The There Are No Stupid Questions Thread

Off-topic Chatter
966

Yes, I tend to see “tint” as color quality, and beam would be the pattern (flood vs. spot, rings, artifacts, tint shift, etc.).

I have an FW3A and have to say, the runtime on turbo is really quite good. I get a good minute out of it before it starts getting too hot for comfort, then stepping down. Actually, it may step down earlier than that, but my eyes don’t see it. Seems to me like the FW21 Pro may be more of a “marketing gimmick,” like scallywag pointed out, easier to resell. It’s “sexy”, I must say. It’s not TIR, has reflectors, so it would throw more than an FW3A, but also delivers decent spill. I’ll have to read up more on the XHP50.2, though.

Yes, sorry I didn’t address that before. Hadn’t quite thought through my needs. There’s so many attractive flashlight choices, making it easy to end up with redundancy. I already have that!

What I’d like to have is a hand-held thrower with a really decent NW beam (4000k ~ 5000k) and also some decent spill. I do have a Zebralight SC64c LE with LH351D emitter. Terrific light. It sort of does what I described—good throw & spill. But, output is just barely over 800lm. I’d like to pump out closer to 3,000lm in a slightly larger form factor. I enjoy Anduril, which is partly what attracted me to the FW21 Pro.

I mentioned the Emisar D4Sv2 because of it’s massive wide hotspot. I sort of consider that “concentrated spill,” albeit more narrow than a wide reflector. And thermal management seems to be pretty decent. And of course, it’s a novelty with its aux LED’s and Anduril UI. But in essence it would be an “upgrade” to my FW3A. More novelty. Something for later on, though.

I use my larger lights for night walks & camping / lounging in forest / beach areas. The FW3A provided wonderful near field flooding. Not great on throw. To fill that niche, I have two Nitecore lights - EA4 (4xAA) and EC4GT (2x18650). They are both nice throwers, albeit averaging around 1,000lm. So while I’m pretty well set for smaller near field lights, I thought I might be able to find one that has both good throw & spill. Seems that’s the unicorn. I do wonder, if a light could mate both OSRAM & CREE (or Samsung) in one light to do both?

Yes, both you and scallywag have been helpful—thanks. So to get my thoughts in order here, I should back off on another near-field light. Already have enough filling up that slot (FW3A, Astrolux S43, RRT-01, H03 FC, and SC64c LE). I want a good handheld thrower (2x18650, 26650, or 21700) that can double the output of my Nitecore EC4GT with a very nice NW beam. Plus also good thermal management. If UI isn’t programmable, must start on low. And would be nice to have moonlight and hidden strobe. Doesn’t need to have built-in charging, but would be nice if larger cells than 18650. Lastly, would like to keep cost below $99 (like a discounted flashlight from a year or two ago), if possible. Are there any decent candidates for those loose reqs?

967

I can’t think of any lights that fit your need. When you talk about a handheld thrower I’m thinking of a light with a single LED and reflector. If you also want around 3000 lumen I typically think of an LED like the 50.2 or 70.2, but they are not the prettiest neutral White. The only powerful led I can think of that might be a nice looking NW is the SBT-90.2. Maybe an Astrolux FT03S, 4500lm, 5700K. Freeme has it for $90. You can look into that one.

Maybe someone can recommend something cheaper or better. I’m not real up to date on the latest flashlight models. (My everyday work lights use the 50.2 and 70.2)

Oh yeah, you might look at older xhp50 lights using boost drivers. This older led was pretty nice looking, color wise, but output was only 2500 lm or so with a boost driver.

968

If you’re looking for higher lumens in a thrower, I’d say to use the Astrolux FT03 as your starting point of reference. It’s available in the original SST-40, which won’t hit 3000 lumens, but out-throws the newer XHP50.2 version that does hit 3000 lumens. I think there’s also a version of it (FT03S?) that has SBT90.2.
The FT03 is, in my opinion, the next step up from “jacket-pocket” size (though it will surely fit in larger jacket pockets). This is mostly to do with head diameter. It takes a single 26650 or 21700 as you please. The official Astrolux specs are… well, Astrolux specs, so be sure to mentally adjust them down by a factor of something like 25%. Also, if you decide it’s a good form factor, please keep in mind that with A$trolux, you get what you pay for, and read up on the threads devoted to common issues with the light.
Frankly, your price range allows you to get something with better build quality, so I’d recommend the FT03 as a starting point for the research. If you think the head diameter is too large for what you’re interested in, you’ll have to start thinking really hard about the tradeoff between lumen output and throw.

969

I’m fully convinced that for a really decent long range thrower, you need a larger reflector. Unless you’re looking for a pencil beam. Living where I am, really no need for something as large as a GT90, but FT03 is more sensible. The drop-off from turbo is pretty steep & reviews are showing the head gets too hot to touch fairly quickly. I will be on the lookout for comparative reviews to see what else turns up.

Actually caught a LEP review by Matt Smith that looks seriously cool (Acebeam W30). Essentially a “white laser”. I think there’s HUGE potential for this. I can foresee having a multi-LED cluster of conventional emitters with a LEP in the center. If that LEP could be independently controlled, that would be really amazing. This way you get great spill & throw in one flashlight.

Matt Smith did a nice comparison of these lights. Here’s the video bookmarked at BLF GT Mini Pro:

BLF GT Mini Pro seems to output turbo longer than the FW21 Pro (video bookmark 7:24), while also producing noticeable throw. Beam quality looks pretty decent from his capture…

970

Personally I’d get a Kaidomain C8.2 w/XHP50.2 and be able to choose temp over a GT Mini Pro if I wanted that kind of beam profile and form factor.

Actually probably would choose a C8F over that too now that Sofirn offers them with 90CRI LH351D. Similar performance and light quality that’s better in almost every way (tint shift, CRI, etc.) + ramping UI (not as good as Narsil or Anduril but still good).

D4S is still king of the hill in this size/output/throw class though IMHO. With the floody optic or some diffusion film/DC Fix you still get generous spill and there is a ton of choice for emitters.

971

Only trouble with D4S and others in that form factor is the limited time on high. It doesn’t look like there’s much choice out there, without stepping into a much higher price bracket. Considering Sofirn, just checked out their SP70. Not an EDC with 2 cells in series but wow, does it give ample performance for the $$. Very nice beam profile. Two temperatures available. The UI is not bad either. A little strange, but without the programming options it’s simple enough to remember. It does have ramping mode. Unfortunately it has last mode memory, but you can override with moonlight or turbo, which helps mitigate that. Rumor has it Sofirn is planning a BLF edition, but nothing confirmed as yet. Might be a year or more out.

972

I’ve got a question about driving the 6V XHP50.2.

I’m planning to run four 6V XHP50.2 in parallel on a 5050 Q8 MCPCB with a direct drive TA driver. I have read that the XHP50.2 6V is sensitive to overcurrent and gets dark dies fast. To limit the current in direct drive I would not bypass the tail spring, use 22 AWG wire and use only 10 or 20A max discharge cells. They would run on two 26350, 18350 or 26650 batteries in a Haikelite SC04.

I would also cut some traces on the Q8 MCPCB and add some sense resistors. Do you think it is enough if I add one R010 resistor for all four leds or would it be better to have one resistor for each led?

I would use two 5000K 90CRI H2 and two 2700K 90CRI G2. I don’t know if they have a different Vf so maybe I should use one resistor for the 5000K and one for the 2700K? Before I start the build I’m seeking advice from anyone who has experience with the XHP50.2 6V so that my leds will survive and run safely in this flashlight.

973

Probably a couple of dumb questions: :slight_smile:

1) I already have an SST20 flashlight (Convoy S2+)
Is there any advantage getting a flashlight with SST40?

I was thinking of getting another budget thrower, I have a C8 XML,
but would prefer a side switch, or e-switch

2) Is this a legit store: Convoy Direct ?
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/3135023

974

I’m not sure I understand you. Four 6v in series needs 24v. You have a flashlight that runs on 24v?

975

SST-40 is just a bigger led so it has the potential for higher output. I know the FT03 is a great budget thrower using the SST-40. It will be brighter with more throw than both the lights you mention.

I dont know about that store. Why would you buy from them instead of from Convoy direct?

976

JasonWW, Thanks for the suggestions, will check out FT03

That store is called Convoy Direct, that’s what’s confusing. I guess that means they are not .

977

I’m not aware of Simon opening a second store on Aliexpress. I would guess that it’s a competitor using a similar name to steal customers from the real store. It’s a common tactic.

978

Sorry for the confusion, I wanted to say in parallel. You are right, 24V in a flashlight makes no sense. Thank you for pointing out my mistake.

979

Okay, I see you want to use a SC04 light, now it makes sense. I never bothered experimenting with the 6v 50.2 with a FET driver because they always burned up as soon as they get power. Even from 18350 cells. If no one answers you here, try asking on this 50.2 thread. There’s a lot more folks who know about it’s limits. For sense resistors to handle so much power you’d probably need a bank of them. And they’d need to be big. I’ve never experimented in this area, sorry.

980

I wouldn't go that crazy with modding the driver or MCPCB. Keep the dual springs, don't use bypasses, use long thin LED wires. 24 or 26 AWG should do with some extra length. I'm not sure what amp level the LED's burn up at though - haven't had that problem, I assume there's been some LED testing to prove the burn out point?

I haven't heard of Vf varying with tint before. Sure, a 2700K will be a lower bin but the Vf? Never heard of that.

Of course I assume you are using a TA driver specifically designed for 6V LED's? That's a must. Plus you have to mod the carrier for 2Sx2P.

981

Thank you for the advice, JasonWW. I asked my question in the XHP50.2 thread.

I have sense resistors in the 2512 and 1206 sizes with 1 or 2W. Maybe the leds would survive if I add a R082 sense resistor to each of them. When I measured the tailcap current with two Liitokala 26650 and four Luxeon V2 it was around 9A on Turbo.

982

SST20 is a small, throwy LED available at 5000K and below, and in high CRI below 5000K. To my knowledge, the 70CRI versions out-throw XPL-HI despite being domed.
SST40 is a large LED capable of very high output (over 2000 lumens at like 6+ amps). It’s not available below 5000K nor in high CRI. It’s a floody LED due to its size, but gets used in throwers due to sheer output and compromise of lumens vs. throw.

983

Thank you, Tom E, good idea to use 24AWG wire.

Djozz tested the XHP50.2 up to 12A and it didn’t burn out. But once I read about a build with 7 XHP50.2 and two 26650 cells in direct drive where the XHP50.2 burned out one after another. So I’m concerned because it is said that the 6V XHP50.2 has weak internal connections and individual dies become dark easily.

I think with Cree leds the Vf is lower if they are 90CRI. I just assumed it would vary with the bin as well.

Currently, I want to mod the Haikelite SC04 whose reflector happens to fit a Q8 MCPCB perfectly. I have a TA driver with LDO and four Luxeon V2 wired 2S2P which work nicely. However, I want more power and a bigger hotspot. If it goes well, I might try it also for the Q8 with a 2S2P mod.

984

Ohhh, interesting bout the SC04, 2 cells config I'm sure. I've done the thin long wires in other lights to reduce amps - works well, and actually some stock FET based drivers simply use long twisty traces on the driver to result in the same thing.

This was an example from a 12X SRK. I bypassed the squiggles and got more amps:

985

I did not hear of a single successful use of 50.2 with FET driver. They all burned out. Some lights used really weak cells and lasted a couple months, but it eventually burned out as well.

This is why no one builds that combo.

Some leds work well with FETs and some don’t. I would ask around a lot more before committing very much money into the build.

The 3v versions are a different beast. They can handle FET drivers no problem. Of course using a single 26650 will reduce run times, but it might be better to just swap a new cell in than to have the 6v leds burn out.