Olight S1 Mini High CRI and Utorch S1 Mini NW, now w N219b and E21A

Geuzzz · 2018-05-25T18:50:23.000Z

Congrats on the light.

Do you really need a minus green filter with that SW40?

jon_slider · 2018-05-25T19:00:51.000Z

Geuzzz:

Do you really need a minus green filter with that SW40?

I like it better with the filter, makes it less yellow.
The SW40 had a yellow cast, otoh the SW45 has a purple cast (and is WAY more pink too)
In the evening I find the SW45 cooler than necessary, otoh, during the day the SW45 is not too warm, for me.

I plan to get another Utorch S1 Mini modded to SW40 9080… that will take a while, the light is headed for Bali

Geuzzz · 2018-05-25T19:07:27.000Z

Maybe I should order myself some minus green filter to play with. Bali, I can guess to wich member than :+1:

jon_slider · 2018-05-25T20:02:21.000Z

Lee filters are fun to experiment with… here are my notes where to buy, etc

http://shop.leefiltersusa.com/Swatch-Book-Designers-Edition-SWB.htm

For heat concerns, Lee makes a Zircon line that is heat resistant:

LEE Filters

Zircon Filters - LED Light Filters

Explore Zircon Filters from LEE. Designed to fine-tune lighting inconsistency & last 200X longer than standard filters. Browse our LED Lighting Filters.

The 802 Zircon Minus Green reduces lumens by 25, that would be closest to the 1/2 minus Green, that reduces by 28

Lee 248 Half minus green: 71.5%
Zircon 802: 75%

Zircon 803: 79.9%
Lee 249 -Quarter minus green : 81.5%
Zircon 804: 83.6%

Zircon 805: 86.6%
Lee 279 -Eighth minus green : 87.2%

Discussed here

LeeFilters Swatch Book for $.01 from LeeFiltersUSA BudgetLightForum Deal Alerts

Got the Lee filter samples from Valor today. Tried it with a diffused Xiaomi USB light, that has a greenish tint (gets worse with higher output modes). Measured on the highest of the five modes. The diffusing filters (a lot of different kinds) also seem very cool. Three different minus green filters tested: minus eighth, quarter and half. [image] Light loss No filter: 100 % 1/8: 88.8 % 1/4: 83.8 % 1/2: 73.7 % Color temperature shifts a bit lower with the filters. Here’s the CRI data. N…

the values I find useful, for each CCT, and what they cost in brightness

Examples of with and without Lee on a pair of sm303 9050

Nichia 219B 4500k D220 9080 CRI Emitter output test by Texas_Ace; Amazing tint and CRI! Output is what you would expect. Flashlight Modding and DIY Parts

I like Lee minus green filters [image] [image] I don’t understand duv, yet, but, I can see that the Greens (R3, R4, R5 and R11) are taller than the Red, Yellow, and Pink (R9, R10, R13), on the Green tinted Oslon… while on the Pink tinted Nichia the Red, Yellow and Pink bars are not shorter than the Green bars… images clipped from maukka’s plots [image] looking at the relative size of the red vs green bars, I would expect all these LEDs to have a green tint [image] and they do: (pic is f…

Geuzzz · 2018-05-25T20:28:36.000Z

Thnx! Will look into it.

jon_slider · 2018-05-27T04:22:55.000Z

toddcshoe:

I believe on the Utorch that the black centering disk as well as the lens itself, once the bezel is screwed back on, pushes the MCPCB down so the thermal paste can do it’s work. If left without any downward pressure you might run the risk of burning it up if the MCPCB separates from the shelf and has no contact to it. Which it might do if bouncing around in a pocket or what not. I could be wrong but check it out. Don’t want anything giving you the smoke of death or anything.

My Utorch S1 Mini w N219b has a problem I have not figured out yet, but it may be related to that thermal paste comment.

Several times today, the light has turned itself off after a few seconds of use. When I try to click on, I get either zero light, or a very dim flickering moonlight that will not advance modes if I click.

I fixed it once by slapping it half a dozen times. Not reliable.
I “fixed” it twice by moving the LED board sideways gently from a couple different directions, in an attempt to smear the thermal paste.

It is possible there is poor contact, and the thermal regulation mode is taking over. Not sure yet.

this is the first installment in Mystery of the Self Dimming Utorch.

stay tuned for the next episonde

ok, now its “fixed” again… modes change, turns on and off, strobe works at the end, do not watch if you get seizures

I took of the lens and slid the led board side to side a little, and now it works again. I wonder if it would like more thermal paste? It is assembled correctly, to maintain pressure on the black centering ring, with the aspheric lens on top of the centering ring, and the O ring between the lens and the bezel.

I dont see any loose solder joints or loose wire. Battery is at 4.0v and the built in Utorch battery check flashes 3 times.
The mystery answer will be published shortly. Speculation notwithstanding.

jon_slider · 2018-05-27T18:45:14.000Z

Ok, the light worked for the rest of the evening on moon, low and Medium. I did not try turbo.
This morning I did a test of Turbo and after 30 seconds the light stepped down to medium. Battery was a 3.9v and the Utorch battery test gave 2 flashes.

I tried Turbo again, but after 3 seconds the light turned off and would not turn back on. I discovered the battery was at 0 volts, the protection circuit had tripped. I installed a fresh battery, the light works fine.

Charged the battery that was at 0 volts for 1 minute, then took it off charger and measured voltage at 3.9v again. The light works again with that battery.

My present theory is that once the light gets to 3.8v, which corresponds with 1 flash of the battery check mode on the light, it wont maintain Turbo, and repeating attempts to run turbo, can trigger the battery protection circuit.

Conclusion is, dont fire turbo again if the light steps down to low from Turbo after a few seconds, and the battery test flashes 2 times (3.9v) or less.

Next time I cause the light to shut down completely, assume protection is triggered, install a fresh battery.

a pic showing the Utorch with fresh battery working normally, while the other battery is being charged (in a PT16 that has built in USB charging).

note to self, avoid Turbo and Strobe. Stick to Moon, Low, and Medium.
Use the built in battery check, and if it drops to 2 flashes, avoid Turbo and strobe completely.

unable to leave a good thing alone,
I did another test with the fresh charged battery at 4.1v and the Utorch battery level flashing 4 times. Ran Turbo for 75 seconds, on my light meter, and watched the initial brightness drop to 50% (normal stepdown after 1 minute). Turned off the light, the Utorch battery check showed 3 flashes, and the battery tested at 3.98v on my meter. Moon, Low, Medium, all working normally.

moral of the story, Turbo is Not my batteries friend.

Now back to our regularly scheduled Flashing… Happy SunDay!

jon_slider · 2018-05-28T01:44:40.000Z

New observation
After using Turbo the light dimmed itself to Low.

being a slow learner, I fired Turbo again, which caused the light to turn completely off.
I said the usual prayers, wiggled the LED board, and tried again. Still Zero Light.

Removed battery, tested Voltage, result 0 Volts…

guess why?
ok, Ill tell you why:

The LVP had been triggered by the repeated attempts to use Turbo when the battery was at 3.8v

Is it possible that the N219b is triggering LVP and the stock LED does not?

Solution, either dont use Turbo w the N219b, or switch to unprotected batteries… hmmm

joechina · 2018-05-28T18:30:51.000Z

How much current draws your Nichia? I measured 1,57A with thin standards probes off my multimeter. Can you measure yours? (A clamp meter would be better, the leads off the multimeter can result in a to low amp reading)

What I tried:
I tried to trigger Under voltage Protection.
But normally the thermal protection of the lamp kicks in. I had step downs from high/turbo to low after multiple times running high.

With a full battery I need 3 times High for about one minute (the Utorch stepps back if to hot or dimms slowly down after 40 seconds. You will see a step down but you won’t notice the dimming) to heat it up. From that on the thermal protection of the lamp kicked in and it switched to low.
So after every 40 seconds I kicked it back to high, when it steped to low. I lost count on this, but I did this ca. 12 times.
Checked Battery 3.3V, let the lamp cool down, to be shure the step down is not thermal related.
I could run High, after 40 sec it switched to low = seems a standard after 3.6V and no thermal reason

From there on I let it run on Mid with 100lm while writing this LVP triggerd, Battery had 0V

I plugged USB in for 5 sec (to reset the protection) and it had 2.96V

With this I could trigger High. I switched it immediately OFF and read 2.95V
Resting the battery let it reach 3.04V (Edit: I didn’t charged it), tried High and after 2 seconds low voltage protection from the battery kicked in.
0V on the battery measured.

Resting for 15 min, only reseted circuit (Edit: I didn’t charged it): Battery recovered to 3.06V. High for only 2 sec, then LVP

Result:
I could run 15 to 18 times HIGH for about 40 to 60 seconds.
Somewhere below 2.95V LVP off the battery kicked in.

Don’t know what your lamp has.
It could be your Nichia draws more Amps.
There are tolerances of the protection circuit in the battery.
Could it be thermal instead of LVP? I don’t know if you must also reset a thermal trigger with a charger.

Joe

jon_slider · 2018-05-28T18:40:31.000Z

Thank you Joe, very helpful.

Yes, Im starting to think that the 0 Volts condition that my Utorch 16340 USB Protected battery achieved from triggering Turbo at 3.9v, was caused by Thermal protection In the Battery (not the light), and not Low Voltage Protection in the Battery. (the light has no built in LVP)

Here is a discussion about currents and differences in heat production of N219b and XPL.

[QUOTE=ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond;4646979]the thermal resistance of the N219B… will be much less efficient at dissipating the heat than the XP-L so the N219B will run significantly hotter
[/quote]

I dont fully grasp the info, and have no skills in measuring the current draw of the N219b, but it seems like the N219b is capable of triggering the thermal protection in the Utorch Protected and USB rechargeable battery.

I have avoided using Turbo completely for the past 24 hours. I have not had any dimming, and no 0 Volt conditions.

IF I was to switch to unprotected IMR cells, then use of Turbo would not trigger a 0 Voltage condition in the battery. I think the light will still use its own built in Thermal protection to dim the light, as you report, after 40 seconds on a full charge, and after 3 seconds once the battery gets below 3.8v.

Your report is very helpful, especially since you let the battery cool off between Turbo heat build ups. So your report that LVP kicks in around 3.0 volts is great info, that I had not yet discovered on my own.

I really appreciate your thorough and detailed testing and reporting.

fwiw, I have no regrets having the N219b 4500k 9080 instead of the stock XPL. The Nichia has awesome Red Rendering, which is what I wanted. When I had the XPL Red things looked brown. I could still tell them apart from other colors, but the N219b makes the Red things really POP!

I have no problem with the super pink and super violet Tints of the N219b in actual use. My brain adapts pretty easily, as long as I dont do white paper comparisons with other LED lights. The same was true with the stock LED btw, its piss yellow tint is not noticeable in actual use, as long as the light is used alone, and is not being compared to other LEDs.

It is a new education for me, to realize that the N219b runs a lot hotter than the XPL. Since I did not buy the aspheric light to use on Turbo, the extra heat is not a problem, the way I use the light indoors at lower levels.

One thing I really like about the Utorch is how low the moonlight is, even in stock form it reads just 0.2 lumens on my meter. The N219b dropped it to 0.1 lumens, and Im glad. It is plenty of light when I wake in the dark to go to the bathroom, dodging cat toys and hairballs in my half sleep.

Now for some rampant speculation. I wonder if the heat generated by the N219b is inversely proportional to the reduction in Lumen output compared to the stock XPL. The N219b dropped output by almost 50%. I wonder if it is also running twice as hot. This is the largest lumen drop I have measured on any of my few converted lights. When the light went 0 Volts with the N219b, it was very warm in the hand, but not painful. When I opened the lens, it smelled a little toasty in there, but so far, no magic smoke has escaped

joechina · 2018-05-28T17:46:20.000Z

jon_slider:

…

I tried Turbo again, but after 3 seconds the light turned off and would not turn back on. I discovered the battery was at 0 volts, the protection circuit had tripped. I installed a fresh battery, the light works fine.

Charged the battery that was at 0 volts for 1 minute, then took it off charger and measured voltage at 3.9v again. The light works again with that battery.

My present theory is that once the light gets to 3.8v, which corresponds with 1 flash of the battery check mode on the light, it wont maintain Turbo, and repeating attempts to run turbo, can trigger the battery protection circuit.
…

I can trigger High down to 3V. The trick is below 3.8V you had to switch the lamp off, then you can start the lamp one time in High. It stays in High for 40 seconds and stepps down.

joechina · 2018-05-28T18:43:46.000Z

jon_slider:

I think the light will still use its own built in Thermal protection to dim the light, as you report, after 40 seconds on a full charge, and after 3 seconds once the battery gets below 3.8v.

Sorry no, 40sec, not 3sec, even below 3.8V. I had always the first reaction after 40sec from the lamp. That went down to 3V. Around 3V the battery kicked it off.
I guess the controller does the first measurement or decision generally at 40sec

Joe

jon_slider · 2018-05-28T18:56:38.000Z

great info Joe

your 40 second turbo runs, contrasted with the 3 second runs I was getting when the battery was hot, suggests the issue I experienced was not LVP, it was OHP (overheat protection in the battery), while the 40 second step down you experience is more likely the OHP built into the light…

I just confirmed that my light also steps down from Turbo after 40 seconds. the battery is at two flashes atm and measures below 3.7v while hot, and rebounds about 3.83v after about a minute. So yes, I confirm Turbo works for 40 seconds for me too.

you are helping me realize that the protection triggering and 0 Volt issue seems to be Over Heating protection being triggered, not Voltage sag during high drain

so changing to an unprotected cell might let me run the light hotter longer, but thats not necessary for my application, and I really like the convenience of the Utorch included USB rechargeable batteries.

Imo lights with USB batteries make good gifts to newbies. It means I can gift a light to someone with no LiIon charger or experience. The overdischarge protection is also important for a newbie

enjoy your lights!

jon_slider · 2018-05-30T03:38:40.000Z

More weirdness

last night when the Utorch had a fresh charged battery in it, the light dimmed from medium and would not switch modes. I was not using Turbo, and the light was Not Hot.

I removed the battery and it tested at 4.04 volts, the protection circuit had Not triggered. After reinserting the battery the light still did not switch modes and only came on in the dim flickery mode.

I removed the bezel, Oring, lens and centering ring and pushed the LED board side to side to smear the thermal paste and make sure the board and wires were not shorting to the body. Reassembled and after that the light is working normally again.

So, the problem seems to suggest an issue with the thermal paste, not the battery protection circuit, and not the level of battery charge. Im thinking the next move is to unsolder the led board and increase the amount of thermal paste, but Im not sure if thats the right move yet, and Im not experienced nor equipped to do the job.

The person that did the mod has offered to help, I just was hoping not to have to ship the light back… But if it goes into dim mode again Im going to have to.

still unclear if the problem is the N219b running hotter, or triggering the battery protection, or if its just an assembly issue, a need for more thermal paste… will share what I learn.

For now, Im going to AssUme the light is “fixed” (again), and keep using it. Im not Egyptian but I do live in DeNial part time.

this post needs more pics
3000k N219c w 1/4 minus green lee filter, 4000k N219b 9050, 4500k N219b 9080

Geuzzz · 2018-05-30T04:58:26.000Z

I don’t know what the problem is. But I am pretty sure it’s has nothing to do with the amount of thermal paste. Should work even without it.

Sounds more like a contact problem, driver problem or maybe a slightly broken ledwire.

jon_slider · 2018-05-30T06:26:02.000Z

Geuzzz:

Sounds more like a contact problem, driver problem or maybe a slightly broken ledwire.

Thank you for helping me brainstorm.

Regarding battery contact problem, yes that is a good possibility.

The battery was rattling because I took the tail magnet out. The magnet supports the spring.

So I put the magnet back in and now the battery does not rattle. And the light is working normally today.
.
.
I will keep the battery Spring supported by the magnet and Hope the problem goes away. No failures today since I put the magnet back in last night.

jon_slider · 2018-05-31T04:05:15.000Z

Well, the light failed again. Sad.

It is very inconsistent. Sometimes it works normally for a day, then it goes into dim mode and wont switch modes. Im thinking of asking the modder to look it over, maybe resolder the wires… not sure.

jon_slider · 2018-06-05T19:34:46.000Z

Problem solved! Thanks to the excellent customer service of Texas_Ace. He found the white wire was shorting to the LED board. It was not his fault, but he would not let me pay him for the fix. His words were “I stand behind my work.” Im very grateful.

I think I created the issue when I tried to use a flat lens instead of the stock aspheric. I actually prefer the aspheric, so I wont be opening the light to screw up any connections in the future… woohoo… Love my sw45 9080 Utorch S1 Mini. I just wish it had the Olight UI and the ability to memorize moonlight, but, Im flexible, no light is perfect.

I just made an offer on another Olight S1 Mini High CRI, to replace the one I passed on to a friend. The tint and CCT are not ideal for indoors, but its a good option for outdoors. Gotta love the Olight UI, including the ability to memorize moonlight. As far as the green tint, I solve that with a bit of Lee 1/2 minus green filter attached w double sided tape (reversible hackmod).

jon_slider · 2018-06-07T23:59:07.000Z

Clemence is modifying a couple more Utorch for me, he shared these pics and I [edited his comments for clarity], to help anyone else that may want to modify a Utorch S1 Mini.
—-
Completely disassembled

The driver relies on a small wire (white) for grounding. Without proper grounding it will flicker or not work at all.

To connect the grounding wire to the body Utorch uses a small screw soldered to the white wire. [the screw was not tight, it should be] …

…the MCPCB is … pressed to the LED shelf… by the black plastic reflector… Most of the heat transfer is done by the white thermal paste. Better thermal paste is usually grey colored.

Screw removed

—-

fariflash · 2018-06-13T04:37:16.000Z

What is the difference between Olight S1 Mini and Olight S1A Mini Baton? I am a little bit confused about those two. When I was reading this review Olight S1A Mini EDC 600 Lumens Flashlight- Users Ratings & Review I wasn’t clear between them.