Mega-Beamshot Thread: TK/40/41/45, DRY 3*XML and more.

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Chicago X
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Mega-Beamshot Thread: TK/40/41/45, DRY 3*XML and more.

Hello,

First thread here on BLF Smile

I wanted to post up some beamshots of several torches I recently acquired, along with some faithful users from the last year or two.

Camera is a Panasonic Lumix with Leica DC Vario-Elmar  F:3.3 2-second exposures across the board.  Imaging processing was unified across all images.  All torches on highest level, unless indicated otherwise.

First, the venerable 6*AA iTP A6 Polestar:

A6 Polestar HI

 

Another AA superstar, the 8*AA MC-E Fenix TK40:

TK40 HI

 

The newest member of the 8*AA TK family, the XM-L-powered TK41:

TK41 HI

 

 

The floodiest of the trio, the 3*XP-G TK45:

TK45 HI

 

 

Ready?  Here's the DRY 3*XML Warm White version:

DRY 3*XML HI

 

Here's a thrower for you, the Solarforce Masterpiece PRO 1:

MPP1 HI

 

 

 

And the wee Sipik SK68 on 14500:

Sipik SK68 zoom 14500

 

Here's a new addition, the JetBeam PA40:

Jetbeam PA40 hi

 

The new CNqualityGoods long-run 3*18650 single XM-L:

Longrun XML hi

 

So far, I am blown away by the DRY 3*XM-L and Longrun XM-L, and recommend both.

Please feel free to ask any questions you may have about any of the torches.

Thanks for looking !!!

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

War Dogs, Making it Home - Rescue Dogs for Returning Vets

2100
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The extreme runtime XM-L from CNqualitygoods is cool and now has NW 5A3 tint which is nice (I like neutrals which are a wee bit warm like the 840 NW fluorescents), looks same sized spot but brighter than TK40.  I just received the new 5A3 neutral white 3 x XM-L with 3A driver and Shadow TC6 5A3. 

 

Chicago X
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2100 wrote:

The extreme runtime XM-L from CNqualitygoods is cool, looks same sized spot but brighter than TK40.  I just received the new 5A3 neutral white 3 x XM-L with 3A driver and Shadow TC6. 

 

Nice! How do you like the NW tint?

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

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2100
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Chicago X wrote:

Nice! How do you like the NW tint?

The NW 5A3 is great, same as your regular Osram/Philips 840 tubes, a wee bit warmth in it.  5000k is also ok, i wouldn't mind both.  But I am an easy person with tints, CW, WW, NW all suit me.  But CW and WW greenies are out.  (I have a 335 emitter based LED strip which is pretty green, skin tones all look wierd under that strip)

Ian2381
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2100 wrote:

Chicago X wrote:

Nice! How do you like the NW tint?

The NW 5A3 is great, same as your regular Osram/Philips 840 tubes, a wee bit warmth in it.  5000k is also ok, i wouldn't mind both.  But I am an easy person with tints, CW, WW, NW all suit me.  But CW and WW greenies are out.  (I have a 335 emitter based LED strip which is pretty green, skin tones all look wierd under that strip)

Where could I get a Neutral XM-L, love the beam.

Chicago X
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Ian2381 wrote:

Where could I get a Neutral XM-L, love the beam.

Link:  http://www.cnqualitygoods.com/goods.php?id=1177

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

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Ian2381
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Chicago X wrote:

Ian2381 wrote:

Where could I get a Neutral XM-L, love the beam.

Link:  http://www.cnqualitygoods.com/goods.php?id=1177

Thanks, Really great and bright light, but I'm not into multiple Lithium Cell lights so I'll pass.

Are there any place to buy a NW XML emitter only?

Chicago X
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I use LEDsupply or Cutter for most LEDs.

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

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2100
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Ian, you can use 1 x 18650, 2 x 18650 or 3 x 18650, no issue. The cells are parallel in the holder. It fits 32650 6000mAh as well.   But do note 3 x 18650 matched cells is cool as well as pretty safe, as that'd be 9.3Ah. 

candle lamp
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Good job and thanks a lot for the great beamshots. Chicago X! Laughing

I'm waiting my long run 1 XM-L neutral white.

I have a DRY warm white version 3 modes.  Yours are same?

 

 

Candle Lamp

DasFriek
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I just cant like warm tints, The DRY 3*XML looks awful to me. But the output is excellent, I just cant get past all the yellow.

I like the tint in the CNG 3x18650 has with its single XML.

Its all personal taste as i think more will like it than dislike the color, Maybe im just odd. 

BTW, Welcome and nice first post! Everyone always love pics. 

2100
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petebaby, you asked about the spacing of the 4-mode 3A neutral white. With 3 full charged XTAR 2600s, it is 2.06A, 0.78A and 0.17A.  Reflected ceiling lux is 150 for this NW, compare this to the 130 of the Trustfire 3T6 CW and 160 of SkyRay SR3800 CW. The CCT difference of NW already gives it an approx 15% disadvantage as compared to CW (you do know about this right, WW is even less efficient). But seriously with such bright lights, the difference close-up is very difficult to differentiate due to how your pupils react by constricting.

In high - and in my tropical country where the nights are still a warm 30 deg C now, @ 2.0A 3 minutes run is somewhat warm, you can push further by trying to withstand the heat but i'd not try. This is to be on the extremely safe side.  0.78A @ 12V still gives you a heck lot of light.....as much as a fully driven single XM-L.  You can run at this level for very long periods due to the heat mass as well as some 2X surface area compared to a single XM-L single 18650 light, 20 mins no issue. The single 18650 XM-L 40mm light like C8, it might get quite toasty.

If you really want bright, you'd have to go the DD 4A.  But seriously this turns into a pocket rocket, ie very short runs only.  If you are well below zero during winter, i supposed multi-minute runs are a piece of cake.  BTW, 2A and 4A is not twice as bright, it does not scale linearly, unless i guess if you live in Antartica - 60 deg C with high winds.

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Thanks for the beamshots , Chicago X .

What I do

 

Chicago X
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Thanks to everyone for the nice words.  

DasFriek, this is my first warm-tinted light, and probably the last.  Smile  I am learning to appreciate the benefits of neutral (and warm) white in a woodland setting, but am a cool white guy, at heart.

 

DasFriek wrote:

I just cant like warm tints, The DRY 3*XML looks awful to me. But the output is excellent, I just cant get past all the yellow.

I like the tint in the CNG 3x18650 has with its single XML.

Its all personal taste as i think more will like it than dislike the color, Maybe im just odd. 

BTW, Welcome and nice first post! Everyone always love pics. 

 

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

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kevinfc
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I'd love to see the final finish of the light. Also, does anyone have a rough estimate of the low lumens on the four mode ?

mizjif
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Awesome beamshots! Thankyou very much for this. 

 

A mildly off topic question, but there are some knowledgable people here on the DRY light. Does the 4-mode CW come with the 3A driver or are all of the CW's coming with the 4A driver?

Chicago X
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2100 wrote:
The extreme runtime XM-L from CNqualitygoods is cool and now has NW 5A3 tint which is nice (I like neutrals which are a wee bit warm like the 840 NW fluorescents), looks same sized spot but brighter than TK40.  I just received the new 5A3 neutral white 3 x XM-L with 3A driver and Shadow TC6 5A3. 

Let's look:

TK40:

TK40hi

 

Longrun XM-L:

 

Longrun XML hi

 

Looks like a good call !

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

War Dogs, Making it Home - Rescue Dogs for Returning Vets

peteybaby
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Thanks very much, 2100.  Your information is very helpful to me and others.  I'm disappointed though in the performance of the NW 4-mode Dry light.  I like the medium and low mode currents, but I had assumed that the high mode current would be around 3 A.  Now I'm not sure if I want this light after all.  The Dry uses 3 batteries while the Trustfire and Skyray use two, yet the Dry (4-mode) is about the same output as those.  The Dry WW 3-mode produces the max. output I want, but lacks a low mode.  Sad

Yes I do know that NW is less efficient than CW, so I was expecting 3 A current on High, with a resulting small reduction in output compared to the CW because of the lower efficiency.  I wasn't expecting lower drive current as well.

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Ye I'm curious too how the NW 4-mode now compares to the skyray ...

It wouldn't be smart for me to go for a DD light + i really like the 4-mode 

 

 
Chicago X
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2100 wrote:
petebaby, you asked about the spacing of the 4-mode 3A neutral white. With 3 full charged XTAR 2600s, it is 2.06A, 0.78A and 0.17A.  Reflected ceiling lux is 150 for this NW, compare this to the 130 of the Trustfire 3T6 CW and 160 of SkyRay SR3800 CW. 

A quick look at the chart here on BLF looks like 686 lumen at 2A per emitter.

686 * 0.85 = ~583 lumen (15% loss for NW-seems a bit high)

583 * 3 = 1749 lumen.  At a 10% loss, it becomes ~1852 lumen.   

 

My 3-mode WW version pulling 3A:

881 * 0.85 = ~749 lumen per emitter with 15% loss for WW.

749 * 3 = 2247 lumen.

At a 20% loss, it looks like ~2114......

http://wardogsmakingithome.org/index.html

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scheven_architect
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Well after a lot of thinking i thought NW would suit me best, although i have never owned a NW light but the nice color rendering combined with high lumen output would be great. But if it isn't 3A and the 2200 lumen i was hoping for i might consider the skyray. But i'll see what ric has to say.

 

 
2100
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Chicago X wrote:

2100 wrote:
petebaby, you asked about the spacing of the 4-mode 3A neutral white. With 3 full charged XTAR 2600s, it is 2.06A, 0.78A and 0.17A.  Reflected ceiling lux is 150 for this NW, compare this to the 130 of the Trustfire 3T6 CW and 160 of SkyRay SR3800 CW. 

A quick look at the chart here on BLF looks like 686 lumen at 2A per emitter.

686 * 0.85 = ~583 lumen (15% loss for NW-seems a bit high)

583 * 3 = 1749 lumen.  At a 10% loss, it becomes ~1852 lumen.   

 

My 3-mode WW version pulling 3A:

881 * 0.85 = ~749 lumen per emitter with 15% loss for WW.

749 * 3 = 2247 lumen.

At a 20% loss, it looks like ~2114......

The SkyRay looks really bluish to me, even more so than the Trustfire 3T6 (i have them side by side). This NW is 4000, maybe 4250k. IF you look at Cree's XM-L chart, the difference from 3700k to 8300k is 240-280 lumens. That is a whole 16.7% range.  So 15% is quite belivable.   I have a Xeno E03 WW and NW. With the same battery and tailcap, it is 38 and 44 lux reflected respectively. 15.8% difference. And do remember, lux meters are calibrated to have peak sensitivity at 2583k warm white, so that 38 lux for WW has the advantage. This is a real-world measurement.

If one really needs the lumens/lux, you can't go wrong with the CW 4A with short bursts, switching to medium for long use.  If you live in the tropics and is hot whole year round, you'd need very high mass to soak up the heat, seriously even those 8 fins on the TF-3T6 does nothing much to cool over here unless you have a very strong breeze.

 

2100
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peteybaby wrote:

Thanks very much, 2100.  Your information is very helpful to me and others.  I'm disappointed though in the performance of the NW 4-mode Dry light.  I like the medium and low mode currents, but I had assumed that the high mode current would be around 3 A.  Now I'm not sure if I want this light after all.  The Dry uses 3 batteries while the Trustfire and Skyray use two, yet the Dry (4-mode) is about the same output as those.  The Dry WW 3-mode produces the max. output I want, but lacks a low mode.  Sad

Yes I do know that NW is less efficient than CW, so I was expecting 3 A current on High, with a resulting small reduction in output compared to the CW because of the lower efficiency.  I wasn't expecting lower drive current as well.

Well, i'll ask Ric if he can send me the so-called 3 mode 4A direct-drive drivers. I'll probably get the CW direct-drive 4A light as well to complete the collection. Remember, Chicago-X has the WW 3-mode direct drive and he gets 3A while I get 2.8A.   

Trust me, if you own a lux meter, you'd see that the higher you drive, the faster the lux drops, it does not look what it seems.   The difference in form factor between the regular 2 or 3 batteries "longish" Sky Ray/Trustfire/SZBOM vs this Dry is well worth the price, operated in medium/low mode this light is another version of the extreme runtime (actually this has higher lumens efficacy).

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/2808  (do play with the lumens calculator, input the different drive levels, and heatsink levels)

I can tell you, NW at 2A drive level, 150 reflected lux (vs 130 for TF and 160 for SR, both cold whites), are all around in the same ballpark.

And if you dig neutral white CCT, seriously there are no other options.  Sealed

You can get the Sky Ray, but mine is sitting here direct drive on either a SLA / 3S3P pack because the driver blew and many others also. I thought Vin posted shots of this and his Dry CW with the 3-mode 4A driver.

2100
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BTW, our eyes/pupils work in such a way....that 0.78A and 2A in closer quarters, is actually quite close. I just tried it last night briefly along a dark pathway in my estate....well my wife is afraid of cockroaches.  LOL!

The difference on the lux and DMM is there, but in reality 2A shuts down the pupils somewhat.  Of course you'd tell a difference if you are using this for throw, btw this light is not for throw and not useful as a dedicated thrower past 100m, well of course it still works and the output is appreciated, but a Fandyfire STL-V6 would blow this out of the water in throw. Correct tools for the correct use.  BTW you guys do know the hotspot size matters a lot for lux (throw)?  Twice the diameter drops the light intensity, eg your 4000L just became 1000L.

In a nutshell, if you are basing on paper 3A looks very much brighter than say 1.5A be it close up or for throw, then that is going to disappoint.  In fact for lux throw figures, you'd need 4X the lux for twice the throw. So yes, say for my WW driven at 3A, it probably still does not reach 2X farther versus a 0.78A drive.  Smile  (remember the 3A is going to put out a lot more heat) 

No offence guys, i'd echo Chicago X and Vin's comments at cpfmarketplace.  You guys are thinking and comparing too much, just buy it!  Just the WW / NW variants PLUS form factor alone is well worth it. By chance the good solid built is a welcomed plus point as well....it won't beat the quality of Shadow TC6 that i received from Ric/CNqualitygoods, but that's yet for another use and appreciation.  When you hold this light, this feels like a mini TK70.

You probably would not get more kick if you get the Big Bruiser from Elektrolumens, which costs 250 before shipping and has the same form factor.  LOL!  Big Smile

 In CPF there are guys who get lights due to this and not absolute lumens. But i can understand about getting too hung up with lumens on paper....but like i said in reality, the diff in a big house between 1800 and 2500 lumens is not really appreciable...too close. Now when i fire up my 4000 lumens Ebay "65W", 1800L vs 4000L, now we are talking.

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To be fair, it's like almost twice the price. The fandyfire 3xml is <50 at dx. 2 of those is pretty close to your 4k lum HID. :bigsmile:

Reading this makes you smarter: http://lesswrong.com/

2100
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agenthex wrote:

To be fair, it's like almost twice the price. The fandyfire 3xml is <50 at dx. 2 of those is pretty close to your 4k lum HID. :bigsmile:

I'd never touch those drop-ins with no threads again.  Try getting any dealer to pay you return shipping for the DOAs in that batch.  Sealed

And Lightake will send you another Wii crazy bunny toy.  Sealed

Just for fun.....Edit : 46.50 x 2 = 93 , vs HID's $122 here and $138 in USA.

peteybaby
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Thanks 2100 for your comments.  I understand what you're saying, and I'm sure you're right that I would probably not notice the difference, at least not as much as I'd notice the diff between the tints.  What bugs me is that the NW 4-mode is "leaving something on the table".  If it were driven at 3 A, I would be satisfied even if the output were the same as the Skyray or TF 3T6.  But since it's driven at 2 A, while the 3-mode is driven at 3 A or 4 A, I would feel gypped.  Smile

Also, one of my minor targets was to be able to beat a Fenix TK45, and a Maelstrom S12.  The CW 3-mode definitely does that, but the NW 4-mode probably wouldn't.  How can I brag if I can't beat my friend's lights???  Smile  (and the S12 is quite a bit smaller than this Dry, so even worse!)  In fact, whatever light I buy has to clobber my current brightest light, which is around 650 lm, or else I wouldn't bother.

I can't buy a 3-mode Dry because it has no real low mode.  I could maybe try a CW 4-mode, but who knows if the CW 4-mode would drive at 3 A or 2 A?

Oh and lastly: "just buy it"... easy for you rich guys to say!

agenthex
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2100 wrote:

agenthex wrote:

To be fair, it's like almost twice the price. The fandyfire 3xml is <50 at dx. 2 of those is pretty close to your 4k lum HID. :bigsmile:

I'd never touch those drop-ins with no threads again.  Try getting any dealer to pay you return shipping for the DOAs in that batch.  Sealed

And Lightake will send you another Wii crazy bunny toy.  Sealed

Just for fun.....Edit : 46.50 x 2 = 93 , vs HID's $122 here and $138 in USA.

BTW, does the extension on the trustfire 3xml fit the skyray?

Reading this makes you smarter: http://lesswrong.com/

peteybaby
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Oh BTW, 2100, if you have a way to communicate directly with Ric, can you ask him why the 4-mode DRY drives at 2 A instead of the 3 A he stated on cpfmarketplace?

Last favour to ask (for now): 2100, if you ever feel like doing beamshots, I'd love to see your two DRYs' beamshots side by side.

2100
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petebaby,

TK45 .....  Hey NW already has that 15% disadvantage to begin with.  And like i said, for throw, the hotspot size matters way more. TK45 is more throwy, that 10-15% reduction in hotspot size (from Chicago X's pix) is going to require like 40%-60% more lumens to compensate just by "lumens brute strength".  As in, 1800 lumens you need to push to 2500-2800L and that is for both lights with CW, and you factor in another 15% disadvantage of NW, sorry it is really too much. 

To see which light is brighter via throw on a 200m target by using lumens is a totally losing battle.

Oh yeah, you do have a point.  While the 3-mode 4A with the NW is cool, it lacks a real low.  But then again at medium, that is going to run for nearly 4hrs.  Smile

2100
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peteybaby wrote:

Oh BTW, 2100, if you have a way to communicate directly with Ric, can you ask him why the 4-mode DRY drives at 2 A instead of the 3 A he stated on cpfmarketplace?

I'll try. Seriously it is really academic on paper.  Why does Chicago X's warm white drive at 3A and mine at 2.8A while it is specced at 4A?  heh....   I'll just take things as it is.

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