New Sofirn SP60 thrower using 2S cells

LED Flashlights – General Info 21700 Flashlights
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The IF22A is $28.90USD all-in with battery right now on AliExpress after all the discounts. I believe that’s a good deal cheaper any of those. At least the ones that come with a battery. Except the c8+ I guess.

I didn’t realize all those 8a convoy drivers were buck. I thought they were linear fet for some reason. Makes sense tho. I do want an m21b now.

I want a d11 but can you seriously not get it with a magnet unless you spend $25 on the 26800 tube? What’s up with that. I mean the if22a doesn’t have aml magnet either but there’s tons of room for one. And I already have a d1.

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That was kind of cute how you schooled Dale on reflectors. lol

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Yes, it does dip a dollar below $30 sometimes on a sale. It’s $35 without a battery on the Sofirn website right now. It’s ~$40-45 on amazon (because you’re basically just paying for faster US shipping). Generally it hovers around ~$35 when not on sale. I’d still call it a light in the $30-40 range.

There’s a bigger conversation about price vs value, which often comes down to personal preferences and priorities. I’d argue that $45 for a DM11 is a better value than $28.90 for an IF22A, given the better driver/regulation especially, but also better build quality, better UI, multiple LED options, SS bezel, aux LEDs, lighted switch etc… Others might argue the IF22A is better value due to the lower price, more body color options, integrated charging, amazon availability, etc… The IF22A is less expensive, sure, but they’re still close in price when similarly configured, and at least of comparable value.

And that’s just the DM11. I think a stronger value argument might be made by something like the M21B or C8+. To that end…

I was naming lights in the $30-$40 range like I said. But I think we might have a different idea of what constitutes “a good deal cheaper”.
Just from the store page, not taking into account any ali discounts:
M21B SFT40 w/ battery - $32.50
S16 SFT40 w/battery - $33.89
M21C SFT40 w/battery - $42.50
L21B SFT40 w/battery - $38.88
C8+ SFT40 w/battery - $28.99
Z1 SFT40 w/battery - $38.27
M21A SFT40 w/battery - $31.46
All would be ~$2 less if you buy them without the bundled liitokala battery and instead add the EVE 50E battery from the convoy store.

So, fair, for the ones closer to $40, I’ll concede the IF22A at $28.90 may be considered “a good deal cheaper” - though those also throw a lot further than the IF22A (There’s that price vs value thing again).

But I wouldn’t call the IF22A “a good deal cheaper” than the M21B, or any of the others around~$35 when there’s (currently, including sales), a less-than-$4 difference between them.

I will say you’ve helped me understand why the IF22A is so popular. A lot of people do consider a ~$5-15 difference significant in the budget space, and don’t value the driver as much, or have a use case where it’s less of an issue. Still, I’d always recommend an M21B or any of the others I mentioned over the IF22A - because to me a decent driver with good regulation holds a lot of value, and I believe most people will benefit from that added value over a FET driver, even if it’s not something many people directly notice when using a light.

Anyway…uh…so how about that SP60 huh?

Sorry, I don’t think I’ve ever gone this far off topic before but I couldn’t stop typing lol. Maybe jeff and I should start a new thread on this because evidently I have lots of thoughts.

I didn’t mean to be confrontational. I guess I was expecting DB Custom to explain why an OP reflector is such a dealbreaker to them.

Though they did mention “Sofirn making the SP70 mistakes all over again!” and I don’t know exactly what that was referring to, but I do remember the SP70 had some major QC issues with the shelf being uneven and leading to burned emitters. I think it was funtastic28/piercingthedarkness who discovered that issue.

I do think it’s fair to be more wary of Sofirn and Wurkkos QC than we have been in the past. My sense is that they’ve become more popular over the past couple years and we’ve subsequently seen more QC issues, especially in the first few batches of a new release.

I bought an SP35T on launch because Jackie mentioned it had a buck+FET driver, but turned out it’s just a FET driver, so that was massively disappointing. I know it was likely just a miscommunication but I felt deceived.

I still appreciate Sofirn/Wurkkos for what they are, but I’m never buying a light on launch from them again. I’m interested in the SP60, but I’m going to wait for reviews and posts here, and if it meets performance specs, has good regulation, and the autolock is toggle-able, I may look to pick it up on a sale.

I do think the 2x 21700 form factor is nice. I thought it might be bulky, heavy, and clunky to use, but once I actually got a couple 2x21700 and 2x18650 lights in hand, I found it’s actually quite ergonomic and comfortable to carry. And VERY satisfying to flip around in your hand! Old-school club-light vibes.

And it’s awesome that the XHP70.3 HI benefits so much from 2S. I haven’t seen a single-cell light push it much more than ~4500 lumens. Crazy that 2S gets close to double that! You don’t see that with something like an SBT-90.2 . So it seems like a good LED choice for this form factor.

Found my way back on topic again, but I need to stop typing at this point lol.

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I know…my comment was in good fun, just ribbing ya a little. I won’t speak for him but suffice it to say that he’s extremely knowledgeable and skilled. :slight_smile:

I hope Sofirn isn’t slowing down too much or less concerned about quality. They seem to be tapering off a little or something but still put out solid products usually. Wurkkos just started out of the gate with QC problems from lack of testing, but they’re really receptive to input on both design/features as well as correcting problems. I’d be more apt to buy a Sofirn release sight unseen than Wurkkos, but yeah, I usually like to see some first-tester comments first (with just about any brand). It’ll be interesting to see what people think about this light and what teardowns & testing tell us.

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I have one on the way to review, although I can’t publish it until mid May when they’re mass produced.

My contact said it’s using a special tube so that unbalanced cells aren’t an issue with the USB C charging. Most likely 2x 21700 in parallel which would mean it’s using a boost driver :slight_smile:

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Cute, I rebuilt my SP70 by throwing away its textured reflector and cranking massive lumens out it’s Anduril controlled SFH55. Schools out.

16 cores and no donut hole.

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I’ve built over a thousand lights. Tried so many different things it’s really pretty staggering to think about . I was helping prototype the GT. And the GT94. I built lights around Convoy prototype reflectors (to my knowledge the reflectors that were sent to me are the only ones made) that bested the GT, Simon decided not to join the fray.

For me, mostly concentrating on a focused long range beam, a textured reflector fails to deliver. I’ve seen it and replaced them on many brands of lights.

I can only speak of my own experience though, my conditions and my parameters may not be the same as someone else’s. I never told anyone to do as I do, would actually prefer the opposite… prove out what works for you, if anything I’ve shown helps you get there, wonderful!

I do this to humor me. I tell y’all about it because, well, I talk too much.

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Special tube…? Looking forward to details and your tests!

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Here’s the comment

There is a thing to keep safely charging, seems some kind of tube.

BTW, two batteries of the same mAh can be installed in the flashlight, or two batteries of different mAh can be installed.
If there is no tube inside, for two batteries with different mAh, if one battery is fully charged first, it will not be protected, which will cause the battery to be overcharged.
If there is a tube inside, no matter which battery inside is full, it will play a protective role.

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multidie led in op reflector is not that bad, assuming it is a right reflector, solarforce got it right more than 10 years ago with l900 model, and p7 led. of course it is not as throwy as smooth reflector with single die led, but not bad at all.
auto shut off with a lockout is a deal breaker for me, when i camp i often put a light inside a paper towel roll and point it up illuminating white gazebo “roof” i often have light stay like that all night.

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It doesn’t automatically turn off though. It automatically locks itself after 1-3 minutes after it’s switched off.

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Yeah, that’s me.

I’m a dealer for Sofirn, but now I only stock the LT1S and D25LR. I removed most models because of the terrible QC issues and I was just so tired of having problem after problem. I switched over to mainly Convoy and wow what a difference.

I perform what I would call “the world’s most thorough QC check” before they’re sold, and the number of issues found on the Sofirn/Wurkkos stock was too many to count. At times I’d receive boxes of models that all had issues that I had to fix myself, sounds bit dishonest to report a whole box as defective, so I just took it upon myself to fix them. Issues with defective charging, drivers, scratches covered up, non conductive lube to un-anodized threads, dirty threads causing flickering.

Great value from Sofirn when you get a working one, but yeah, I’d never risk buying large stock numbers again.

Convoy on the other hand has been great, no where near the issues I had with Sofirn.

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Hmm…so tube maybe changing from series to parallel?

Side note, I just randomly discovered that Sofirn has created a youtube channel. Just two videos on it right now, same light, with a couple minute showcase and a 30 second marketing clip. They actually did a pretty good job…has some energy and will probably be great on product pages.

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Can you link me to their channel?

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Here ya go. Just the SP35T for now. Seems to me that Barry had a channel in the past, too, if I’m not mistaken.

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Link for “Barry Lee” YouTube Channel:

https://www.youtube.com/@barrylee1869/videos


My favorite Barry Lee video, “BLF Q8 and Sofirn Q8 Extended Tubes”:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmeRWGCQN6I

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Just wondering, would you know what kind of driver does the Amutorch XT45 use? (let’s assume the SFT40 and the SBT90.2 LED variants of the XT45)?

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I was seriously counting on those Q8 extension tubes to happen! Built scratch made lights counting on it, but then, no. Never saw even one. :frowning:

Would still love to see em.

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The Amutorch XT45, confusingly, has a several variants all using the XT45 name:

  • The SBT90.2 XT45 uses a reverse clicky tail switch, and a FET driver.
    • There is an older SST-40 version that uses this host and I don’t know what driver it has, but possibly FET too. I don’t know if they made an SFT-40 version of this one.
  • The newer SFT-40, SST-40, and Fresnel (which uses the Yinding 5050) versions are dual switch with a mechanical forward clicky and side e-switch.
    • The newer SST-40 and SFT-40 versions have a silver bezel, and I’m almost certain they use a buck driver based on their other lights and reviews, though I don’t have one in hand to confirm.
    • The Fresnel version has a black bezel and I’m not sure what driver, but the 1lumen review did show good stabilization.
  • The XHP70.2, XHP50.3 HI, and NB90.16 versions all have a silver bezel and are side e-switch only.
    • The XHP70.2 and XHP50.3 HI of course have a boost driver.
    • The NB90.16 version has a Buck+FET driver.

The NB90.16 version (which is what Amutorch calls the SFH55 for some reason) is quite excellent. Not really a thrower though with only ~560m throw, but also 9000+ lumens in such a small package is really nice at medium-long-ish distances since you light up such a massive area. Sustains an impressive ~1800 lumens too (according to 1lumen), with cool white but decent tint. I think it’s a bit pricier than the SFT-40 version, around $50, but it’s a lot of performance for the money - both a ton of fun as a hot rod, and surprisingly practical as a jacket-pocket hybrid floody-thrower. Of course as a dedicated pocket thrower the SFT-40 might be better since the NB90.16 does step down fairly quick from heat on turbo.

Suffice to say I did not know who I was talking to lol. I’ve since clicked on his profile, and my original response to his comment is pretty funny in hindsight lol.

Huh. So yea, I suppose hitting specs might be a bit harder then. Could they potentially make a single-cell version then? That might be neat.

Interesting to hear your experience. Yea. I do like some of their models as budget lights, but I can see all that being a massive headache as a dealer. I wonder how some other dealers do with them here in the US, though there aren’t many. At least their customer service, at least in my experience with them, is not terrible. Not the best, but they were fairly responsive and quick in sending out a replacement to me. Though that was a while ago so things may change as they have grown as a company I believe.

Sounds badass. So you swapped it with a smooth reflector? Is there a post or beamshots on this one?

IIRC, a textured/OP reflector throws about ~8% less than a smooth reflector, is that your experience? 8% isn’t nothing, and certainly if the focus is long range smooth is the way to go. I do generally prefer smooth but it depends on the LED and what the light is for. I think some manufacturers use OP sometimes because they don’t have their LEDs consistently well-centered, so an OP reflector can kinda hide artifacts a bit and make up for less-than-perfect manufacturing.

Same lol. I am also not exactly known as the hallmark of brevity…

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I can’t seem to locate a smooth reflector that will fit in the SP70. I am currently using a diamond faceted textured reflector from Illumination Machines, in part because it’s comparatively thin aluminium construction was easy to shorten with scissors.

Sofirn used a wide but short reflector that doesn’t meet norma parabolic standards. I will quite likely sand the texture out of their stock reflector and hand polish it.

That will, almost assuredly, result in a lot of wasted effort and a lousy beam… so I’m still looking for a better option that I can adapt to the strange dimensions of the SP70.

In the meantime, other projects are hastily being addressed in the limited time before I go under the robot. :wink:

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