"Sky Ray 9xT6" issue from CNQG

43 posts / 0 new
Last post

Pages

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California
"Sky Ray 9xT6" issue from CNQG

I’ve been lurking around these forums for some time now. Lots of good information here. Lots of helpful people. I haven’t posted prior to this, because I’ve mainly just been reading, learning, and trying out a couple lights (avoiding repetition of questions that have been answered elsewhere). Anyway, I recently purchased a ““Sky Ray 9xT6” from CNQG”:http://www.cnqualitygoods.com/goods.php?id=1716 for 94.78$ shipped, and I’ve since run into a few problems. I should note that I have previously ordered a Sky Ray King (the first gold version in NW) and Roche F12 (NW) from CNQG. Aside from conductivity issues due to anodizing on the Roche, I have no complaints with those orders. That being said, this recent purchase of the 9xT6 (SR9) has left a bitter taste in my mouth.

My light shipped on 01/10/13 and was delivered on 01/24/13. 2 weeks… not too bad. Well, when it arrived, it appeared to be sufficiently bubble wrapped, so that was nice. But then… I opened up the package and the first thing I noticed was that the flashlight is branded as a “Hwaswys Ultrafire 9T6” on one side, and “High Power LED Brightness up to 9500 LM” on the other.

I know a lot of these Chinese companies are the same company so I wasn’t immediately worried, but I was definitely apprehensive. I noticed FMCamaroZ28’s review where his was labeled as a “Xenon”, however his did have “Sky Ray” printed on it. Anyway, at the same time of my SR9 purchase from CNQG, I also purchased some INR King Kong 26650’s from Intl Outdoor. I charged up the 26650’s and they came off the charger at 4.2 volts. Popped 3 of them into the light and fired it up. It was bright for sure, but didn’t really amaze me. I almost felt like my SR King was brighter. I thought that this might be attributable to the fact that they sent me an Ultrafire and not a genuine Sky Ray, so I sent them an email. This was their reply:

****
“Dear Gen1three

Sorry for no notice. Because our Dispatch Dept do not inform me about this.

Actually it is the completely same flashlight except the logo.

Hoping you can kindly understand.

2013-01-25
Best regards

Merry

CS”
*****

I had suspected that the lights are all the same, and when I saw FMCamaroZ28’s review, I noticed that they appeared to have the same driver.

Somehow I convinced myself that the apparently low output was due to the cool white tint and tricks on my eyes. A few days later, I caught a direct glimpse at the light and noticed that only 3 of the LEDs were lighting up. This was very difficult to tell at first because looking at the light is obviously still very blinding. If I covered the head with a piece of paper or piece of cloth, it was very apparent. I took a picture of it that really shows the problem:

Those center 3 LEDs are lit up while the outer LEDs are all completely off. I was obviously very disappointed in this, so I emailed CNQG yet again and included the above picture. I told them how I tested my 26650’s and some 18650’s with the included sleeves. Same problem. Unfortunately, this was the entire reply:

“Ok, please send it back by registered post for repairing.”

Really? Just send it on back? Just like that? Aside from the fact that I have no idea which exact address I would ship it to or any shipping details, I’m not going to spend nearly the cost of the light, just to ship it to China. I don’t have subsidized shipping charges. Besides, I paid for a working light. And shipping. Nearly 100$ (a substantial amount of money in both of our countries). I shouldn’t have to pay for their mistake. Well, after doing some research online, I basically found out that I’m pretty much screwed. I have seen some threads about successful resolution with RIC intervening, but to be honest, it still sounds like a headache. So I decided to take a look at the problem myself.

I was initially apprehensive about opening up the light because I didn’t want to somehow ruin my chances to return it. Once I learned that returning it wasn’t really a practical option, I unscrewed the reflector from the piece with the LED’s “mounted” on it. and I immediately found out what was wrong. 3 of the loops of wire were completely cut off. They were very cleanly cut off but it looked like it could have been done by something somehow pinching them under the reflector. Not only that, but one of the LED’s wasn’t even mounted. It has some sort of compound dried up slathered around it. Unfortunately I forgot to take a picture before soldering some replacement wires in. I was just eager to fix the seemingly simple problem and have a working beast of a light. So I soldered some replacement wires, but then only 7 out of the 9 were working. Here are the 7 working LED’s and the shoddy solder job. I took this first pic with only 2 batteries in, on low mode. Ridiculously low output. When it had 3 batteries in, it was too bright to take a picture:


The 2 LED’s with the green dots next to them are the non-functional ones. The pink dots are the (+) positive sides of the LED’s. I just labeled them in case they were difficult to tell apart. This was my second time soldering something and the quality shows. I thought I messed up the wiring somehow and replaced the white wires (which are 2 of the 3 replaced wires) as they were connected to the non-functional LED’s. Still had the same problem. And I guess this brings me to the crux of my problem and the reason for my post (aside from also allowing me to vent and give a heads up):

1. Does the wiring look like it would explain why the 2 marked LED’s aren’t working?
2. What type of compound do you guys suggest for sticking the LED’s back onto the head? (Both LED’s are mounted. The one that isn’t works fine and is pressed into placed when the reflector is screwed in)
3. If those 2 LEDs are fried, does anyone have a suggestion for a source for replacement LED’s?

While this was an obviously embittering experience (almost 100$), I should reiterate that my first 2 orders from CNQG were without complaint. My Sky Ray King doesn’t have any emblem on it, but it’s bright as hell and a nice neutral white. Anyway, I’m not into modding and all that, but I just want to fix my light and see it working correctly for the first time. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!

Firelight2
Firelight2's picture
Offline
Last seen: 25 min 4 sec ago
Joined: 04/08/2011 - 15:17
Posts: 4626
Location: California

From the picture you posted, Looking at the lower LED you marked with a green dot: It looks like only 1 wire is connected. The second wire to the “-” contact to the right of that LED looks cut and doesn’t appear to be soldered to the star. Not sure that will solve the problem but it’s a place to start.

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Thanks for the reply. So I replaced the white wires:

And then I read your post. I had noticed that the black wire did look partially cut, but I was thinking it should still work. I decided to give it a try though. I clipped off the wire, stripped it and resoldered it on. It’s not pretty, and the plastic is a little burnt, but that shouldn’t stop it from working:

And it didn’t… Initially just 2 LED’s lit up. I don’t know for sure if it was the 2 that weren’t working but I highly suspect that it was. I had no way of telling after I replaced the cover. Anyway, the 2 LED’s lit up for a few seconds and after a couple mode switches, only the center 3 lit up. What might this mean? Some kind of short?

scaru
scaru's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 10 months ago
Joined: 03/22/2012 - 13:36
Posts: 6946
Location: Virginia

Judging from that I would guess it is a driver issue, the driver probably is having trouble boosting up the voltage enough for all 9 LEDs. I'd like to point out you could file a claim with either paypal or your credit card company to just get your money back. 

FMcamaroZ28
FMcamaroZ28's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 months 6 hours ago
Joined: 10/08/2012 - 09:05
Posts: 972
Location: New Jersey

Maybe i can take some better pictures of the wiring layout of my 9xt6 for you when i get home?

Let me know.

But it does sound like there is a driver issue here.

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Thank you for the helpful replies! I think you both might be right. If those 2 LED’s that lit up were the formerly non-functional ones, then it would make sense that the driver is the problem and not both of the LED’s. As to the wiring, thank you FMcamaro, but the picture you have in your review was perfect already Smile

I didn’t want to file a complaint once I saw that the wires were cut, because it seemed like an easy fix. I shouldn’t have had to repair even that, but I didn’t mind so much because I was eager to see this thing working. Either way, Ric emailed me a couple hours ago and said this:

*****
Hi Gen1three ,

I think it might be the driver problem. Are you able to take the driver off to replace one, If so , i will send you a new driver to fix the problem.

ThanKS
Ric
*****

Well, I really don’t want to file a complaint now, because he is attempting to make things right. Again, I still shouldn’t have to deal with this because the light should have been tested after being assembled. But seeing as how it took me a couple days to notice that only the center 3 LED’s were lighting up, I can’t really blame them if they didn’t notice either.

Anyway, I told him I wanted to get some input as to whether people thought it was the LED’s, wiring, or the driver that was the problem before he sent me a driver that may not fix it. Now, I am beginning to think a new driver might be the best course of action. I lack a tool to remove the driver though (note the 2 holes). Here is the underside of the driver:

This is the topside:

Is a driver swap as simple as using the proper tool to unscrew the old one and soldering on the wires to the new one? I feel like I should order some better, thicker, wire and replace all the wiring while I’m at it. Also, do you guys know of some good thermal adhesive paste like the white stuff that they used to stick the LED’s? Even though the LED’s are pretty much held in place by the reflector, it would be nice to secure the loose ones.

FMcamaroZ28
FMcamaroZ28's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 months 6 hours ago
Joined: 10/08/2012 - 09:05
Posts: 972
Location: New Jersey

A pair of snap ring pliers will be able to unscrew that alum holding the driver in place. If i remember from the posts in my review it was just sitting in there, should be easy to do.

https://www.fasttech.com/p/1200101

The LED’s are thermally glued on using Fujik

https://www.fasttech.com/p/1049304

IF your going to start doing mods, might as well get a bottle.

dthrckt
dthrckt's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 48 min ago
Joined: 11/08/2011 - 10:11
Posts: 4618
Location: Upstate NY

if you didn’t already, you might put 2AA in a battery holder that has leads and test each emitter individually

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Awesome. Thank you for the suggestion. I’m going to order both of those. And I’m glad they’re both fasttech links :). I’m currently waiting on some batteries from them and some random odds and ends. They shipped out fast too, no pun intended. I don’t really foresee myself getting heavy into modding, but I might do a little here and there. I also just recently purchased a ton of random stuff from other sites too so I’m sure I can find a use for those items.

I have read “Fujik” quite a few times on light forums.

Why do people prefer it?
Does it have better heat transfer than other options out there?
What would be the difference between Fujik and something like Arctic Silver?
Is it because of a lack of electrical conductivity from silicone based thermal pastes? But in that case, there might be a ton of other options right?

FMcamaroZ28
FMcamaroZ28's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 months 6 hours ago
Joined: 10/08/2012 - 09:05
Posts: 972
Location: New Jersey

The Fujik is just another brand.

Theres two different types

Thermal GREASE, which is comparable to the arctic silvers of the CPU world.

https://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10000468/1049305-fujik-heatsink-ther...

And thermal GLUE which is what i linked to you before.

The glue type products will adhere the LED stars where the grease will not.

Arctic Alumina is the comparable one to the Fujik that i posted before.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arctic-Silver-AATA-5G-Alumina-Adhesive-Thermal-Epoxy-5g-/170708546413?pt=US_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item27bf05b36d

Its just a different brand. If you want to use the same stuff that’s on the flashlight now your looking for the fujik glue. Its way easier to work with.

Just don’t use glue or alumina on your CPUs!

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California
leaftye wrote:

Big tweezers should work too. I got a set for a couple bucks at Harbor Freight.

Good point… I haven’t been to Harbor Freight in a few years, so it might be a good excuse to go. Thanks!

dthrckt wrote:
if you didn’t already, you might put 2AA in a battery holder that has leads and test each emitter individually

That’s nice and cheap… and potentially useful for other stuff. So there shouldn’t be a problem with a direct contact on the LED? Thanks for the link!

FMcamaroZ28 wrote:
The Fujik is just another brand.

Theres two different types

Thermal GREASE, which is comparable to the arctic silvers of the CPU world.

https://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10000468/1049305-fujik-heatsink-ther...

And thermal GLUE which is what i linked to you before.

The glue type products will adhere the LED stars where the grease will not.

Arctic Alumina is the comparable one to the Fujik that i posted before.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arctic-Silver-AATA-5G-Alumina-Adhesive-Thermal-Epoxy-5g-/170708546413?pt=US_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item27bf05b36d

Its just a different brand. If you want to use the same stuff that’s on the flashlight now your looking for the fujik glue. Its way easier to work with.

Just don’t use glue or alumina on your CPUs!

Ahhhhh.. Thank you for the clarification! That makes a lot more sense now. Gonna definitely order some Fujik.

Werner
Werner's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 10/19/2012 - 15:00
Posts: 3679
Location: Germany

I can’t see where the above mentioned black wire goes. Please make some pictures of the LED wiring from different angle.

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Both of those black wires are soldered onto that LED as indicated by the picture below. The orange dot represents where they are soldered together onto the LED.

It might still be a little difficult to see how they are soldered together there… but there appears to be good contact. Also, since the central 3 LEDs are still functional, there should be good contact there. The negative wire comes off the driver and is soldered onto LED “1”. Another black wire then connects “1” and LED “2”. This happens at the orange dot. Next is 3, then 4, etc.

scaru
scaru's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 10 months ago
Joined: 03/22/2012 - 13:36
Posts: 6946
Location: Virginia

Looking at that wiring, I'm going to say it is the problem. The wires are supposed to wire them in series, and I don't think that is what you did. (May be wrong)

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

I modified the picture. It may need to be refreshed if it doesn’t show the alterations.

The wires marked by the blue arrows were the ones that were clipped and that I initially replaced. It was pretty obvious where they were connected, so I just replaced them accordingly. The white arrow marks the re-soldered black wire that firelight2 suggested. I don’t think I wired it incorrectly, but it’s been a while since I’ve taken electricity and magnetism in Physics so it all seems pretty foreign now.

scaru
scaru's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 10 months ago
Joined: 03/22/2012 - 13:36
Posts: 6946
Location: Virginia

Ok, are your LEDs wired like this? 

P.S. Have I won the award for crappiest paint drawing yet? Silly

relic38
relic38's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 10 months ago
Joined: 12/28/2012 - 00:39
Posts: 3390
Location: Toronto, Canada

There should be no branches (two wires connected to the same side of an LED). You have at least one branch in the red wires. You need to wire them like Scaru has drawn. There should be one wire going from the + of one LED to the – of the next LED.
Edit: Make sure the red wire coming from the driver goes to the first LED + and the black driver wire goes to the last LED -.

Welcome the night.

My Reviews   My Mods    http://budgetlightforum.com/search?

Werner
Werner's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 10/19/2012 - 15:00
Posts: 3679
Location: Germany

No his wiring is right, if I remember correctly there are 3groups of 3 parallel.
And this is what I can see.
This would also make clear why just the 3 in the middle worked.

What is status quo? Does it light up?

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

The wiring is in the same configuration that I received it in. This is a very crappy picture of the basic wiring:

Haha, I think my pic might be worse than yours now scaru… although yours does have elliptical LED’s…

scaru
scaru's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 10 months ago
Joined: 03/22/2012 - 13:36
Posts: 6946
Location: Virginia

Ok, if it is supposed to be 3S3P does your circuit diagram follow this? (Your drawing confuses me Silly )

Werner
Werner's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 10/19/2012 - 15:00
Posts: 3679
Location: Germany

What is the actual problem? Which LEDs light up and which not?

The wiring seems visually correct for me.

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Haha… yeah my diagram confuses me too even. But yes, it appears that it follows your wiring configuration scaru.

The problem is that currently only the central 3 LED’s are lighting up now. But prior to that, 7 of them were lighting up.

dthrckt
dthrckt's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 48 min ago
Joined: 11/08/2011 - 10:11
Posts: 4618
Location: Upstate NY

I think scaru is correct

the led that is furthest to the right has a wire coming off positive and going to a positive

even if they’re supposed to be 3s3p, they wiring is incorrect

instead of drawing on the picture, I suggest recreating the way it is wired in a diagram that is easier to read (like scaru’s)

Werner
Werner's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 10/19/2012 - 15:00
Posts: 3679
Location: Germany

Wiring is right! I see 3s3pi have marked groups with colors

The furthes right goes direct to driver just with a short visit at the other led

aoyue2702
aoyue2702's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 9 months ago
Joined: 07/01/2011 - 18:41
Posts: 344

dthrckt wrote:
I think scaru is correct

the led that is furthest to the right has a wire coming off positive and going to a positive

even if they’re supposed to be 3s3p, they wiring is incorrect

instead of drawing on the picture, I suggest recreating the way it is wired in a diagram that is easier to read (like scaru’s)

bingo.

scaru
scaru's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 10 months ago
Joined: 03/22/2012 - 13:36
Posts: 6946
Location: Virginia

Yeah, the wiring is screwed up. Truthfully I am having a hard time figuring out what you did but it isn't right. Silly I'm gonna try drawing up how it should be wired on one of your pictures for ya. 

scaru
scaru's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 years 10 months ago
Joined: 03/22/2012 - 13:36
Posts: 6946
Location: Virginia

Ok, first of all here the correct wiring is. Each color is a 3S group. 

And here the fix is to make it correct. 

Werner
Werner's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 10/19/2012 - 15:00
Posts: 3679
Location: Germany

Now I am confused isn’t this the same way like it is?

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Thank you for the replies…
aoyue, it actually wraps around (orange line)… see diagram below for what I mean.

Scaru, it is actually wired like that right now. It just doesn’t seem that way in that particular pic, but the one I posted with the orange dot should.

Edit: Yes Werner, I believe so.

I made a sloppy diagram on sketchbook, but I tried to maintain the relative orientation of the individual LED’s:


This should more or less be similarily oriented:

Werner
Werner's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 10/19/2012 - 15:00
Posts: 3679
Location: Germany

That’s the best picture so far.
.
.
.
.

And I was right.

But why worked it for a moment and then just the 3 LEDs light up?
I can’t figure out what is wrong. But it can’t be just the driver, if current flows through the inner 3 than there has to be current through the other 6 too…

Gen1three
Offline
Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: 01/29/2013 - 03:04
Posts: 30
Location: California

Now that I’m actually looking at it simplified… I’m more convinced it’s a driver issue. Unless it is shorting a circuit/s somehow?

Pages