FW3A, a TLF/BLF EDC flashlight - SST-20 available, coupon codes public

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tatasal
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FW3A Status report:

As of this posting, only the host is ready, the driver and optics are unfinished. Beer

teacher
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cabfrank wrote:
It better. I try not to be negative in these group buy threads, but it is ridiculous that you are not in the main loop, and among the first to know, about any and all developments. I know you don’t like it either, and I hope it changes immediately.
Thumbs Up … Yes & amen, +1.

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

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Tom Tom
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Geuzzz wrote:
Yes, please no logo’s. If it is sold from China you don’t neet the CE logo anyway. It’s the responsibility of the European importer/distributer of the product, wich probably won’t be the way of selling. Don’t think this will end up in shops, just straight from China to the end user.

No, you have got that wrong.

No CE marking (and genuine documentation) is just asking for it to be sent back at the EU Border, if inspected.

Already happening. And a database of repeat offenders no-doubt being built, and shared, the easier to catch the next dodgy parcel.

By the way, there is no difference between business and personal importation. The rules apply to you, personally. Or as a businessperson. That’s why you will be charged duty, tax, and handling fee if found-out.

Some EU countries are very tight on this and clearly have plenty of officials looking into things. in the UK you can usually expect to get away with it.

Geuzzz
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Tom Tom wrote:
Geuzzz wrote:
Yes, please no logo’s. If it is sold from China you don’t neet the CE logo anyway. It’s the responsibility of the European importer/distributer of the product, wich probably won’t be the way of selling. Don’t think this will end up in shops, just straight from China to the end user.

No, you have got that wrong.

No CE marking (and genuine documentation) is just asking for it to be sent back at the EU Border, if inspected.

Already happening. And a database of repeat offenders no-doubt being built, and shared, the easier to catch the next dodgy parcel.

By the way, there is no difference between business and personal importation. The rules apply to you, personally. Or as a businessperson. That’s why you will be charged duty, tax, and handling fee if found-out.

Some EU countries are very tight on this and clearly have plenty of officials looking into things. in the UK you can usually expect to get away with it.

Just as I said, it’s the responsibility of the importer and I am happy to take that (very minor) risk.

Never heard of someone not receiving their emisar because there were no labels on it.

RobertB
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Tom Tom wrote:
Geuzzz wrote:
Yes, please no logo’s. If it is sold from China you don’t neet the CE logo anyway. It’s the responsibility of the European importer/distributer of the product, wich probably won’t be the way of selling. Don’t think this will end up in shops, just straight from China to the end user.

No, you have got that wrong.

No CE marking (and genuine documentation) is just asking for it to be sent back at the EU Border, if inspected.

Already happening. And a database of repeat offenders no-doubt being built, and shared, the easier to catch the next dodgy parcel.

None of the thousands of Emisar lights were sent back, and still aren’t.

Tom Tom
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RobertB wrote:

None of the thousands of Emisar lights were sent back, and still aren’t.

Perhaps they have got their ducks in a row, the paperwork in order, using a reputable freight-forwarder, etc. etc. Like any reputable company. Good on them.

But you seem very confident that no Emisars have been sent back from the EU. How do you know that ?

Nevertheless I wasn’t pointing fingers at Emisar. I suspect that they behave with integrity.

But, speaking frankly, at Neal, and his blatant drop-shipping from dodgy outfits, where there seems to be a recurring pattern of problems, delays, lack of tracking, return to sender, weird shipping methods, interest list confusions, all the Fireflies stuff that is creating concern, (don’t know about his other deals, never used them, never will) and potentially this one, unless he ups his game and turns into a serious business person, rather than a chancer.

If Neal was operating a real business, holding owned stock, bought and paid for, in a warehouse ready to ship, maybe in the customer’s territory, commissioning new products, having delivery, quality control, warranty provision, and customer service systems, that would be a different matter.

As he did manage before Banggood let him go.

But I suspect that he might even still be operating as a middle-man from his spare bedroom. No disgrace in that, but things ought to be better and smoother and faster to Western customers. The world is changing rapidly and amateurism just isn’t good enough. He’s had a few years to develop since then and impress us with his acumen. Still waiting.

Frankly, if he is in the loop, I don’t want it. There, I’ve said it, so sue me or rude me. Just know who and what you are dealing with.

If this can be delivered by e.g. Banggood or even Gearbest, or similar, who play to the rules, I’m in. If it has to be a “Del Boy Deals” or similar I’m out.

M4D M4X
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Tom Tom wrote:
nag nag nag

 

 

Neal is part of this project as he was in many before. that was clear from the beginning. 

 

you broke repeadetly your promise to stay out..  

please be gone this time!

 

 all new deals are posted here: 

deals.m4dm4x.com

ask MARTIN@M4DM4X.COM - i will try to save you money!

teacher
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Facepalm

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

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sb56637
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Tom Tom, please drop the subject.

 

http://budgetlightforum.com/forum/misc/siterules

 

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cabfrank
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tatasal wrote:
FW3A Status report:

As of this posting, only the host is ready, the driver and optics are unfinished. Beer

Thanks for the info. It seems as if it may be a while yet then.
Repeating myself, I hope there will be a final prototype sent to TK, and others, before production begins.
It would definitely be better to identify any issues beforehand.

Freedom
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teacher wrote:
cabfrank wrote:
It better. I try not to be negative in these group buy threads, but it is ridiculous that you are not in the main loop, and among the first to know, about any and all developments. I know you don’t like it either, and I hope it changes immediately.
Thumbs Up … Yes & amen, +1.

+2
We may not agree in every single instance yet your past reputation precedes itself here in terms of giving investors the inside look needed to shape opinions of who we are all actually dealing with in these GBs. Your purpose wasn’t to start anything yet you deserve respect for holding many of these together and frankly offering some hint of credibility where (unfortunately) it is often…we’ll just leave it there (no disrespect whatsoever to the OP who has put lights in thousands of hands for little to no compensation given the work required).

I’m in for (2) more LF351Ds…if only for the above and the fact that McBob is apparently in for (6)…which should intrigue anyone looking for “the perfect light” which (imo) he took a pretty good stab at producing not too long ago:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/63288

(Off Topic): “The Perfect Country and Western Song”
https://www.wideopencountry.com/story-behind-david-allan-coes-never-even...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jn2cXDTxWTI

Domari Nolo “I Refuse to be Subjugated” (1st Pennsylvania Regiment Flag) https://www.1stcontinentalregiment.org/blank
(Flagguys.com):..and man o man did they ever refuse to be subjugated. These guys were everywhere. They were important in Washington’s siege of Boston. They stayed behind and were the last to leave after covering the main army’s dangerous nick of time retreat from Long Island. They crossed the Delaware with Washington. They were “..at Brandywine, Germantown, Monmouth, and every major skirmish, and battle all the way to Yorktown..” where they fought “the most important part of the siege” according to General Steuben. These guys saw action in every one of the original 13 colonies.

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Tom Tom wrote:
Time will tell.

You just make your money from affiliate links, codes and other such stuff. No technical contribution AFAIK. All take, no give, just saying.

So don’t criticise me because I am the opposite. I like to talk about technical stuff, maybe not always correctly, but I am true to myself FWIW.

Others try to make money from decent design engineering consultancy, but from what I have heard on the backchannel, even if they were promised a little, it somehow never turns up. They are generally treated like sh(it) and ignored once they have delivered something useful. Until problems arise and it all seems to go friendly again. It’s a cultural thing, respect not being a big part, if there is no personal relationship, face to face etc.

For you’re income stream to keep flowing you need a continual supply of “fresh meat” and fresh punters. And to ramp up the excitement for everything new. Consume.

Let’s just see where this goes, doubtless you are already negotiating your “code” and percentage arrangement with Neal in advance. As I’m sure you have done many times before. Cosy. Looking forward to your review soon. Maybe you’ll have one before TK.

A funny old business, technically regarded as corruption in many territories and very difficult to justify, particularly if you are caught back-handing any of it to the ones who paid you your “commission”.

Or maybe I have mis-judged you, perhaps you are really as dim as you claim, and I should feel sorry for you, whilst you try to get by in the wicked world.

FWIW, I generally dont read, much less agree with what TT says…… not so much that I disagree but mainly because the post are so long that I tend to loose track of what he is saying. On this I have to agree….. Neal’s inability to communicate, insure QC and provide customers a troublefree transaction has a lot to be desired. It ‘seems’ like it is always a roll of the dice when he is involved.

Im not a Pessimist …. just an Optimist with a lot of experience


A little John Prine

kanton
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Uhm.. as I am still pretty new.. Who is Neal and how does he contribute to all those projects he is involed in (like in the FW3A)? It seems to me that he is more than just an owner of an online shop, so what does he do? And how is this related to M4D M4X?

Also, I always wondered whether any of the people involved in the actual creation of the flashlight design ever see any money for their efforts. Like the people who design the lights, drivers, program UIs etc. This does not seem the case, if I read that right and it makes me kinda sad. If that’s right, I wish there was at least an option to pay 10-20% extra for the light and that extra money then reaches the private contributors from this forum. Because everyone besides them seem to get their fair share out of it(?)

ToyKeeper
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kanton wrote:
Who is Neal and how does he contribute …? … And how is this related to M4D M4X?

Neal handles a lot of what needs to be done in China. He used to work in the flashlight department of Banggood, and was involved in making the BLF-A6 and Kronos X5/X6, but later ended up on his own. I don’t recall the timeline exactly, but I think he got canned shortly after the failed Cometa project. Then he started his own flashlight middle-man company and was involved in making the BLF GT. He has also been reselling a variety of other products at his online shop, which I think was created in collaboration with M4D M4X. M4D M4X has been doing tuán gòu (group buy) style deals for a few years, where the vendor gets a bunch of buyers, the buyers get a discount coupon, and M4D M4X gets a percentage for his services.

In this case, I think Neal basically hired Lumintop to produce an item, and is acting as a retailer for that item. Once the product is available to buy, the rest of the process is up to Neal and M4D M4X — sales, shipping, support, returns, etc.

kanton wrote:
Also, I always wondered whether any of the people involved in the actual creation of the flashlight design ever see any money for their efforts. Like the people who design the lights, drivers, program UIs etc. This does not seem the case, if I read that right and it makes me kinda sad. If that’s right, I wish there was at least an option to pay 10-20% extra for the light and that extra money then reaches the private contributors from this forum. Because everyone besides them seem to get their fair share out of it(?)

No, the people on the BLF/TLF side of this don’t get any money for it. Just an occasional prototype, and generally a free light or two at the end.

People keep telling me I should set up a Patreon account or something, but I haven’t done it yet. Maybe I should, but most of the time it seems like it’d just be another headache.

teacher
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ToyKeeper wrote:

(snip)
People keep telling me I should set up a Patreon account or something, but I haven’t done it yet. Maybe I should, but most of the time it seems like it’d just be another headache.
Heck, just keep it simple & fairly headache free then. Give us a PayPal address….. money will follow. . Wink

Seriously, please think about it TK. You give a lot here, many of us would like to give back. Thumbs Up

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

      Xlamp size chart _ BatteryU _ Flashaholic? Need Professional Help???            TheOriginal _ TAB _ LightSearch _ BatterySearch _ 14500's _ DiCal 

 

                                             

kanton
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ToyKeeper wrote:

Neal handles a lot of what needs to be done in China. He used to work in the flashlight department of Banggood, and was involved in making the BLF-A6 and Kronos X5/X6, but later ended up on his own. I don’t recall the timeline exactly, but I think he got canned shortly after the failed Cometa project. Then he started his own flashlight middle-man company and was involved in making the BLF GT. He has also been reselling a variety of other products at his online shop, which I think was created in collaboration with M4D M4X. M4D M4X has been doing tuán gòu (group buy) style deals for a few years, where the vendor gets a bunch of buyers, the buyers get a discount coupon, and M4D M4X gets a percentage for his services.

In this case, I think Neal basically hired Lumintop to produce an item, and is acting as a retailer for that item. Once the product is available to buy, the rest of the process is up to Neal and M4D M4X — sales, shipping, support, returns, etc.


Thank you very much for the explanation! Smile

ToyKeeper wrote:

No, the people on the BLF/TLF side of this don’t get any money for it. Just an occasional prototype, and generally a free light or two at the end.
People keep telling me I should set up a Patreon account or something, but I haven’t done it yet. Maybe I should, but most of the time it seems like it’d just be another headache.

I honestly think you and the others involved in this and similar projects should do that, or a Ko-Fi or at least a PayPal donation thing. Something like that. Not as a payment, but as a token of gratitude from people who really like what you all do.
Jambo
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I’d be up for that, TK’s interfaces have changed my flashlight world!

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when i ran the BLF GT and other groupbuys i added the "one for the team" token to buy and that raised money has been shared to the team members aand other contributers.

unfortunately i am not part of the FW3A project since Neal started his own shop - i do not know how its done here.


If Toykeeper PMs me her okay and PayPal adress i would be honored to run a donation / raffle whatever

So she does not only get our deepest respect for her supernatural work, but also some money for more profane things like a nice dinner or a day in the spa to forget all those bits and bytes Wink




 all new deals are posted here: 

deals.m4dm4x.com

ask MARTIN@M4DM4X.COM - i will try to save you money!

KaiserSosa
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Please add me to the list for 1x…..many thanks~

BlueSwordM
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Same thing.

I can donate a bit of money to project contributors.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

Coscar
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I thought there should have been a ‘permanent’ TK donation thread with a PP addy a long time ago…. she deserves it for her time and knowledge.

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/47205

Im not a Pessimist …. just an Optimist with a lot of experience


A little John Prine

chadvone
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How about a permanent Donation thread for anyone that is willing to accept donations??

I can think of many people I would donate a small amount of money to.

There has been many reviews that has saved me money.

I own a D4 because of TK’s review, donation sent.

I own several cells based on HJK’s reviews , donation sent.

I have or haven’t bought lights based on robo819, donation sent.

Oh, No way I am gonna forget SB for giving me a place to hang out, donation sent.

cabfrank
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The Miller, very sadly long departed from the forum, did something similar. I think it was donation for future products. I donated a little, and to my knowledge, everything was distributed very fairly. I understand, especially with regard to TK, the hesitancy making a hobby a job, but maybe a few tokens of appreciation would be appreciated. Not many people I know of work for free, but the ones I am aware of all reside on BLF. A lot of us would throw a few dollars, or whatever we could, their way.

JasonWW
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kanton wrote:
Uhm.. as I am still pretty new.. Who is Neal and how does he contribute to all those projects he is involed in (like in the FW3A)? It seems to me that he is more than just an owner of an online shop, so what does he do? And how is this related to M4D M4X?

Also, I always wondered whether any of the people involved in the actual creation of the flashlight design ever see any money for their efforts. Like the people who design the lights, drivers, program UIs etc. This does not seem the case, if I read that right and it makes me kinda sad. If that’s right, I wish there was at least an option to pay 10-20% extra for the light and that extra money then reaches the private contributors from this forum. Because everyone besides them seem to get their fair share out of it(?)


A few things about Neal.
1. He’s a flashlight enthusiast who knows how they work internally.
2. Speaks both Chinese and English.
3. Lives within driving distance of Shenzhen China where most of the flashlight manufacturers are located.
4. He’s a translator between us and the engineers, etc… in the factories.
5. He has gone to the factories on many ocassasions to supervise aspects of a flashlight build, worked on the packaging and trained people to do quality control checks on the lights.
6. He knows several ways to reduce shipping costs for both the buyer and seller and a lot of times can avoid the buyer from having to pay additional taxes or import fees.
7. He helps to arrange and run group buys.
8. He helps customers track their packages.
9. He deals with warranty related issues. (Better than the company does, usually)
10. He wanted a website to promote his items and teamed up with M4D M4X since he already had a website.
11. Overall a nice guy and trustworthy.

Sometimes the team working on a big flashlight design will negotiate a tiny percentage, like 1%, with the manufacturer to be equally distributed among the team members or to maybe go into a collective pot that can be used for future projects, etc… The same goes for M4X and Neal. They do get a percentage of the sales that they bring in. Nothing to be ashamed about. I know that their good deals have certainly gotten me to buy lights I normally wouldn’t have. Lol. M4X has also contributed a lot to getting warranty issues settled as well as making lots of review videos. You can check them out on youtube here.

Guys like Lexel, Texas_Ace and others can sometimes be hired by companies to design a driver for a particular flashlight. They usually get paid a set fee, not a percentage, for their work.

I don’t think the software guys like Tom E and ToyKeeper make much or any money off their UI’s. I’m sure they could get paid if a company wanted them to customize a UI for a specific light. I assume, but have no real knowledge, that ToyKeeper made some money from Emisar when she made RampingIOS for their lights. It was built/customized to their specific needs.

Take everything I say about money with a grain of salt. I may know some details, but there’s a lot I don’t know. People like to keep money details private. You know how it is. I believe everything I said is public knowledge, though.

Ps, I hope TK gets a little monetary compensation from this project for all her efforts. It will never be enough to match all the actual work she is doing. Most folks put in all the hours on these projects just for the fun of it, to see it through to a final product. For the passion of it.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube and JoshK Sphere calibrated with Maukka lights

Click this to go to signature links. I'm still around, just not reading many new threads.

lionheart_2281
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I’d happily donate to TK, the UI she has made us is nothing short of amazing, yet somehow it keeps getting better

teacher
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cabfrank wrote:

The Miller, very sadly long departed from the forum, did something similar. I think it was donation for future products. I donated a little, and to my knowledge, everything was distributed very fairly.
You might find THIS interesting & informative cabfrank…..

cabfrank wrote:

I understand, especially with regard to TK, the hesitancy making a hobby a job, but maybe a few tokens of appreciation would be appreciated. Not many people I know of work for free, bit the ones I am aware of all reside on BLF. A lot of us would throw a few dollars, or whatever we could, their way.
Yeah, I can understand that too. Thumbs Up . But, as you basically said cabfrank; TK gives a lot to the BLF Community. And you are 100% correct… she does.

And as chadvone mentioned above, there are a few others that do also.

It would be nice if there was a way, for those of us that wanted to show our appreciation; to be able to do so on an individual basis.
Not some organized fund raiser, there is nothing wrong with that of course; but just on a simple individual basis. A way of letting them know in a tangible way we appreciate & recognize what they do on an individual level.

No strings attached, no expectations, no list of contributors…. just an honest “Thank you” in a tangible way on an individual basis.

To my way of thinking this would be an individual PayPal contribution sent directly to the individual(s) of your choice.

Honestly… it could not get much simplier than that. All that is needed is a PayPal address & hopefully a ‘stickied page’ to keep a list of those addresses on.

I hope this can happen. Smile

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

      Xlamp size chart _ BatteryU _ Flashaholic? Need Professional Help???            TheOriginal _ TAB _ LightSearch _ BatterySearch _ 14500's _ DiCal 

 

                                             

cabfrank
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Not sure on the money, teacher. I thought there was a raffle, with prizes and money distributed. I could be off base though, seems long ago now.

teacher
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cabfrank wrote:
Not sure on the money, teacher. I thought there was a raffle, with prizes and money distributed. I could be off base though, seems long ago now.
Yeah, there was supposed to be…. it never happened. Or, if it did; there was never any mention or record of it. Not good anyway you slice it…. Sad

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

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cabfrank
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I could be confusing it with a giveaway of profits from a affiliate link from the Q8 project. I really can’t remember.

teacher
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Probably so, the affilate thing you mentioned was done.

As far as the other, it is all in black & white right HERE in the OP of that thread; last updated 1 October 2017.

Bottom line, $486.37; whereabouts unknown…. at this point anyway.

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

      Xlamp size chart _ BatteryU _ Flashaholic? Need Professional Help???            TheOriginal _ TAB _ LightSearch _ BatterySearch _ 14500's _ DiCal 

 

                                             

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