

ven:

I dont care much for their AA lights really
…
My sc5c mkII 4000k was not very nice on my eyes, i tried and tried to like it………………gave in. The sc53w which is also the xp-l2 but 4500k is tolerable.

Great photos! Impressive array.

If possible, I would like to see a close range triple beam shot side by side, on a piece of white printer paper, (suggest at less than 20 lumens) of a

4000k N219b HDS,
4000k SC5c and
4500k SC53w

Anthon · 2018-04-02T06:30:46.000Z

Pablo de Llama:

Anthon:

Long click to turn off. That’s enough to discard the manker (in my case)

Its a short long click.

But I understand.

BanglaBob:

Anthon:

Long click to turn off. That’s enough to discard the manker (in my case)

Not really. On my U11, half a second press turns off the light :+1:
Compare that with 2 seconds (one eternity later !) with my Xtar H2 :rage: :rage:

kramer5150:

x2… the “long” click to turn off is not really that long… IMHO. Maybe 1/3 - 1/2 second at most.

All my flashlights turn ON and OFF with the same action and I won’t buy any flashlight that doesn’t work like that. It’s a personal preference

But apart from the long click for off, there are more differences between manker and zebralight, such as:
-Build quality, much better in zebralight
-Quality control: manker doesn’t seem to have a good QC
-Efficiency: Zebralight is a step forward here, for example the new U12 looks very inefficient
-Lumens, at least my Manker T01s: claimed 400lm in turbo but barely made 270lm in my integrating sphere, whereas my SC5W II makes 470lm measured

Pablo_de_Llama · 2018-04-02T09:08:30.000Z

Interesting!

Reading this, something occurred to me.

Compact, slim, efficient, good design overall, not very user serviceable by any metric, has one or two consistent “bugs” or “flaws”, not a lot of distinct models compared to some other manufacturers, good QA and QC.

Am I talking about Zebralight or Apple? :D

Of course, there are major differences. Apples easily break when dropped, Zebralights don’t (usually). Apple seems to be the most expensive of the well known smartphone brands, and there lots of flashlight brands more expensive than Zebralight, etc.

I just thought that it was an interesting comparison. :)

ven · 2018-04-02T12:14:10.000Z

jon_slider:

ven:

I dont care much for their AA lights really
…
My sc5c mkII 4000k was not very nice on my eyes, i tried and tried to like it………………gave in. The sc53w which is also the xp-l2 but 4500k is tolerable.

Great photos! Impressive array.

If possible, I would like to see a close range triple beam shot side by side, on a piece of white printer paper, (suggest at less than 20 lumens) of a

4000k N219b HDS,
4000k SC5c and
4500k SC53w

Thank you Jon, hope life is treating you well :+1:

I don’t have the sc5c mkII any more, as I just could not enjoy the yellow beam. I actually got a 6300k sc62 in its place and much easier on my eye(think clean/pure white , colours not too washed out nor exaggerated). It’s nicer than I actually expected, but the 5000k 62d is my preferred.

Sledgestone · 2018-04-02T13:56:57.000Z

Ven,

What’s the light in the second picture to the left of the thrunite?

WalkIntoTheLight · 2018-04-02T14:24:32.000Z

Well, I’m a Zebralight fanboy, but I also own Mankers. But as you’d expect, I think Zebralight wins on almost every count except throw and price. Manker isn’t bad, it’s just not up to the same level as Zebralight yet.

I know there’s been discussions of the “tint lottery” with Zebralight, but I’ve never been displeased with the tint I’ve received. My last purchase (the SC600w MkIV HI) has a wonderful tint! I’d say it’s pretty close to “Nichia 219” good.

I’ve never bought the “c” and “d” versions of their tints, though. I generally stick to the “w” versions, for best compromise between tint and output.

ven · 2018-04-02T14:55:13.000Z

Sledgestone:

Ven,

What’s the light in the second picture to the left of the thrunite?

Lumapower , old AA/14500 light which CRX modded to a very nice 219c 4000k.

Sledgestone · 2018-04-02T15:29:56.000Z

Trust model-1?

emarkd · 2018-04-02T15:34:11.000Z

Honestly its not even close. Manker even billed themselves as a “zebralight killer” when their first light came out, they know who their competition is, but they’re not there yet. Efficiency isn’t there, PID/regulation definitely isn’t there, UI isn’t there, build quality isn’t there. There’s just nothing out there like a Zebralight, as a total package. There’s only two places that I’ll give the nod to Manker:

Mod-ability. I do like lights I can mod and keep up to date myself, at least capable of emitter swaps with reasonable effort. Zebralights fail this test hard, but Mankers can be worked in.

Onboard charging. To be honest I usually care absolutely zero for this feature - onboard charging is useless to me. But some folks like, or even need, it. So for them, again, Zebralight isn’t the right choice.

jon_slider · 2018-04-02T17:25:44.000Z

WalkIntoTheLight:

(the SC600w MkIV HI) has a wonderful tint! I’d say it’s pretty close to “Nichia 219” good.

I would like to see a side by side beamshot. A lot of people CLAIM their flashlight has great tint, and compare it to N219. But do they post a photo?

Let me tell you, even the N219c is no match for an N219b. The 219c is certainly brighter, but its also considerably yellow/greener, as shown by the light in the middle:

And the High CRI Zebras dont even come close to an N219b in terms of Red content. Look at the R9 values, and look at the red bar
(the following images are from maukka’s posts: Lumintop Tool AAA Copper + Titanium measurements (Nichia 219B) and Zebralight SC5Fc measurements (AA, warm tint))

Also look at the spectrum, can you see how much less Red the Zebra LED produces?:

The W Zebras are not in the same league, they have lower CRI than either of the above LEDs.

Maybe someone will post photos of their W Zebra compared to an N219b

Firelight2 · 2018-04-02T17:35:49.000Z

I quite like the latest Zebralights.

Currently EDC’ing an SC64w.

It’s small and compact. At 1400 lumens, it’s not blazingly bright like my D4s, but is more practical as it doesn’t ramp down as fast and stabilizes at a higher output than the D4.

Decent drop resistance too. Dropped mine last night from about 4 feet onto a wooden floor. The light continues to function perfectly and suffered no damage… not even a scratch on the anodizing.

Pablo_de_Llama · 2018-04-02T18:02:51.000Z

Is there a way to measure estimate driver efficiency without disassembling the light, maybe by taking lumen outputs, a battery of known capacity, runtime numbers, and LED data sheets? I’d like to figure out what it is for my E03H.