*POSSIBLE* 18650 and charger for $10 at Home Depot (YMMV and some (dis)assembly required)

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stuart
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*POSSIBLE* 18650 and charger for $10 at Home Depot (YMMV and some (dis)assembly required)

I try to spend my money wisely, therefore I frequent Slickdeals and Fatwallet as frequently as BLF. Yes I have been lurking for a while…

Over at Slickdeals:
http://slickdeals.net/f/5151684-HomeDepot-Ryobi-Motion-Sensing-Alarm-10-...YMMV

My local HD had 5 of these (at the clearance price). I bought 3. I will use 2 to keep the cats off of the counter. The third… hmm…

I noticed that the battery pack is just a wee bit bigger than an 18650. These tools use “4v lithium ion batteries.” The included manual states “…designed with features that protect the lithium-ion cells and maximize battery life.”

I haven’t opened one up yet because I am currently charging the batteries, but it sure sounds and looks like a single protected 18650. Due to the size of the battery the protection circuit may be seperate from the battery, hence possibly an unprotected 18650.

To use the charger, it would obviously need to be diassembled and re-assembled into something that could take the raw 18650.

Keep in mind, the package also includes:
2 Energizer 2032 batteries
Remote
Motion Detector
So there are a lot of extra parts and pieces that could also come in useful if scrapping the entire thing. I would like to somehow keep the original functionality of the motion detector and battery pack so I could swap 18650s in and out of the pack (to use the motion detector OR charger without having to tear the charger apart).

Sorry my first post is such a monster. If anyone is interested, I will try to gently (ha ha) open one of the battery packs to see what exactly is in there.

jacktheclipper
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scaru
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Welcome to BLF! I for one am interested and will probably go check my Home Depot for one. Smile

Chicago X
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Heck, I could use one of those for the cats...dang bread-munching little ba$tards !

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stuart
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I got the battery pack opened. It is an 18650 in there but it has an external protection circuit. If the charger relies on this circuit, it may not work to charge a raw cell. I could not salvage the battery pack.

scaru
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stuart wrote:
I got the battery pack opened. It is an 18650 in there but it has an external protection circuit. If the charger relies on this circuit, it may not work to charge a raw cell. I could not salvage the battery pack.

Why weren't you able to salvage the battery pack?

stuart
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It was very hard for me to take apart. Someone with more grace and skill could probably do a better job. I have all the elegance of a rhinoceros on crack.

The protection circuit is a pcb directly over the + end of the battery. The battery is a Sanyo UR18650W2. Nothing spectacular. The back of the charger states output at 400mA so the charger would be super-slow.

I guess this might not be the hot deal I thought it was but at least I can keep the cats off of the counter with the other ones!

scaru
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stuart wrote:
It was +*very*+ hard for me to take apart. Someone with more grace and skill could probably do a better job. I have all the elegance of a rhinoceros on crack. The protection circuit is a pcb directly over the + end of the battery. The battery is a Sanyo UR18650W2. Nothing spectacular. The back of the charger states output at 400mA so the charger would be super-slow. I guess this might not be the hot deal I thought it was but at least I can keep the cats off of the counter with the other ones!

Well, that is an IMR battery. If you want I can walk you through it. It really is not that hard. 

stuart
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Have you opened these cases before? I can rip the protection circuit off to get to the raw cell. It was the actual platic cases that gave me fits. What is different between an IMR cell and a non-IMR cell? Thanks for your help!

scaru
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stuart wrote:
Have you opened these cases before? I can rip the protection circuit off to get to the raw cell. It was the actual platic cases that gave me fits. What is different between an IMR cell and a non-IMR cell? Thanks for your help!

Not those cases but lots of other battery packs. An IMR cell can supply larger amounts of current that an normal Lion battery. The disadvantage to this is they have a lower capacity. The one that you have is a 1500 mah battery. 

First take a pair of pliers and snip the wires that connect to both ends. Now you can take the battery out. Then you tear off the wires. Chances are there is a wire on the flat side, (negative) and a strip of metal on the positive side. Either way tear it off. Now you should have a bare battery. Then you just use it. Big Smile

stuart
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Thanks scaru. I figured since I toasted the battery housing, I might as well see whats in the charger. It has tamper-resistant torx heads… but… I have the cover off (thank you Harbor Freight). The wall-plug-in dealies seem to be plastic-welded to the case. I guess I could un-solder them.

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 some of the imr batteries can deliver10/15/ 20 amps ..I just salvaged some sanyos from a ryobi llithium drill pack ...i'm calling them lmr because i don''t want to get into what chemistries are being used these days ..[Too much battery research in the past few days]

 ..They are what they are ..able to be hammered on .. a bit safer perhaps and 1500mah....

Panasonics and sanyos are hard to beat .

 

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scaru
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stuart wrote:
Thanks scaru. I figured since I toasted the battery housing, I might as well see whats in the charger. It has tamper-resistant torx heads... but... I have the cover off (thank you Harbor Freight). The wall-plug-in dealies seem to be plastic-welded to the case. I guess I could un-solder them.

Did you get the battery out? From my experience with making home made chargers they almost all run on 5 volts. If you can access the wires going from it to the charge board you could measure the voltage. If it is 5 volts then just use any USB power supply to power it. That is what I am using to charge lifepo4 batteries. Smile

scaru
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Boaz wrote:

 some of the imr batteries can deliver10/15/ 20 amps ..I just salvaged some sanyos from a ryobi llithium drill pack ...i'm calling them lmr because i don''t want to get into what chemistries are being used these days ..[Too much battery research in the past few days]

 ..They are what they are ..able to be hammered on .. a bit safer perhaps and 1500mah....

Panasonics and sanyos are hard to beat .

The ones he found can do 20 amps. If you give me the model number of yours I can look them up for you. 

stuart
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scaru wrote:

Did you get the battery out? From my experience with making home made chargers they almost all run on 5 volts. If you can access the wires going from it to the charge board you could measure the voltage. If it is 5 volts then just use any USB power supply to power it. That is what I am using to charge lifepo4 batteries. Smile

Oh yeah! Battery is out. The charger is also a wall wart, so no worries about power supply. On the back it claims output is 4V at 400mA. It has nice flashy little lights to tell you when it is 1/3, 2/3, full, and two different fault types. I realize the 400mA output will make it a slow charger. I just hope the charger does not rely on the (formerly affixed) protection circuit!

scaru
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stuart wrote:
scaru wrote:

Did you get the battery out? From my experience with making home made chargers they almost all run on 5 volts. If you can access the wires going from it to the charge board you could measure the voltage. If it is 5 volts then just use any USB power supply to power it. That is what I am using to charge lifepo4 batteries. Smile

Oh yeah! Battery is out. The charger is also a wall wart, so no worries about power supply. On the back it claims output is 4V at 400mA. It has nice flashy little lights to tell you when it is 1/3, 2/3, full, and two different fault types. I realize the 400mA output will make it a slow charger. I just hope the charger does not rely on the (formerly affixed) protection circuit!

Do you have a DMM? If so measure the voltage that it puts out when charging the battery. (Disconnect the PCB) If you tell me that I might be able to tell whether it needs the protection circuit. 

stuart
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With a fully charged but rested cell in the charger, I get a constant 2.92V (with a cheap HF mm).

With no load it bounces between 1.55 and 2.19V

EDIT: that was with a battery with a protection circuit. Please disregard till I can hook up some leads. Might be tomorrow..

scaru
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stuart wrote:
With a fully charged but rested cell in the charger, I get a constant 2.92V (with a cheap HF mm). With no load it bounces between 1.55 and 2.19V *EDIT: that was with a battery +with+ a protection circuit.* Please disregard till I can hook up some leads. Might be tomorrow..

That was a different battery? When you say it was with a protection circuit do you mean one built into the battery? If so then it doesn't matter. 

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Welcome to Blf Stuart. Thanks for the heads up on that.

Piers said " ....but who wants enough light, when you have the option for far too much "

stuart
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I don’t mean to be ignorant, so please forgive me. It was a different battery (one that I did not take out of the housing) that still had the circuitry involved. The only way I can attach the raw battery to the charger would involve making leads to get it to connect. I probably wont do that tonight. I truly appreciate all of your help!

scaru
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stuart wrote:
I don't mean to be ignorant, so please forgive me. It was a _different_ battery (one that I did not take out of the housing) that still had the circuitry involved. The only way I can attach the raw battery to the charger would involve making leads to get it to connect. I probably wont do that tonight. I truly appreciate all of your help!

If it was a different battery that is fine. That most likely means that the charging circuit is part of the PCB since 2.9 volts is not enough to charge a lion battery. 

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Welcome to your new home, stuart!

Best0270

stuart

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Sorry for the slow reply.

The charger has 4 terminals that correspond to T2, , T1, and + on the battery housing. When I connect jumper cables between the cell and the + and terminals, the charger shows a defective battery fault. I get the same fault when connecting to the T1 and T2 terminals also.

It seems like a pretty smart (but slow) charger. It is probably very safe when used as its meant to be used, but where is the fun in that? I think I will have to give up on using the charger. Oh well, I got a new 18650 and a way to keep the cats off of the counter. Smile

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Chicago X wrote:

Heck, I could use one of those for the cats…dang bread-munching little ba$tards !

LOL! Nothing worse than turning you back for a second only to turn around and find someone has taken a bit out of your sandwich. Our cat usually points a paw at one of the kids whenever I inquire. Fortunately, he is too big to defy enough gravity to get as high as the table or the counters so I only have to worry when I break the house rules about eating in the living room.

Welcome to BLF, Stuart. It is here where the fun is just as important as the flashlights.

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My Ryobis are  Sanyo L

Ur18650sa  N47A  which is probably the date code   google seems to say  1200 or 1300mah and 20 amp

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EDCPlus
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If anyone wants to trade one or two of these batteries (unopened pack) for a new Redilast 3100, let me know. My Craftsman tools use the same batteries, and I wouldn’t mind a spare cell or two…

stuart
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EDCPlus wrote:
If anyone wants to trade one or two of these batteries (unopened pack) for a new Redilast 3100, let me know. My Craftsman tools use the same batteries, and I wouldn’t mind a spare cell or two…

I plan on keeping the ones I have left. I believe the slickdeals thread contains a home depot inventory search. Maybe one in your area has some of these in stock.

EDCPlus
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stuart wrote:
EDCPlus wrote:
If anyone wants to trade one or two of these batteries (unopened pack) for a new Redilast 3100, let me know. My Craftsman tools use the same batteries, and I wouldn’t mind a spare cell or two…

I plan on keeping the ones I have left. I believe the slickdeals thread contains a home depot inventory search. Maybe one in your area has some of these in stock.

If you are after high current cells I can also get some new ones for you. I just hate to see someone rip open a perfectly good battery pack when I have a legitimate use for these packs.

I can get just about any of the Sanyo, Samsung, Panasonic high current cells if that is what you are after…

stuart
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EDCPlus wrote:

If you are after high current cells I can also get some new ones for you. I just hate to see someone rip open a perfectly good battery pack when I have a legitimate use for these packs.

I can get just about any of the Sanyo, Samsung, Panasonic high current cells if that is what you are after…

Really I opened the one to see what was in there and if I could get it to work with the charger once it was out of the battery pack.

I am going to keep my remaining two in the battery packs to use in the motion detectors as cat deterrent.

EDCPlus
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stuart wrote:
EDCPlus wrote:

If you are after high current cells I can also get some new ones for you. I just hate to see someone rip open a perfectly good battery pack when I have a legitimate use for these packs.

I can get just about any of the Sanyo, Samsung, Panasonic high current cells if that is what you are after…

Really I opened the one to see what was in there and if I could get it to work with the charger once it was out of the battery pack.

I am going to keep my remaining two in the battery packs to use in the motion detectors as cat deterrent.

Ok no worries. I thought you were going to also pull the others apart just for the cells, and didn’t want to see a perfectly good pack go to waste like that.