[PART 1] Official BLF GT Group Buy thread. Group buy officially closed! Lights shipping.

Theodore41 · 2017-08-17T08:36:45.000Z

I see…

AdrianWA · 2017-08-17T09:30:11.000Z

So everyone needs to pay 14 dollars up front? To whom?

The_Miller · 2017-08-17T09:33:20.000Z

Yes to Neal

Essexman · 2017-08-17T10:26:04.000Z

Customs fees and charges are the buyers responsibility.

Even with extra charges this light is a very good deal.

The group buy team and light manufacturer have already gone far beyond what they should be expected to do, to help BLF members.

I understand in the US it’s a federal offence to falsify customs documents.

The_Miller · 2017-08-17T10:43:58.000Z

Yes I think so too, LT wanted a down payment so paying in two was good, keeping the first payment under the tax threshold is OK but also as far as I will take it.
If one gets taxed it is according to local laws and should be paid, simple as that.
If one does not want to pay taxes on the GT, just don’t order and ask to be removed from the list

Texas_Ace · 2017-08-20T13:34:14.000Z

Lumintops responsibility with the customs/duties/taxes on the light ends when it ships.

You have a choice of DHL in a single shipment or 2 smaller shipments and they will not include an invoice in the package is the way I understand it. They will label the 2 package shipping arrangement as $14 each on the customs.

Everything else is up to you, if the package is taxed and you refuse it, that is your fault and the shipping cost will not be refunded nor will another light be shipped. It is not even remotely fair to make LT eat peoples mistakes and inability to pay taxes. For example, if I was going to be changed taxes and I could not afford them, I would not order it.

I also 100% agree that any talk beyond this is unpleasant, which is why I have not participated till now.

- You buy the light, you are responsible for figuring out if there will be taxes, customs of duty charges for your selected shipping method.

- You are responsible for paying any and all fees, taxes or otherwise. Add those into the cost of the light before deciding if it is worth it for you, there are plenty of people to take your place if not.

- If you refuse a package you will not be refunded the shipping or paypal costs as that would cause a massive loss to lumintop and could easily end them ever wanting to work with us ever again.

- If you refuse half a shipment, you will only be refunded part of the total cost depending on which part is returned to lumintop

- Any refunds will not be sent until Lumintop received the refused package back to verify that it was indeed refused, anything else would be unfair to LT, you don’t expect them to send you the light without payment, they can not be expected to do that.

Theodore41 · 2017-08-17T11:42:52.000Z

You told them all!

RotorHead64 · 2017-08-17T13:06:21.000Z

Thank you Texas_Ace

Keisari · 2017-08-17T13:57:12.000Z

Theodore41:

Keisari:

……………
A false customs declaration is potentially much worse than still being randomly taxed. It’s a criminal offense and (depending on country, more or less theoretically) could result in prosecution.
………………………

You know that the declaration is done by the seller and not by the buyer…

Oh, on the contrary. I was more worried about the declaration given by the buyer, the recipient. More specifically there was discussion on forging an invoice or fraudulently presenting an unrelated or incomplete document to make the product value appear low, thus avoiding taxes and duties.

I didn’t mean the notoriously inaccurate and untrue formal stuff printed on a shipment. I mean the actual declaration of contents and price paid that is requested by the the customs and given by buyer in case the shipment is processed more than just letting it pass. Only a few flashlights and similar items will get his process, but large and expensive looking examples have a higher risk.

Around here and illegal or restricted items aside, most often they look for items that may exceed import VAT limits that are typically lower than import duty limits. Varies a lot by country even within EU.

Some parcel services also want to have everything declared in some countries of destination, and what I stated earlier applies to regular postal service.

Joey_Adams · 2017-08-17T13:47:47.000Z

What did you expect? He is, after all, from the United State of Texas! Well said TA. No reason for LT or the blf contributors to have any undue liability.

fuzun · 2017-08-17T13:53:14.000Z

Texas_Ace:

Lumintops responsibility with the light ends when it ships. You have a choice of DHL in a single shipment or 2 smaller shipments and they will not include an invoice in the package is the way I understand it. They will label the 2 package shipping arrangement as $14 each on the customs.

Everything else is up to you, if the package is taxed and you refuse it, that is your fault and the shipping cost will not be refunded nor will another light be shipped. It is not even remotely fair to make LT eat peoples mistakes and inability to pay taxes. For example, if I was going to be changed taxes and I could not afford them, I would not order it.

I also 100% agree that any talk beyond this is unpleasant, which is why I have not participated till now.

You buy the light, you are responsible for figuring out if there will be taxes, customs of duty charges for your selected shipping method.
You are responsible for paying any and all fees, taxes or otherwise.
If you refuse a package you will not be refunded the shipping or paypal costs as that would cause a massive loss to lumintop and could easily end them ever wanting to work with us ever again.

Yeah this sums up the situation. I agree with you and I am not saying that Lumintop needs to be involved in this tax avoid thing. But you know Chinese sellers generally do their best for this situation. Maybe Lumintop is one of them and they may take some extra caution for this if we talk them. (not saying we should talk)

Anyway, I will decide whether or not to buy this light if you tell me,

1) Exact shipping cost ($50 ?) . For the case packages go back.
2) Is that certain that both packages will have $14 written on them?
3) Exact Paypal or any other cost for refunding.
4) Weight of the two packages.

These are all of my questions for tax. I will not ask more question related to this topic because I agree that it is unpleasant.

If I can not and if I let the packages go back, I will (of course) get the refund with any fees deducted. I can not complain about this. But I want to find out the total fee to be deducted to decide whether or not to buy it like I have said (If I refuse to pay tax).

But if you say that even though fees will be deducted from refund, you need to accept paying tax before buying. I think this is unfair.

Texas_Ace · 2017-08-17T14:08:49.000Z

fuzun:

[1) Exact shipping cost ($50 ?) . For the case packages go back.
2) Is that certain that both packages will have $14 written on them?
3) Exact Paypal or any other cost for refunding.
4) Weight of the two packages.

1: The actual shipping costs will vary by destination and method. Exact costs will depend on final weights and other factors. I would take a VERY rough guess and say it is around $30-$50. I have very little experience with china shipping prices except what I have learned in the last few months though.
2: Yes, as I understand it LT will put the cost of the lights as $14 for each of the 2 package shipment
3: This will be determined after the fact but I would take another guess that fees for paypal and the like would be between $5 - $10 depending on the price you paid and exactly how paypal works in China, might have higher fees over there. Call it $10 to cover the time and effort that lumintop would have to spend dealing with the returns as well.
4: The total weight of the light is around 2.2kg + packaging. figure that will be roughly split between 2 packages, it will most likely not be an even split. Then add any cells if those were ordered as well.

You are obviously welcome to make your own decisions on what to do about the taxes but they are yours alone to make.

If you figure it is worth the risk, then that is up to you. Seeing as I would expect the total deduction from any refund to be at least $50, that is a lot of money to throw away vs just paying the taxes IMHO.

g_sintornillos · 2017-08-17T17:40:29.000Z

BobbyMK:

What he said.

I am one of the ones who also can’t import the light without import tax but i totally agree with The miller and Keisari.

If you can’t afford to pay/don’t want to pay import tax don’t try stupid things, where i live and i guess every other country trying to import item with false invoice is illegal and might end up with hefty fine and seized item and for me the risk is not worth at all.

With that said i accepted my faith and will not try to do any stupid stuff while trying to import the light,

+1

In my country to enter any package can not avoid the import procedures in any way, must be made prior to arrival in the country

The declaration must present the invoice, proof of payment (Paypal) and photocopies of the credit card and identity document, must match the name of the buyer in each of them, must also match the number of the card in proof of payment
This way Big Brother can verify if everything is true
There is no chance of evading

I am going to use DHL shipping

PS. I also need as soon as possible the tracking number to fill out and submit the declaration before the arrival of the package to the country

Jimmy007 · 2017-08-17T18:01:47.000Z

One has to pay taxes, the other one no. It’s lucky or Country Rules so there is no space to discuss about it
Lets do pay 14$ and wait… When we will have to pay 14$?

The_Miller · 2017-08-17T18:07:06.000Z

Yes
We are checking some last things and when it all is settled will prepare a PM.
I hope Mr Scott and SB have figured out sending bulk PMs soon

adsum · 2017-08-17T19:54:24.000Z

After paying the $14 first part payment how much prepare time in advance we get before we have to pay the last part?
It would be nice to know because there has been this really short only 5 day window to make payments.
Easier to do with smaller amounts but sudden bigger amounts within only 5 days to be paid may sometimes be difficult to get sufficient amount of money to Paypal account on time.

cccpull · 2017-08-17T20:28:25.000Z

The Miller, is the core list going to be updated?

The_Miller · 2017-08-17T21:44:25.000Z

cccpull:

The Miller, is the core list going to be updated?

Yes of course, just very busy and hardly sitting behind a PC these days. But will do tomorrow.

The_Miller · 2017-08-17T21:45:48.000Z

Adsum, not clear, but there will be time in between.

adsum · 2017-08-17T22:09:28.000Z

Okay,just trying sort out in which order to buy these upcoming special lights.
BLF GT is on a top of my list but still trying get the other ones too.
I just hope that not all have such tight timelines when to buy or at least not too many surface in a same month too close together.