I was just on my balcony with my solarforce L2P and P1D. Each light was running an XM-L with a Qlite 3.04 driver on high. Although neither drop-in is wrapped, I didn’t have any excessive heat problems. I could feel the L2P getting warmer before the P1D.
Unless you're willing to spend the bucks for heads like the A001 or Ronac/Cryo's cooling bezel, I don't think you'll be able to find a P60 head with fins cheaply and easily.
That being said, I have the P1D and it is definitely one of the heftiest P60 hosts you'll find. It should be able to wick away more heat from the dropin compared to other hosts simply due to its mass.
@texaspyro - thanks for the confirmation! i thought i had figured that out, then had a relapse… lol! the SF XM-L I have will handle 2 x 18650 so whatever configuration I lego my extension tube into will use that drop-in…
@garry, ouchy, & moses - thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences… perhaps I am being too ‘paranoid’? at the end of all this I do want this light to outperform my current P60, but I guess I will have to make concessions (runtimes) along the way… I’ll keep lookin’!
thanks again!
I’ve come to believe that cooling gets more concern than it really deserves. I have several el-cheapo WF-501Bs that are about as poorly designed for cooling as they come. I wrapped the drop-in’s with copper ribbon to a snug fit, smeared on a bit of thermal gloop, and the improved heat transfer was quite dramatic. Others have used strips of Coke can aluminum with equal success.
Secondly, I doubt that many people really run their lights on high for a long enough period to do any harm. Most of today’s lights are more than adequate on medium, and offer much greater run times at that level, and heat at 1500 mA or so isn’t much of a problem. I know that I rarely run a P60 light on high for a full minute. I just don’t seem to ever need to.
Admittedly, if it was a 5 amp light with a 3 amp medium, things would be different.
Without wrapping, wouldn’t that mean you could have heat issues without realizing it. All the heat is stick in the drop-in instead of going to the body.
When I run my wrapped p60 lights on 3A, the body gets hot quick. I’d definately wrap my drop-ins to try and lower temps at the LED. Not only to combat lumen sag but also to preserve led life by not killing it with heat.
As far as I am aware, only one has ever been produced that can properly sink 3+ amps without additional mods: The thick aluminum host of the TrustFire TF-R2. The P60 pill screws directly into it. After owning this light, I got rid of more than a dozen P60 lights and am very happy to be down to only 2 now. IMHO, the P60 remains by far the worse mainstream design and investment that can be had in this hobby.
I happen to think the P60 is one of the best designs for a torch. What other torch can you just swap the LED, or reflector, just like that.
The problem is, we all want to drive them too hard. 1.5/2A is plenty. Since I got my olight i6 I decided that all my lights would be driven more modestly. Whats more I cannot think of a more beautiful light to look at or hold, for the money than the Solarforce L2T. The bizarre thing is, it has an XML running at 2.8A, but it doesn’t stay there very long and when it drops to around 1.6A It is hard to see much difference in light output.
Marc.
I think you mean the P60 concept is great. The versatility of the P60 concept is just what appeals to the typical flashaholic. Problem is the heatsink-absent design dating from incan-times. What even appeals more to the typical flashaholic is output. We arrived at typical 3+ amps now, and the P60 design is just not going to work (well, just with makeshift wrapping and thermal pasting, it gets dirty and you loose the nice versatility of the P60 system). As others have pointed out as well: it is time for a new standard that allows easy swapping and that does heatsink well. The TrustFire TF-R2 could be it, making your collection of P60 drop-ins still useful, but I think the standard C8-pills fits the bill better, better suited for good heatsinking and it fits in various flashlights. But these solutions do not allow easy swapping of the reflector as well. Still waiting for the holy grail...
Once my WF501B turned on accidentally in a backpack (3A on high). The drop-in was not wrapped in anything. Found it probably 30+ min afterwards it went on. Light was still very bright! 80 degree Celsius on the head. Measured with IR meter. I could not touch the head. Even the tail was too hot to touch for more than half a second. Luckily I had a lanyard attached to it and managed to turn it off and take out the battery once the tailcap had cooled enough.
XM-Ls seem to handle a lot of abuse around 3 amps!
When a light is too hot to comfortably hold, turn it down to medium or low.
If I go outside, there is little amount of wind and several minus degrees a P60 is barely able to function as a hand warmer while using it on high. Heat issues depend a lot on the environment. And no matter how hot the light gets with a 3A drop-in. The LED will most likely survive without issues is long as its in a P60 and the LED is attached properly to the pill. If you are able to hold the light, I would not worry at all about the LED.
I think people worry too much about heat issues. Especially when driving XM-L at 3amps or less. A P60 probably have much better heat sinking to the body than say a Nitecore Caveman.
When that is said. I normally aim for good heat sinking in combination with copper sinkpad. Just because, maximum output on high!
>)
Being fairly new to the modding hobby, I finally picked up my first P60 host in order to try out all the various LED types and tints. Since it costs hardly anything to build a P60, it is a great way to build a working library of LEDs. I bought a second host just so I could then do side by side comparisons. I also like P60s for trying out new techniques. Best to work things out on inexpensive format before trying them in a more permanent host.
I have a bunch of 501B P60’s and they work great for their intended purpose. All of mine have special LED’s (red/green/blue/365 nm/385nm/395nm/800nm/850nm940nm/etc). They are not driven to obscene levels. I would not put a 3A+ LED in a P60 light.
Most P60 host seem to have a big gap to fill between the reflector and the host. There are some silver hosts on ebay that are from Aleto. They have the smallest gap and the thickest wall I have seen so far. It also has some small fins. My experience with P60’s light though. I have only seen Citipower and Ultrafire 501 and 502’s mostly.
I'm a fan of this one:
...although I understand the newer version isn't made quite as well as the older one I have. Mine is extremely rugged; I ran over it in an asphalt parking lot and it just scuffed the finish on a couple of spots and bent the bezel ring. A drop-in fits closer so less wrapping needed. A well-wrapped pill transfers heat into the body of the host very well, with more mass and heat-sink area than your typical 50xb-type host.
Do you have a link to the Aleto? A model number/name? I've never run across that one.
-Garry
I agree with what you said, but… can you actually find a “C8 drop-in”? To be clear, what I mean by “C8 drop-in” is a drop-in that you can just put into an existing C8 (host) without modifying either the host or the drop-in.
Yea me to!
C8 "drop-in" here:
Actually, a pill with a driver/emitter pre-installed. Not a simple modular drop-in/easy-swap like a P60.
I have been using that SR5 Host for 3 years with XPG R5. wrapping the drop in with alumunium foil is a must to preserve the thermal transfer capability. I will be having one with XML T6 very soon. I’m gonna wrap it too. Hopefully the drop in can handle XML well. and this host is clone of Lumens Factory Seraph P6.
their drop in is also good one.
I would like to see more C8 "screw ins" but they likely would be the same price as a C8 light. Especially the FT Convoy. That line of lights is where things are heading to, what you want how you want it.
Ahh. Can you tell what kind of emitter that is?