Realised the communities are a bit closer than I realised.

[itsonlyme]

Look up the history of aspartame.

[18sixfifty]

I found this forum when looking for something to use my spare vaping batteries with. Before that I didn’t even know that 14500’s or 18650 batteries were used in flashlights. Now I’m a moderator on both a flashlight site and a vaping site, along with other members from this site. So the overlap is pretty big actually. Safety of course is a big issue for both but possibly even more important for vaping, considering that you use them while they are in your mouth. With the advent of sub ohm vaping it’s become way more important too. I’m really surprised that more knuckleheads haven’t blown up their e-cig mods.

I don’t think the addiction studies on nicotine alone are terribly complete. But from what I have read it’s not nearly as addictive as cigs by themselves. If it were anyone who switched to a smokeless delivery system from cigs would be successful. But it doesn’t work that way at all. The patch and gum in particular are a poor way of quitting cigs. E-cigs work better than either of them but I suspect it’s simply because they also mimic the act of smoking and not because of the nicotine. As a nicotine delivery system they don’t work particularly well. You get way more nicotine from the gum or patches than you do with the very highest concentrations of vaping liquid. However, even though e-cigs don’t give you as much nicotine they do in fact have a much higher success rate than either the patches or the gum.

E-cigs by themselves have not shown to be addictive but I don’t know if that is because they simply don’t deliver enough nicotine or because nicotine is not that addictive. although it’s impossible to know the long term effects of vaping it is a known fact that it’s safer that cigs. That much at least has been proven.

Still the best way to avoid any addiction is to simply not start in the first place. Same could be said for flashlights, so watch out!!

[WarHawk-AVG]

Yup…gotta have something to put those not good enough for vaping batteries in….then started building VERY high power flashlights…

[Keisari]

Yes, vaping and custom flashlights are quite related. I do both, too. Since this thread is now about medical issues, I can't help myself. Sorry.

@sonntag

I am aware that cigarettes are addictive. Is it possible that pure nicotine in e cigs is not addictive ? Is nicotine really similar to niacin ? Does nicotine really have any effect on preventing future brain disease ? I know the cigarette companies were free-basing the nicotine, making it more addictive, I am asking about nicotene salts.

Pure nicotine is addictive. Nicotine addiction is just one component in a cigarette habit, but it's there. I'm addicted to nicotine after years of not smoking cigarettes except a few random times. I take other preparations every day and pretty much every waking hour. Quitting smoking was hard, but I could do it. Quitting nicotine... haven't managed yet. Oddly, some heavy smokers seem to be not be actual nicotine addicts.

No, nicotine is not similar to niacin.

Yes, nicotine has beneficial effects on health. These include protection against some diseases that involve cognitive impairment. Most recreational drugs have significant health effects, both beneficial and detrimental. Oh, we could drop the "recreational" part here. The same goes with pretty much any medication.

And yes, nicotine products other than cigarettes are addictive, including pharmaceutical products, vaporizer fluid and tobacco products other than cigarettes. Very traditional and organic cigars are addictive. Oral tobacco products are addictive, even the traditional ones that are much older than the modern predatory tobacco industry.

@sonntag

My osteopathic doctor told me that European doctors have discovered that ASA, naproxen, ibuprofen prevent the body’s self healing of joint injuries leading to the increase in hip and knee replacements.

I don't think that's very important. Long term use of NSAIDs is quite fatal through other means, and should be avoided whenever possible and at least moderated when necessary.

@InfinitusEquitas

Maybe it's similar to why athletes tend to not like taking pain meds for muscle soreness... since they act as anti inflammatory they prevent the natural repair process from taking place, on top of masking the pain allowing further damage to take place.

At least there is correlation in AS sufferers having less permanent damage to spine when they have a history of NSAID (ab)use. This is a result of the natural repairing(or damaging) process slowing down.

@Jubeldum

I found that Ibuprofen is what gave me relief where those expensive drugs would not. I had her switch me from Vicodin to Vicoprofen so when I got to the point I wanted to scream, I would take three 200mg tablets of Ibuprofen along with a Vicoprofen. I consider that a Motrin 800 with a little kick. Acetaminphen and naproxen sodium are good for nothing other than burning holes in your stomache and destoying your liver.

Acetaminophen is quite liver-friendly when used well below the typical and horrifying "safe" limits. Most analgetic drugs are effective on some patients and on some types of pain. Neither of the two you mention are very reasonable choices for most chronic pain.

You should remember that ibuprofen is not actually safer to your digestive tract than other NSAIDs such as Naproxen Na. It kind of is, in the same sense that "light" cigarettes are safer than "full flavour". It's like shooting at one's foot because it's kind of harmless compared to shooting through a knee. New generation coxibs might be even less dangerous to your stomach and more effective depending on the condition, but it's early to say they're safer overall. Could be the opposite.

NSAIDs (including ibuprofen and mostly just that) are also by themselves a leading cause of kidney disease and need for dialysis treatment. They can also rarely trigger serious skin conditions and strokes, to name just a few. Not trying to scare anyone or rally a cause against these drugs. I consume quite a bit of them, unfortunately. Just saying they're not candy.

[cabfrank]

Well though out post. It says to me that there are a lot of factors involved in everything, and one must be open to all of them before making decisions.

[18sixfifty]

That’s not reassuring: it’s totally bizarre. Nicotine has routinely been described in news accounts as among the most addictive substances known. As the New York Times Magazine famously put it in 1987, “nicotine is as addictive as heroin, cocaine or amphetamines, and for most people more addictive than alcohol.”

But that’s just wrong. Tobacco may well be as addictive as heroin, crack, alcohol, and Cherry Garcia combined into one giant crazy sundae. But as laboratory scientists know, getting mice or other animals hooked on nicotine all by its lonesome is dauntingly difficult. As a 2007 paper in the journal Neuropharmacology put it, “Tobacco use has one of the highest rates of addiction of any abused drug. Paradoxically, in animal models, nicotine appears to be a weak reinforcer.”

That same study, like many others, found that other ingredients in tobacco smoke are necessary to amp up nicotine’s addictiveness. Those other chemical ingredients—things like acetaldehyde, anabasine, nornicotine, anatabine, cotinine, and myosmine—help to keep people hooked on tobacco. On its own, nicotine isn’t enough.

Will a Nicotine Patch Make You Smarter? [Excerpt]

[centralvapors]

[quote=18sixfifty]

other ingredients in tobacco smoke are necessary to amp up nicotine’s addictiveness. Those other chemical ingredients—things like acetaldehyde, anabasine, nornicotine, anatabine, cotinine, and myosmine—help to keep people hooked on tobacco. On its own, nicotine isn’t enough.

Nicotine itself, definitely a contributing factor the addictiveness but I was surprised when using tobacco free vapes WITH nicotine, still left me felling like I was still missing something. The additional tobacco ingredients or additives they put in make up a large portion of the addictiveness.