New Driver: PD68 "DoubleDown" - 17/20/22mm FET+4

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mattlward
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I did find the solder joint problem, the PWM pin for the FET was not well soldered. Now I get both the 7135 channel and the FET channel.

Pdog, I may have to move to the firmware thread… Just was not sure about the lack of reverse thing. I thought the ground ring was quite thin as well, but it does work when mounted in a light! Right now the off time mode save is advancing 1 mode with each test and I can’t back up. Really frustrating!

I did get battcheck running, got some really odd numbers but did plug them in. Mine were higher than any other sets of files, I was using a power supply. With the unit on battery, it start stepping down almost immediately. Did not you have a problem where the numbers were off when using a power supply as well?

Tom E:
It is defined in the main BLF.c file as the tiny13.

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

pilotdog68
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Well your reversing and mode switching sound like the OTC isn’t draining. I’d try it without the lighted tailcap first. If it still behaves the same, try swapping out the OTC for a new one (and be careful how long the heat is on the cap)

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

mattlward
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My eyes are just shot for today! Not sure I could pull it off right now if I felt like it. I have tried it with both types of tail caps, no change. Will the hot air solder let go with hot air again and still leave usable pads?

BTW, the hole through the middle is just genius!

Matt

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

pilotdog68
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mattlward wrote:
My eyes are just shot for today! Not sure I could pull it off right now if I felt like it. I have tried it with both types of tail caps, no change. Will the hot air solder let go with hot air again and still leave usable pads?

BTW, the hole through the middle is just genius!

Matt


Forget my earlier post, I see the problem. You have the parts sideways. I should have marked that on the PCB. The way you have it, the BR effectively doesn’t exist, and the cap is connected to batt+ instead of batt-. And yes, you can heat it back up with the hot air and move stuff around. Did you have any problem with clearance around the small ground ring?

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

Joshk
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What FET is this this? I would like read about it. I didn’t see a parts list.

pilotdog68
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It’s basically the same parts list as any of the other fet drivers on BLF

MCU: Attiny 13a/25 or 45/85 for 20/22mm
R1: 19.1k or 22k
R2: 4.7k
C1: 10uf
OTC: 1uf
FET: LFPAK56 footprint

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

Joshk
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Thanks for the quick reply. With that I was able to find some and datasheets.

mattlward
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With a standard tailcap all works as expected. I do need to adjust the medium press to be shorter but it works and memory works. With a lighted tail cap memory is always previous mode! I have about 2.3k of resistors on the tailcap board, 2 5.6k resistors and a 560 on the driver. It appears that the OTC is not discharging. I assume that I may need to raise the value of the bleed resistor?

I am so close!

Matt

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

pilotdog68
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I’ve never tried to dial in the medium press with a lighted tailcap. It actually sounds like it’s discharging the OTC faster than expected. Try running TK’s offtime cap FW to get the values. Here

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

mattlward
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With the light tailcap the only thing not working reasonably well is that fact that mode memory always decreases 1 mode. I can go forward and backwards but just not remember the correct final mode! I do not understand the process for last mode memory. If what I understand is correct, the OTC must totally discharge to store the last mode. It seems to my simple mind that it never discharges while off and therefore considers the off time as a medium press. So, I think I have to get it to discharge more. But, I am not sure if a larger or smaller bleeder will cause that to happen or larger or smaller resistor in the tail cap. Memory works on a standard tail cap.

I see that guys have it working on the A6, maybe someone will chime in with their resistor values.

Gotta hit the rack, will work more on this one. I really like the idea.

Matt

BTW, the center hole is great. It is always hard for me to get the conductor soldered in on the center of the pad.

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

pilotdog68
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i see what you’re saying now. Maybe try posting it in the lighted tailcap thread so the others see it.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

Joshk
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Is there anything you would have added to this project if you had more space?

pilotdog68
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Hmm.. I was able to fit just about everything on the 20mm. Once development gets a little further on FW for the new mcu’s I’ll probably do some with 3 pwm channels.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

Joshk
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I was thinking about board stacking for more space. I have not seen it done before, I’m not sure why.

mattlward
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I have the driver and firmware working and completed. I may add a couple more 7135’s and save this driver for my first triple in a Convoy tube light. Still have to acquire the parts, LED’s, good Noctigon board and spacers for the Convoy. This really screams well regulated medium mode triple!

So to combine notes, just in case someone else runs into any of the issues that I have.
1) Make sure that the OTC and R1 are in the right orientation. Prevents much head banging!
2) My build used standard FET+1 parts with a 22k resistor and a 560 ohm bleeder.
3) I really wanted to use BLF-A6 firmware for mode reversing. I also wanted to eliminate strobe and bike flasher, figured out changes and they worked.
4) Use offtime-cap.hex, it will save some guess work.
5) Wanted to use the voltage to adc converter to find LVP and shutdown volts. Had to guess at the settings to some degree. My cheap bench supply must have excessive ripple or a bad wave since values were BS and way high compared to a real battery. But discharging a battery by tenths while the firmware was loaded is not going to happen. Will have to check battery during controlled discharge and adjust firmware in the future.
6) These values in the “tk-calibration.h” file work very well with lighted and traditional tailcap.

#ifdef OFFTIM3
// The OTC value 0.5s after being disconnected from power
// (anything higher than this is a “short press”)
#define CAP_SHORT 235
//was 210, 225
// The OTC value 1.5s after being disconnected from power
// Between CAP_MED and CAP_SHORT is a “medium press”
#define CAP_MED 170
// was 170
// Below CAP_MED is a long press
#else
// The OTC value 1.0s after being disconnected from power
// Anything higher than this is a short press, lower is a long press
#define CAP_SHORT 150
#endif

7) The hole for the LED+ wire from the spring to the LED direct works great, I used 20ga wire.
And finally…
8) This really begs to be a triple! I have not built one yet, but now I will have to.

I do only really find 1 possible negative, and I will test it at a later point. I am concerned about mounting 7135’s on the battery side due to possible tab clearance issues with the driver ring in a Convoy light. But, they may go!

Thanks for reading, hope someone else tries this driver. PilotDog has designed a very well thought out board. I just wish I had those skills. I have tried the software and it makes my head hurt!

Matt

EDC rotation:
FW1A, LH351D 4000k (second favorite)
FW3A, LH351D 3500k
FW3A, SST20 FD2 4000k
FW3A, Nichia 4000k sw40 r9080 (favorite light!)
FW3A, Cree XP-L Hi 5A3
Emisar D4V2, SST20 4000k
S2+, XM-L2 T6 4C

pilotdog68
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Thanks!

Just a note on #7, I’m 99% sure it won’t clear a convoy retaining ring with 7135’s on the back. In those instances it might work to modify the ring as others have done to fit qlite’s, or soldering to the pill may be required.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

Tom E
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Just ordered 1 set of each size. Nice work, once again PD68!

Wonder if I can get an LDO on here - haven't done any research on LDO's yet though.

pyro1son
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What size did you want for LDO I have one that’s 22mm

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Tom E
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pyro1son wrote:
What size did you want for LDO I have one that's 22mm

Ahhh - just browsed thru your OSHPark designs from your sig line. Lots of good things. Well not sure yet what sizes. Need to mod up a 7G10 - probably using a XHP70, might do a Yezl Y3 as well. Right now I know squat about an LDO - don't even have the LDO parts yet. All I know is it's needed for a 6V, 2S cell mod with an e-switch to reduce parasitic drain. Also it replaces the zener, but not sure how it's wired in exactly.

 Yes, saw your 22 board: https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/CNNTJkeT, looks like v003 is your latest? Didn't realize the LDO part is so big.

pyro1son
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Yeh I’ve been looking for a smaller LDO but been unsuccessful. Iam4wheeler has been testing this board.

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itsonlyme
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http://www.bobstarr.net/pages/downloads.html
https://github.com/robertstarr/lbr_user

I hope you pcb designers can get something from this. While I dont fully grasp it, sounds like he has made improved libs for Eagle for surface mount components. I hope its useful

chouster
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I just received my boards from OSH Park, 3x DoubleDown 17mm rev. 2.1, 3x Triple Down 17mm rev. 1.1z, 3x Triple Down 17mm rev. 2.

PD68, with the DoubleDown 17mm rev. 2.1 the inside of the through-hole isn’t supposed to be plated, right? Cause mine are. Were yours plated? Also from post #57 it seems like mattlward’s boards have them plated on the inside too. I feel that it’s too freakin close to the FET pad and maybe traces coming from the MCU

I’m gonna try to make some pictures now.

EDIT: From further looking at these boards I must say, I’m not happy with the quality from OSH Park this time. I’ll explain soon.

EDIT2: Don’t get me wrong. I love OSH Park and what they provide to us. Ok, here are some shots. Please excuse that I couldn’t get it closer, I have to work with what I got, and I ain’t got a macro lens.

(click the image to see full size)

Notice the lack of the ground ring on the left side and the weird things going on with the plating of most of the pads?

pilotdog68
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Yeah, there’s definitely something wrong with that board. I would contact them, thet normally fix any issues very quickly.

Regarding the hole, it doesn’t need to be plated, but they usually come that way. Just check with a DMM to make sure it isn’t shorted.

But I think the other parts of the board make it almost unusable anyways

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

DavidEF
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pilotdog68 wrote:
Yeah, there’s definitely something wrong with that board. I would contact them, thet normally fix any issues very quickly.

Regarding the hole, it doesn’t need to be plated, but they usually come that way. Just check with a DMM to make sure it isn’t shorted.

But I think the other parts of the board make it almost unusable anyways


Not that I know anything about it, but…

The only thing that looks to me like it might make the board unusable would be the ground ring. If you can confirm that the ground ring does make contact in your light host, the rest of the board should be functionally okay, though a bit ugly.

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pyro1son
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All of the pads looks like they have been shifted over to the right

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chouster
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Thanks for taking a look and for your feedback, guys. Checked with DMM, no shorts so far. Seems shifted indeed, now that you say it, pyro.

And of course thanks to you PD, for making and sharing these boards. Hope you’ll get a nice firmware for your TripleDown, so many possibilities to use that board.

EDIT: By the way, now when I have these boards in front of me thinking about how to flash, adjust firmware and reflash, and adjust firmware and reflash them… it totally makes sense having an additional LED+ pad. Will use that and move the LED+ wire to the spring at the end.

pilotdog68
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Looking at it more, as David said the ground ring could cause a problem, and I’m not sure what would happen if Pin1 (the dot) is shorted to ground. It looks close.

chouster wrote:
By the way, now when I have these boards in front of me thinking about how to flash, adjust firmware and reflash, and adjust firmware and reflash them… it totally makes sense having an additional LED+ pad. Will use that and move the LED+ wire to the spring at the end.

I would suggest soldering both your power supply/battery connection to the Batt+ spring pad for testing. Otherwise you will probably have to un-solder the LED+ wire every time you want to reflash. There usually isn’t enough space for the SOIC8 clip to fit with the wire there.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

chouster
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I think I’ll pick the best looking one of the three I got and give it a try – carefully handsoldering. Will finish some other stuff first, but will keep you updated. Thanks

pilotdog68
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chouster wrote:
I think I’ll pick the best looking one of the three I got and give it a try – carefully handsoldering. Will finish some other stuff first, but will keep you updated. Thanks

check continuity between Pin1 and gnd, there shouldn’t be any. I’m not positive, but I think there might be a chance of ‘bricking’ your attiny if there is. (maybe someone else can confirm yea/nay?) Pin1 is the Reset pin.

My Favorite Modded Lights: X6R, S8 , X2R , M6, SP03

Major Projects:  Illuminated Tailcap, TripleDown/TripleStack Driver

chouster
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Just checked it, no continuity there. Thanks PD.

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