"new" model LG INR18650 HG2L

SKV89 · 2019-09-05T18:10:18.000Z

Not sure I agree with you. I have been using primarily VTC6 in my flashlights that I need both good output and capacity. I use the VTC6 often for work. I don’t notice any issues after two years of use. I also been using the VTC5D for a long time for my hotrods but have since switched to Molicel P26A, which is slightly superior. According to Mooch’s test results, I don’t see any other 18650 around 3000mah performing better than the VTC6A. I bought the last 2 Vapcell VTC6A and I love them. They tested at 2983 and 2986mah. I do hope the HG2L will come close or even beat the VTC6A but I doubt it.

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SKV89 · 2019-09-06T22:20:11.000Z

I inquired with Vapcell to see if they know how the new cell performs and they said, “LG HG2L is almost the same as LG HG2”

On a side note, they might be getting in a small batch of VTC6A

I just did some output testing with the E07 XP-L HI using fully charged cells.

VTC6A 5,790 lumens
VTC5D 5,780 lumens
VTC6 5,300 lumens
Molicel P26A 5,820 lumens
Samsung 20S 5,950 lumens

Out of the bunch, I would choose the VTC6A any day followed by the P26A. I measured the VTC6A with only 150mah less capacity than the VTC6 but better performance throughout the discharge curve. P26A will perform better along the discharge curve but I measured it at 300mah less than the VTC6A.

Side note. The same E07 made 6,600 lumens with the P26A last time I tested but recently I tried putting a NCR18650GA button top in it and crushed the spring. So be very careful what cells you put in your lights. It can permanently deform your springs resulting in much less performance.

Barkuti · 2019-09-07T00:23:09.000Z

It is really amusing to watch the amount of effort and money some of you spend to gain a prawn's hair difference in a measurement. Are you going to some kind of competition to see who among you got it bigger?

SKV89 · 2019-09-07T02:39:21.000Z

It’s part of the hobby to push everything to the limits where possible. Just like people modifying cars trying to squeeze every last bit of horsepower or shave every last ounce of weight.

vapcell_Dennis · 2019-09-10T09:43:39.000Z

we sell the HG2L battery，have enough stock

RobertB · 2019-09-10T10:19:22.000Z

vapcell Dennis:

we sell the HG2L battery，have enough stock

What are your test results? Is it equivalent to a VTC6, or just a plain HG2?

vapcell_Dennis · 2019-09-10T10:25:54.000Z

RobertB:

vapcell Dennis:

we sell the HG2L battery，have enough stock

What are your test results? Is it equivalent to a VTC6, or just a plain HG2?

This is the HG2L produced at the end of 2017, similar to the performance of LG HG2 in the same period.

At present, LG HG2 technology continues to improve, capacity and power are improving.

So the performance of LG HG2L is slightly worse than that of LG HG2 in 2019.

RobertB · 2019-09-10T10:43:26.000Z

vapcell Dennis:

RobertB:

vapcell Dennis:

we sell the HG2L battery，have enough stock

What are your test results? Is it equivalent to a VTC6, or just a plain HG2?

This is the HG2L produced at the end of 2017, similar to the performance of LG HG2 in the same period.

At present, LG HG2 technology continues to improve, capacity and power are improving.

So the performance of LG HG2L is slightly worse than that of LG HG2 in 2019.

Thanks Dennis. Thats what I thought, a LG cell designated for a tool company. Just like the (yellow) LG HE4 was for Bosch cordless tools, with identical performance to the (red) HE2, except that it was supposed to be able to handle heat a little better

Pajda_cz · 2019-09-12T11:04:37.000Z

So LG HG2L samples from Nkon arrived today. One major difference which I think was not mentioned earlier is that HG2L have bottom vent. I already started some initial tests with older (but not used) HG2 sample running on the next channel of my battery tester. I hope I will post the results this weekend.

RobertB · 2019-09-12T11:23:32.000Z

Pajda cz:

So LG HG2L samples from Nkon arrived today. One major difference which I think was not mentioned earlier is that HG2L have bottom vent. I already started some initial tests with older (but not used) HG2 sample running on the next channel of my battery tester. I hope I will post the results this weekend.

Lets see a picture of that bottom vent. Never seen that in an 18650 before

Pajda_cz · 2019-09-12T11:36:32.000Z

RobertB · 2019-09-12T12:23:21.000Z

Pajda cz:

I don’t think that is a vent on the bottom. Vents are on the positive end

Pajda_cz · 2019-09-12T12:39:12.000Z

Yes it is really so called bottom vent, you can read some study about it for example in this document starting from page 43 https://ec.europa.eu/jrc/sites/jrcsh/files/eric-darcy-nasa-lessons-learned-passive-thermal-runaway-propagation-resistant-designs-spacecraft-batteries.pdf

RobertB · 2019-09-12T13:58:57.000Z

Pajda cz:

Yes it is really so called bottom vent, you can read some study about it for example in this document starting from page 43 https://ec.europa.eu/jrc/sites/jrcsh/files/eric-darcy-nasa-lessons-learned-passive-thermal-runaway-propagation-resistant-designs-spacecraft-batteries.pdf

Ah ok. Interesting article. It’s a weakened area on the bottom. Not the primary vent, but if the cell were to build enough pressure to explode, it would separate at that disk instead of splitting the sides. Always wondered what that ring was for I’ve seen on various cells.

Lishen 21700

Lightbringer · 2019-09-12T15:41:37.000Z

RobertB:

Ah ok. Interesting article. It’s a weakened area on the bottom. Not the primary vent, but if the cell were to build enough pressure to explode, it would separate at that disk instead of splitting the sides. Always wondered what that ring was for I’ve seen on various cells.

Yeh, radial electrolytic caps often have an ‘X’ scored into the bottom in case they blow.

via

en.wikipedia.org

Electrolytic capacitor

An electrolytic capacitor is a polarized capacitor whose anode or positive plate is made of a metal that forms an insulating oxide layer through anodization. This oxide layer acts as the dielectric of the capacitor. A solid, liquid, or gel electrolyte covers the surface of this oxide layer, serving as the cathode or negative plate of the capacitor. Because of their very thin dielectric oxide layer and enlarged anode surface, electrolytic capacitors have a much higher capacitance-voltage (CV) pr...

Lightbringer · 2019-09-12T15:46:45.000Z

One more…

HydrAxx · 2019-09-15T05:45:19.000Z

Big and happy news: the official datasheet for LGGhem’s HG2L cell is finally available:

https://www.imrbatteries.com/content/lg_HG2L.pdf

But seriously, nothing new, the only data / value that changes in this datasheet compared to that of Brown HG2 is the Voltage Cut-Off operation, it goes from 2.50 Volts to 2.00 Volts, which explains and confirms the rumors and the reports of the sites which indicated a better management of the current during important sag of voltage.

Pajda_cz · 2019-09-15T12:43:18.000Z

Thanks for posting datasheet HydrAxx

After initial tests I can say that there is no significant difference. In fact older “brown” LG Chem HG2 cell sample, manufactured in Dec 2016 seems to be slightly better. I added one sample of HG2L to my cycle life test, but it will take some time to get results.

LG HG2:
nominal capacity: 2.893 mAh
nominal energy: 10.603 Wh
“10s DCIR” at 50% DoD: 27.58 mOhm

LG HG2L:
nominal capacity: 2.852 mAh
nominal energy: 10.422 Wh
“10s DCIR” at 50% DoD: 29.85 mOhm

BlueSwordM · 2019-09-15T15:56:08.000Z

What did you use to measure DC IR?

Did you compensate for the contacts’ resistances?

Pajda_cz · 2019-09-15T18:29:24.000Z

BlueSwordM:

What did you use to measure DC IR?

I am using for DCIR measurement dedicated high-tech battery testers as well as some low-cost testers with proper calibration. But I think more important is to use always the same testing method, because 10 methods = 10 different results. I am a fan of a method which I personally called “10s DCIR”. The main benefit of this method is the ease of implementation, which is very straightforward and can be performed with low-cost equipment or battery testers. So I am not looking for some magic method, but for direct cell comparison under the same conditions.

If you are interested in competitor cells under the same 10s DCIR test:

Sony VTC6: 24.96 mOhm
Samsung 30Q: 24.7 mOhm

BlueSwordM:

Did you compensate for the contacts’ resistances?

Sure