Fireflies E07 preview

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djozz
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If you are a perfectionist: the E07 is not perfect as you probably already read on this forum. It is a great design en very desirable but it is a new flashlight that has some significant shortcomings still. Apart from that, I do not think that Fireflies can maintain the consistent production tolerances of Zebralight. Nothing wrong with that but if you are finicky about the exact feel of the switch button, buying the E07 may be a lucky dip Party

d_t_a
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M4D M4X wrote:

@TK

is it true the nichia E07 has a different firmware?
or is it just different setting?
or just a myth?

I only have the FF E07 Nichia 219B (ordered from Neal), but using my “shine light thru a portable USB fan blades” method, I notice that on Turbo mode, NoPWM is detected, same as the Regulated mode (first insert battery into the flashlight).

Unlike the D4S (I’ve tested the D4S with Nichia 219C and the D4S with XPL-Hi).
On the D4S with Nichia 219C, even Turbo mode will show PWM using the “portable fan” method. (Only the regulated mode will have NoPWM)
On the D4S with XPL-Hi, Turbo mode will have NoPWM (also NoPWM on the “regulated” mode).

This would imply that the E07 Nichia 219B didn’t have a multiplier value (75% or 80% on the D4S Nichia 219C) on Turbo mode. (Or could this be only on the early batch E07 Nichia 219B?)

joechina
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Yournamehere90 wrote:
ToyKeeper wrote:
I should probably check my E07 too. I’ve been avoiding soldering though, because all my solder tips are dead or very close to dead. I need to get some new ones, and maybe figure out how to make them last longer.

Can you elaborate on the dead tips? I’m really not good with soldering and don’t know much about it. I’ve been using a Weller brand solder station at work and have to crank it to 800 or 850 to even melt the solder on the MCPCB. Does that mean the tip is bad? I thought they were just pieces of metal.

have you tried cleaning your tip?
It does take a while.
Here is good video about it

netprince
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I wanted to clean up the huge solder blob on the driver spring on my e07 lights, and I figured I would snap a picture the best I could while I had the driver opened up.

After cleaning the solder blob on the driver spring there is more space for the battery.

I also learned the shelf the LED MCPCB sits on is very thick, must be almost 10mm thick.  I also appreciate how well the PCB boards are made, the feel really high quality compared to some of the others I have seen.


IMG_20190123_183941.jpg



IMG_20190123_183944.jpg




IMG_20190123_190041.jpg



IMG_20190123_190042.jpg

Agro
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Firelight2 wrote:
Adhara wrote:
…Not nearly as confusing as the retorts praising what would be defects to most as some kind of advantage in the light…
I assume you’re talking about my earlier comments on the heatpath from the star. I had previously commented that having a worse heatpath can sometimes be an advantage, and might be so in the E07.

That was based on my own experience modding small hotrod lights.

A few years ago I modded a DQG Tiny III into a small triple with a FET driver. It was extremely bright, but became extremely hot. This heat didn’t appear to be a danger to the LEDs, driver or battery. They were fine and seemed to have no trouble taking the heat. No… the problem was that the head became so hot the light was extremely dangerous to hold. You could burn your fingers with it just trying to turn it off if it accidentally turned on.

To address this, I eventually built a sleeve made of aluminum and then coated it with paint and brush-on super glue to wrap around the head. I doubt the sleeve helped heat transmission at all since the exterior glue was insulating. But it DID have the effect of allowing the user to hold and use the light for a longer period of time before having to manually ramp down. In that respect it was helpful.

In a more recent example we have lights with optional copper heads like the Emisar D4 or Astrolux S41 or S42. In my experience, having a solid copper head is considerably LESS useful than having an anodized aluminum head. This is the case even though aluminum can’t hold as much heat as copper and is less good at transmitting heat from the LED.

Why? … same reason as on my DQG. Copper gets dangerously hot to the touch extremely fast and my hand can’t take nearly as much heat as the LED inside the light. I’ve found that I sometimes cannot run a light with a copper head at turbo for as long as I can with an aluminum head light if the light is of a type where my hand needs to touch the copper.

For the E07 I was concerned that any benefits from improving the heatsinking might be countered by too much extra heat transmission to my hands… with the result that max practical output would actually be lower.

However, this was based on the assumption that the extra heat wasn’t having any effect on the LEDs. After reading a couple reports in this thread from people reporting diminished peak output, I changed my mind in regards to this specific light and did go ahead and fix the stars on both my E07s.


I think there are 2 things in that.
First, thermal path between LED and fingers is short, so temp difference is small. This is good for the LED durability and efficiency. This is good for sustained performance. This is not good for Turbo – because material close to the LED doesn’t heat up quite as much (and therfore – doesn’t store as much heat).
Second – the thermal path to your fingers is way shorter than to some other parts of the light. Suddently the thermal barrier of threads becomes a much bigger part of the setup and less heat spreads there before the head becomes too hot.

I believe the best of both worlds is to have as much conductivity as possible…but thermally insulate the touch points, especially near the shelf. Note that you don’t need to insulate untouchable parts like (near-) bottom of deep fins.
And furthermore – to have as few barriers as possible, so heat can spread easier. Unibody is a win…

Firemedic
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Netprince, How did you pop the driver out and are you extending the led wires from driver to make it easier to re assemble?

netprince
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Firemedic wrote:
Netprince, How did you pop the driver out and are you extending the led wires from driver to make it easier to re assemble?

I pushed it out using the stick from a QTip. (its kind of soft plastic, or hard paper, not sure which).

I replaced both the + and – wires, but it should be possible to re-use the stock wires. The smaller wires I just needed help for re-assembly.

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I wonder if it would be better to move the switch LEDs all over to the MCU so that they can all be controlled to go off and work with LVP.

I’m actually surprised Dale didn’t do this

M4D M4X
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a friend received this one a day ago and had a look....

 

already member of M4DM4X.com ?

the best deals are waiting for YOU!

 

before you buy elsewhere mail me: MARTIN@M4DM4X.COM - i will try to save you money!

Firelight2
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Agro wrote:
Firelight2 wrote:
Adhara wrote:
…Not nearly as confusing as the retorts praising what would be defects to most as some kind of advantage in the light…
I assume you’re talking about my earlier comments on the heatpath from the star. I had previously commented that having a worse heatpath can sometimes be an advantage, and might be so in the E07.

That was based on my own experience modding small hotrod lights.

A few years ago I modded a DQG Tiny III into a small triple with a FET driver. It was extremely bright, but became extremely hot. This heat didn’t appear to be a danger to the LEDs, driver or battery. They were fine and seemed to have no trouble taking the heat. No… the problem was that the head became so hot the light was extremely dangerous to hold. You could burn your fingers with it just trying to turn it off if it accidentally turned on.

To address this, I eventually built a sleeve made of aluminum and then coated it with paint and brush-on super glue to wrap around the head. I doubt the sleeve helped heat transmission at all since the exterior glue was insulating. But it DID have the effect of allowing the user to hold and use the light for a longer period of time before having to manually ramp down. In that respect it was helpful.

In a more recent example we have lights with optional copper heads like the Emisar D4 or Astrolux S41 or S42. In my experience, having a solid copper head is considerably LESS useful than having an anodized aluminum head. This is the case even though aluminum can’t hold as much heat as copper and is less good at transmitting heat from the LED.

Why? … same reason as on my DQG. Copper gets dangerously hot to the touch extremely fast and my hand can’t take nearly as much heat as the LED inside the light. I’ve found that I sometimes cannot run a light with a copper head at turbo for as long as I can with an aluminum head light if the light is of a type where my hand needs to touch the copper.

For the E07 I was concerned that any benefits from improving the heatsinking might be countered by too much extra heat transmission to my hands… with the result that max practical output would actually be lower.

However, this was based on the assumption that the extra heat wasn’t having any effect on the LEDs. After reading a couple reports in this thread from people reporting diminished peak output, I changed my mind in regards to this specific light and did go ahead and fix the stars on both my E07s.


I think there are 2 things in that.
First, thermal path between LED and fingers is short, so temp difference is small. This is good for the LED durability and efficiency. This is good for sustained performance. This is not good for Turbo – because material close to the LED doesn’t heat up quite as much (and therfore – doesn’t store as much heat).
Second – the thermal path to your fingers is way shorter than to some other parts of the light. Suddently the thermal barrier of threads becomes a much bigger part of the setup and less heat spreads there before the head becomes too hot.

I believe the best of both worlds is to have as much conductivity as possible…but thermally insulate the touch points, especially near the shelf. Note that you don’t need to insulate untouchable parts like (near-) bottom of deep fins.
And furthermore – to have as few barriers as possible, so heat can spread easier. Unibody is a win…

Some observations:
  • Having a “hot-headed” light is more an issue for the fingers with sideswitch lights. Stick a FET driver in a Manker E14 and the head can get burning hot. But this is ok, because you can hold the light by the body and the switch is in the tail. On the other hand, consider the Astrolux S42: having a burning hot copper head that you have to touch to get to the switch doesn’t work out well.
  • I agree unibody construction out of aluminum works best. It’s one of the reasons why Zebralights work so well. I’m hoping Emisar makes a unibody light with a head the size of a D4 and tube sized for 21700. Result would be a compact EDC with more capacity, output and better heatsinking than a D4. Oh and while they’re at it they should make sure the tube has knurling.
  • Protecting the fingers can work. Perhaps a copper heatsink head with cage around it made from plastic. If done right the copper heatsink could get burning hot and the light would still be relatively safe if the cage kept it away from fingers. The button would also similarly need to be protected. If the cage were done right there should still be enough exposed copper to get the heat out of the heatsink to atmosphere.
Firelight2
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M4D M4X wrote:


a friend received this one a day ago and had a look….

I think all of them look like that. I haven’t seen a single picture that shows a stock star with a film of thermal compound on it. I don’t think we’ll see compound on the bottom of the star until their latest revision using much more compound hits the market.

Last night I swapped the stars on my two E07s. Unfortunately, I’d used way too much Arctic Silver 5 on the first one. That star just didn’t want to come out. I could slide it back and forth, but trying to lift it up… ouch! Reminded me of those old denture cream commercials “Fixodent and Forget It!”

Eventually I managed to get it off and completed the switch. Used a much thinner layer of compound the second time.

DB Custom
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If the copper MCPCB were a little smaller in diameter you’d see their thermal compound on the bottom. It’s not seating all the way down flat onto the emitter shelf. That’s all.

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Finally, ImageShack is working again! Smile

Changed half the Aux LED’s to orange to complement the lavender or light purple look. . .

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very nice dale

 

already member of M4DM4X.com ?

the best deals are waiting for YOU!

 

before you buy elsewhere mail me: MARTIN@M4DM4X.COM - i will try to save you money!

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contactcr, I’m not that much a fan of the lighted switch to begin with so I won’t be making any changes there unless I just disable them altogether. The 4 lighted dots look neat, I like the color, but don’t care that much for the diagonally opposing action when in lockout with the aux LED’s off. I just turn the light around so they aren’t visible and don’t worry about it. Silly

Edit: LVP is something I never see in action anyway, so again it’s something I don’t use. Lighted or otherwise. Wink I just don’t tend to let a cell get that far down.

contactcr
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but what I’m saying would fix both of your concerns. It would have all 4 lights either on or off, no “slash” and allow you to turn everything off and on with the firmware, right?

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DB Custom wrote:
Finally, ImageShack is working again! Smile

Changed half the Aux LED’s to orange to complement the lavender or light purple look. . .

great.

I still think I prefer blue outer ring and purple middle ring though.

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Ryzbor wrote:
@DB Custom: I should have stated I own a ROT66 and assume the switches are the same. Edit: after closer looking the E07 switch seems to protrude a bit and have some kind of ribbing on it, can anyone who has both lights tell if they are the same or different. Why it would withhold me from buying? Because I’m a perfectionist and spoiled by both the ZL switches and the shimmed switches of the Clemence’s E21A Wizard’s ; )

When using the ROT in both winter and climbing gloves I feel and hear no click at all while clicking the Wizard is very responsive by both feeling the switch through the gloves.

You are correct that the E07 switch looks and feels the same as the ROT66. If you can’t stand the feel of the ROT66 switch, then the E07 is probably not for you.
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Thanks for clarifying my doubts Firelight2.

good tint: Nichia E21A 2000K-7500K except d240 bin, Nichia 219B sw40/sw45, 219C sw303, Cree XPL-HI A/D bins, XHP70.2 5A, Samsung shaved LH351D's, Luminus shaved SST-20's.

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contactcr wrote:
I wonder if it would be better to move the switch LEDs all over to the MCU so that they can all be controlled to go off and work with LVP.

I’m actually surprised Dale didn’t do this


Good idea:)
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DB Custom wrote:
Finally, ImageShack is working again! Smile Changed half the Aux LED's to orange to complement the lavender or light purple look. . . !{width:62%}https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/921/LCLQWG.jpg!:https://...

 

Quite an achievement to replace those leds  

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Possibly Firelight, and that is what I asked them for, but I got all purple auxiliaries so I addressed it. Wink Now mine is Custom, as usual. lol

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How in the world did you change those tiny things? You use a microscope or something? Wow Shocked

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DB Custom wrote:
Possibly Firelight, and that is what I asked them for, but I got all purple auxiliaries so I addressed it. Wink Now mine is Custom, as usual. lol

Which SMD LED size did you use?

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I used 0804’s but they had 0603’s on there. The bigger SMD barely clears.

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No scope, no magnifier, no helping hands… pointy tweezers and my hot air station. Dropped one of the purple ones coming off and aliens ate it…

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DB Custom wrote:
I used 0804’s but they had 0603’s on there. The bigger SMD barely clears.
DB Custom wrote:
No scope, no magnifier, no helping hands… pointy tweezers and my hot air station. Dropped one of the purple ones coming off and aliens ate it…

Thanks a lot! Shocked Now I can order some while the light is still shipping so I don’t have to wait ages. ^^

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DB Custom wrote:
No scope, no magnifier, no helping hands… pointy tweezers and my hot air station. Dropped one of the purple ones coming off and aliens ate it…
I’m thinking of trying this. Will have to order some of those tiny LEDs though.

I notice $13 gets a giant bag of a bazillion different colors of these from Amazon.

Unlike Dale, I’d put the board in a vise or helping hands though. And I’d use reading glasses to magnify it enough so I can actually see the parts. Flat Stare

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Lol, you and me too Firelight2;)

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Dale, did you happen to measure the screw size by any chance? I’m going replace mine when I fix the mcpcb, maybe with some allen heads. I believe someone mentioned M2, but didn’t say what the length was

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