“REVIEW”: On The Road i3 (2018/2019) - 16340 - Zoomable - 620 Lumens [Pic Heavy] - [***MODDED XPL-HI***]

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-22T22:26:37.000Z

Hmm…

What you did to that black lenses? Or it just some kind of filter underneath?

New lenses looks better but what may happen here is that because of 2mm difference in lens height light goes slightly into overfocus.

Temporary solution like you already did would be to remove oring beneath lens (if it has o ring beaneath). Ugly but working solution thin circle layer of transparent silicone on the place of an old oring…

But all that should not be happening since light is not on a budget side… You can get new Conwoy Z1 for less money…

I really don’t understand their QC standards… Simple white wall test would do the trick. They do have eyes
That kind of seller behavior drive me mad. But don’t be disappointed cause they are all like that… Even 100$ Dereelights had such issues (Tiablo, Crelant, Uniquefire and others…) Glass lens are lottery! no matter what some guys think. If you don’t buy glass lens from reputable source(and that will cost 3-20x price of the flashlight) you’ll be better with plastic ones.

So production process and QC of glass lenses for China flashlight manufacturers is el terrible! However they do have I would dare to say 99% consistency if they will go with acrylic ones. Acrylic should be winning lens for China zoomie industry. Cheaper, better light transmittance and no performance variations. Easily scratched? You can scratch them with nail and it will still have better performance than same size glass one…

I am still waiting for mine i3 btw… Freaking Corona…

Agro · 2020-07-23T06:54:57.000Z

It’s 0.2 mm and it’s not as simple ans shifting a focus.

Assuming that they simply made the base 0.2 mm thicker without altering the curved side, this still changes beam pattern because light that hits the the air-to-glass boundary refracts and continues inside the lens. Now it’s shifted so literally any part of the beam other than dead center hits the curve lower than it would otherwise - and that part of the curve is being hit at other angle than it would be otherwise.
This seriously changes beam pattern.

I seriously doubt they would change thickness without altering shape. It would be too amateurish, if their supplier is able to produce asperic lenses they surely understands this.
OTR probably simply switched the lens model or maker.
Or maybe tooling to make a different shape would cost too much and OTR thought that some packaging or strength improvements were worth the artifacts.

MascaratumB · 2020-07-23T13:42:00.000Z

luminarium iaculator:

Hmm…

What you did to that black lenses? :laughing: Or it just some kind of filter underneath?

Ahah, the black looks is just a black permanent marker line that I did on the flat part of the lens to avoid some artifacts on the beam. It prevents some reflection on the bezel and therefore, in the outer line of the beam (specially when zoomed out).

luminarium iaculator:

New lenses looks better but what may happen here is that because of 2mm difference in lens height light goes slightly into overfocus.

Temporary solution like you already did would be to remove oring beneath lens (if it has o ring beaneath). Ugly but working solution thin circle layer of transparent silicone on the place of an old oring…

Yup, there is not much more I can do to solve that! Also, as I am using a different led and MCPCB from the original ones, that may play a role here too. The original led was an XML2 and the original PCB was aluminium of 1mm. Now it is a Samsung led on a 1.2 or 1.5mm MCPCB that automatically raises the led and the focal point is different too.
Maybe with the original settings the new lens could have a better focus too!

luminarium iaculator:

But all that should not be happening since light is not on a budget side… You can get new Conwoy Z1 for less money…

Hum, yeah, you can get that light, but not put it in your pocket as you do with i3
I see what you mean here, but maybe it has to do with lens provider. I was not aware of the differences between glass and plastic lenses, so maybe some tweaks on the machines that make it is the issue.

luminarium iaculator:

I am still waiting for mine i3 btw… Freaking Corona…

My Z821 is already in Portugal (not sure when it will arrive home). Shipped on the 9th July
The 311 took 2 months (19th May - 20th July) :weary:

Agro:

It’s 0.2 mm and it’s not as simple ans shifting a focus.

Assuming that they simply made the base 0.2 mm thicker without altering the curved side, this still changes beam pattern because light that hits the the air-to-glass boundary refracts and continues inside the lens. Now it’s shifted so literally any part of the beam other than dead center hits the curve lower than it would otherwise - and that part of the curve is being hit at other angle than it would be otherwise.
This seriously changes beam pattern.

I seriously doubt they would change thickness without altering shape. It would be too amateurish, if their supplier is able to produce asperic lenses they surely understands this.
OTR probably simply switched the lens model or maker.
Or maybe tooling to make a different shape would cost too much and OTR thought that some packaging or strength improvements were worth the artifacts.

Did you measure your lens? Can you tell if it is similar to my original or my new lens?
Also, did yours come with the o-ring below it?

I believe that those 2mm make a reall difference, at least in the setting I have (as I explained above). Not sure if the original setting would suffer from that!

Note that those artifacts are not terribly overwhelming, but they are more notorius and eventually distracting, specially when using it for “white-wall-hunting”

I am not curious to see how the Z821 will perform…

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-23T21:54:58.000Z

MascaratumB:

luminarium iaculator:

I am still waiting for mine i3 btw… Freaking Corona…

My Z821 is already in Portugal (not sure when it will arrive home). Shipped on the 9th July
The 311 took 2 months (19th May - 20th July) :weary:

Oh yes… I also ordered that one and not i3 :person_facepalming:

Just checked it is in Amsterdam (NL post).

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-27T12:58:49.000Z

I received this Z 821

Size compared to some small zoomies

My opinion…
GOOD:

- One of the smallest (if not smallest?) 18650 zoomies out there

- Very light and high quality flashlight body dedicated to 18650 battery size

- Great anodizing process and great anodized tailcap threads

- high quality reverse clicky switch (unfamiliar to me and it looks like FW clicky switch) on 17 mm PCB

- Fine zooming system (push-pull with very little head moving)

- Beautiful old school looking zoomie

MCPCB retaining ring on brass pill

BAD:

- O ring or square ring under glass lens seems broken

- Very thin O ring which is located in a flashlight head once when flashlight disassembled is PITA to put it back on its original place

LENS are average quality glass lens with crack here and crack there… Nothing spectacular or AR coated… Or ultra clear… I would dare to say that most low budget manufacturers have better quality lens than OTR.

UGLY:
OMG! It has press fit pill! Do you now what that means for modders?
May the force be with you! Use the Force to beat that out!

Dear OTR if you are watching this what should you improve? What? You don’t know? Well look this:

- change lens to better glass one or even better and cheaper for you swap them for acrylic one…

- Square O ring underneath aspherical lens is ok but put better quality one which does not brake (or you just put that broken one on purpose?)

- Oring inside flashlight head should not be there?! It should be on the flashlight neck section so it would be easier to handle. It is impossible to return it back on its place

- REDISGN PILL! You ruined very good concept pill! Instead of press fit system use retaining ring for driver! Or use driver solder to pill system…

Lower the price! It is to much considering it does not has DTP Board and some inner parts as mentioned above are just terrible quality It should not cost more than 15$ in this condition.

Final thoughts: For someone that does not wants to mod anything this seems like a good light.
Throw goes up to 16 kcd
Driver with High(2.6A), Ultra low(0.10A), Lower(0.4A), and Low mode(0.75A) with hidden strobes and SOS… It has last mode memory even if you remove battery it will start on last mode selected…

MascaratumB · 2020-07-27T13:43:34.000Z

Thanks for your input on this light
I have to say that the “broke” o-ring is probably put in purpose! I guess it has to do with not creating a “bubble” of air while zooming in/out.
My i3 had the same thing!

Yeah, the thin o-ring between the head and tube may be a PITA to put back in place. I lubbed the one on the i3 and it stays sill right there!

About the pill, well it could be different indeed. I didn’t have much trouble modding the i3, once you have a driver with the same diameter. However, it may ruin the original driver when pushing it from the top, you can sever or damage any component.

I am amazed on how small it is though, and I like that

I will wait to check mine’s quality! BTW, can you tell if the driver is 17mm or less? I’m already thinking about the mod

Thanks again for your input on this

contactcr · 2020-07-27T13:59:04.000Z

Also what is mcpcb size and thickness?

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-27T16:29:33.000Z

MascaratumB & contactcr

Guys and OTR… Don’t get me wrong… I like that light… It has more pros than cons. This is probably smallest 18650 zoomie light form/quality factor out there. But requires final touch. So if with 2.6A driven XML2 on classic aluminum 16mm mcpcb (I did not measured thickness) gives 16 kcd, with same settings but just de domed emitter it would give 30kcd and with dtp board it would give 50-60 kcd…
That means that with Osram WF1, 4.5A driver this light will easily go 90-100kcd which should be super impressive for light that small. It should out throw a whole lot of factory 35-55mm reflector/zoom lights with smoothest flood to throw mode ever.

OTR could easily make such light out of the box so that we don’t have to mod anything and then it would really worth 30-35$. This price for current flashlight state is to much. 15$ would be fair for their aluminum mcpcb, 2.6A driver…

I guess I can forgive press fit system pill. Even that can be modded. It would not be any problem to modd it if they would offer empty brass pill and that additional 17mm driver retaining ring for pill (So yes it has 17mm driver). But I really hate to redo from original factory state cause they use press fit machine for that and I have to improvise and probably ruin their driver which BTW it is not that bad at all… It has missing real middle mode at lets say 1.5A but ok we can live with it…

Edit:
Forgot to mention it uses 28mm aspherical glass lens with 8.8mm total height from bottom to top, 3.3mm of “edge” from each side which means that curved aspherical part is only 21.4mm
So place for improvement here also… Give us lens with as less edge possible and with as larger aspherical part for better throw… For example if you would be able to find lens with 1.5mm edge that would mean that you have 3mm edge and 25mm effective aspherical lens surface.

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-27T17:22:00.000Z

luminarium iaculator:

- Very thin O ring which is located in a flashlight head once when flashlight disassembled is PITA to put it back on its original place

- Oring inside flashlight head should not be there?! It should be on the flashlight neck section so it would be easier to handle. It is impossible to return it back on its place

I found out the right Oring to head returning technique.
There is upper and lower section in the head. Lower section is tighter, upper section is wider… Or how to say head has transition from narrow to wide section when we watch into head internal diameter and narrow section uses mentioned oring while wider section uses brass pill oring so that way we have double oring sliding mechanism (almost no movments at all if you placed O rings properly…

So what you need to do? You need to place neck section of flashlight into head but watch very carfuly untill it starts transition from narrow to wider section… When it protrudes few mm from tighter to wider section you got to put mentioned oring inside with a help of a toothpick or similar tool… Now in this point when you have inserted oring you gotta make tool out of A4 printer paper; tube that will embrace neck section OD and with careful and gently press it will will be pushing oring to bottom narrow section. You gotta to have feeling for that because at same time you must do zoom out action while pressing with paper tube.

For returning of oring some kind of ultra thin metal sheet tube could also do the trick as a more permanent tool than paper for someone who needs to mod lets say 20 –100 of this lights.

MascaratumB · 2020-07-27T17:46:50.000Z

luminarium iaculator:

MascaratumB & contactcr

Guys and OTR… Don’t get me wrong… I like that light… It has more pros than cons.

Ahah, I have nothing to get you wrong man
I do like that you point what are the good and the bad aspects! I am a clear fan of OTR, but I am not a “fanboy”, if you know what I mean

Thanks for the measurements you made of the MCPCB, the driver and the lens too! I am happy they use a 17mm driver on this one

The PCB will probably be 1mm or the most 1.2mm, as they normally do!

Using an OSRAM W1 or even a W2 on this light will be top ! I am looking for mine to arrive to decide what to do, and then I will be looking for L4P to reopen store and grab some

And I will have to check if any of the other lights I have with this type of lens will fit the Z821!

I really wanna grab it now :smiling_imp:

Thanks again for your info :+1:

Agro · 2020-07-27T18:51:49.000Z

My o-ring was glued to the side of the lens. Yes, it was cut as well. It a cushion rather than a waterproofing device.
I believe gluing it back would be the easiest thing to do.

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-27T19:14:38.000Z

Mine was stick to the lans like it was glued but in fact it was vacuum effect.
“It is a cushion rather than a waterproofing device.” Yes and not just that… It uses for proper centering lens from emitter.

But it still has o ring in a flashlight bezel, double oring at neck section, and thick oring at tailcap. You can toss and leave it in a bucket of water and nothing should happen.

contactcr · 2020-07-27T19:17:21.000Z

so what do you guys do if you have 1.5mm MCPCB white flat vs stock 1mm XML pcb? Do you need to thin the PCB for proper focus or is it non-issue cause smaller LED?

luminarium_iaculator · 2020-07-27T19:29:09.000Z

Personally I don’t do nothing… I think you will not have issues at all. Maybe slightly overfocus can occur when zoomed in. But since it is zoomie you can just zoom out slightly.
If it will bothering or if it will be to annoying (in one word if you are perfectionist) you’ll just need slightly thicker/thinner oring combination under the lens.

Agro · 2020-07-27T19:53:44.000Z

I think I’ve seen a line of glue on the side of the lens. But maybe it was a mistake…

MascaratumB · 2020-07-29T15:25:15.000Z

@ luminarium iaculator

When you showed the photos above, in particular the one of the driver, I suspected one thing, and now that mine arrived, I confirmed it!

This light has 3 group modes, similarly to the new OTR 311:

A – Ultra Low > Low > Medium > High + Strobe

B – High > Medium > Low + Strobe [default group mode]

C – High + Strobe

You can check how to alternate between those 3 groups on my OTR 311 review .

I will do a complete review of this light in the next days!

Unheard · 2020-07-31T08:42:35.000Z

Found my i3 in the mailbox today. Unfortunately no battery, but I didn’t knew I could have contacted the seller for it. Doesn’t matter, a Vapcell from Dennis nice GAW is incoming .

It has some rings OOF, but I knew this from the Utorch S Mini already. The bezel produces a faint ring, too. Not a problem. In focus the die shows some colorful speckles. Very nice projection.

I have the warm white LED since I knew I would like the tint.

Really a nice small one hand action zoomie. My first and last one, since I don’t need one and just ordered this light out of curiosity .

Well done, OTR!

MascaratumB · 2020-07-31T15:48:41.000Z

Unheard:

Found my i3 in the mailbox today. Unfortunately no battery, but I didn’t knew I could have contacted the seller for it. Doesn’t matter, a Vapcell from Dennis nice GAW is incoming .

It has some rings OOF, but I knew this from the Utorch S Mini already. The bezel produces a faint ring, too. Not a problem. In focus the die shows some colorful speckles. Very nice projection.

I have the warm white LED since I knew I would like the tint.

Really a nice small one hand action zoomie. My first and last one, since I don’t need one and just ordered this light out of curiosity .

Well done, OTR!

Nice that you like it
Well, if the cells are unprotected (or not very long) you’ll have no issue Are those the white ones?

Yes, the i3 as weel as th Z821 create some rings due to the lens, gasket and bezel. Blackening them or making them “matte” helps avoiding some of that reflection.
Ahah, don’t enter the zoomie twilight zone, or you won’t get back from there

This is a nice small light, with a better UI it can make a good EDC, but to each its own

Glad you like it!

Unheard · 2020-08-01T21:19:48.000Z

MascaratumB:

Nice that you like it
Well, if the cells are unprotected (or not very long) you’ll have no issue Are those the white ones?

Yes, the i3 as weel as th Z821 create some rings due to the lens, gasket and bezel. Blackening them or making them “matte” helps avoiding some of that reflection.
Ahah, don’t enter the zoomie twilight zone, or you won’t get back from there

This is a nice small light, with a better UI it can make a good EDC, but to each its own

Glad you like it!

Not sure what will arrive, I just asked for a 16340. But I have several 16340 lights and can swap batteries.

If I EDC it or not, don’t know. But it’s fun to toy with.

Here’s a diagram, lux (arbitrary distance) vs. extension [mm]. Looks like a sigmoid. Is that plausible?

Edit: And btw., the i3 has as much throw as the 1000 lm S1RII. I know, it’s just a tiny square, but still…not bad for a light that otherwise can evenly illuminate a huge area and is as inefficient as zoomies are. Late night thoughts.

MascaratumB · 2020-08-01T23:13:26.000Z

Unheard:

Not sure what will arrive, I just asked for a 16340. But I have several 16340 lights and can swap batteries.

If I EDC it or not, don’t know. But it’s fun to toy with.

Here’s a diagram, lux (arbitrary distance) vs. extension [mm]. Looks like a sigmoid. Is that plausible?

Edit: And btw., the i3 has as much throw as the 1000 lm S1RII. I know, it’s just a tiny square, but still…not bad for a light that otherwise can evenly illuminate a huge area and is as inefficient as zoomies are. Late night thoughts.

Hum, I am not sure if I understood the graphic well. Do you mean: lux increase if the flashlight is zoomed in/more focused? I am not sure if it can be represented that way, but yes, it increases a lot.
I did a small experiment: at around 1m from the luxmeter, on the lowest mode of the Z821 (zoomable).
Full flood: 3 lux
Zoomed to 0.5cm: 15 lux
Zoomed to 1cm: 93 lux
Full zoom: 109 lux
Not sure how this can be represented on a graphic, though

I don’t have the S1RII, just the 1st version (modded) so I can’t compare, but I guess this may be better for some closer range or a longer one, because on the intermediate, the S1RII will probably better!

And yes, this light may be a bit gimmicky