Yeah. it is just such a shame that it is evidently direct drive. It is a very nice looking, bright light. It gained Lumens almost through out the entire 30 seconds. During the T/C test the amps also increased. That east092 driver is kind of scary in this light.
AFAIK, C8 and C12 reflectors are same.
IIRC, Chris Zhou did not compare C8 and C12. There is another C8 reviewer who said C8 was brighter than C12.
As some mentioned, there is no logical reason why C8 is brighter than C12, and if anything C12 should be brighter with its bigger heat sinking fins.
This kind of info and comparison is exactly what I wanted to happen on my original thread, makes me h-h-happy…carry on! 
Sam I am still looking for the link for the first part of my statement but here is the link where chriszhou states that the c12 from Lightmalls out performs the C8 bought from them.
Most of what I am reading is kind of suggesting the opposite but I just wanted to show both sides.
We are both correct. Your C12/C8 is XM-L T6, while my C12/C8 is XM-L2 [U2]. Often it’s not clear whether which C12 is compared to which C8. This mixing/confusion of which emitter bin being compared contributes to confusion/misunderstanding.
Well Sam this is getting even stranger. Lol. You are correct. Partially anyway. The C12 is XM-L T6 but the C8 that got beat by it was XM-L U2 unless I am missing another review by him. The C12 review took place in October and the C8 in August. :~
.
.
.
.
Man…. now I think I’m even more confused.
Good for reference to link those threads here. 
I hate to say it but it almost sounds like unless you get the Xin TD it is kind of a crap shoot.
I think what we’re seeing here is that straight out of the box, it’s a ‘luck of the draw’ kinda thing. They vary so much that a light that ‘technically’ shouldn’t be brighter, IS brighter than another light that should win the contest. This is why I ordered the C12 XM-L2 U3…at least ‘maybe’ I won’t have to replace the emitter, and it ‘might’ have better heat dissipation than a C8! (but who knows…)
EDIT: Just saw Manxbuggy1’s post above. ^ He says the same thing, only much more succinctly!
EDIT 2: So if you get a light with a decent emitter and a driver that puts out enough amps, it’s mainly a matter of using a good battery, heat management and making sure the juice gets where it needs to be. Right?
Fixed that for you 
Seriously, this is why I always say the XinTD is worth every penny.
Do we have serial numbers we could compare? That’s about the only way I can think of getting more exact with this. Probably not possible though.
true true and again from what I read thw KDX8XML2-u2 should have been a flamethrower its only slightly ahead of the LMC8XMLU3 and way behind the LU2 and even XMLT-6 ! Now I have again ordered the wrong light the LMC12XML2-U2 hoping to get the king of the C8 and similar sized platforms
I would say if it is a c8/c12 from Lightmalls it will be a nice bright light. Mine and your U3’s are the only under acheiving C8’s from lightmalls. My XM-L2, XM-L2 & Trustfire T6 all bought from lightmalls are nice powerful lights. Hopefully your C12 from there will follow that trend.
Still like my LM xm-l2 u2 C8. Hope you get a good one.
I’ll bet Tom E could make any of these lights into flamethrowers without ‘too’ many changes!
+1 
Well there are limits... My C8's are usually 3.85A and can get in the 1,200's (lumens) at 30 secs, but this is fully mod'ed out for a C8: UCL lens, extra copper in the pill, XM-L2 U2 on copper star, Samsung 20R cell, copper braided springs, etc. For HD2010's and SS T08, usually go 4.2A and get in the 1,300's (maybe close to 1,400), and better runtimes at high output.
My LightMalls C8 (original U2) has a copper pill in it now from VOB, but I didn't see any increase in lumens measurement when I upgraded it with the pill, though runtimes I'm thinking will be better with more consistent high output, but didn't measure it.
Tom, what would you recommend as a ‘most essential’ mod to one of these lights, assuming we don’t have your skills? Is there something that is easy to do and yields more lumens or efficiency? (My first guess is…buy a Samsung 20R… :bigsmile: )
There's no simple answer - if you got a high amp direct drive, best mod would be good emitter on copper star (don't go with a low resistance cell and copper braiding because you may fry something). If you have a lower amp, non-direct drive, then maybe the driver first, 2nd is the emitter on copper. Copper star's benefit over 3 amps for output, though still better in thermal mgt for lower amps. I'd say lower down is the copper braided springs and UCL lens. Of course if you go from XML to XM-L2, amps may drop significantly, so then the better, lower resistance cell will help to get the amps back up.
I usually replace the switch as well - one rated at 1.5A 250v like this: http://www.fasttech.com/products/1610/10001865/1135000-15a-250v-reverse-clicky-switches-2-pack. Most of these C8's take that size switch.
I prett much always test the tailcap by measuring the lumens of the light assembled, then check the lumens with the tailcap off - using a heavy wire to connect the cell neg. to the host body. Usually just doing the copper braid on the spring recovers all lost lumens -- this is quite revealing... I've never noticed lost lumens from the switch itself, just that the bought 1.5A 250v OMTEL's are better quality, better feel.
So, a stock light is kind of ‘self-regulating’ with its inefficiencies? To mod it for better current flow without getting heat management under control is asking for trouble. Is that what you’re saying…sort of?
Thank you for the little mini-class, I’m still very new to all this!
Yes - the 'direct drive' stock lights are sort of self-regulating (would be 6+ amps and burn out if not for the thin wires, poor springs, high resistance battery, etc.). And yes, all these mods are kind of related. Heat mgt is a bit tricky - best measured over time of minutes, not just 30 seconds, and all depends on how you use your flashlight - short burst on high, longer runs, mostly used on med or lo, etc. Going 4.5A or above will get you nothing more on XM-L2 on copper, with a single 18650 cell, linear driver light because of the high Vf demand.
to be fair, pushing a similar xp-g2 beyond 4.5a on a single cell will be similarly fruitless, we are back at the point where emitter tech has exceeded cell tech, now we have to consider a battery to really push things to the limit in a usable way……
I’m pretty sure that in twelve months time, 5a from a single cell will be almost common place with the cell maintaining an acceptable voltage curve for ooooo, half an hour or more
Then new emitters will come out to upset all we have learnt once again. Can’t wait myself.