FWIW, I originally thought that dim mode was nearly useless as well. Have been EDCing the light for several months now and have grown to actually appreciate it. Spends most of the time in my pocket anyway where the light is irrelevant. If I put the light on my night stand that dim little light that I used to think was useless is actually quite visible and yet not enough to disturb my sleep. Quite satisfied with it now. The only thing I really value with that light anyway is that it marks out going above regulation. It does that very clearly and I rely on it. I keep mine at one level below regulation and therefore don’t bother to lock it out in my pocket. Only occasionally does it accidentally come on while carrying. At that level there are no heat issues and even if it goes on for hours it is but a blip in the battery capacity.
Just took it off the charger for its once a month charging at it took 2500 mAh. That is all parasitic drain included with however I used it this past month. Definitely hit turbo and high a few times but again, default is below regulation and I go up from there as needed so clearly typical use is not that much for me. Mostly I use an EO2 II for walking the pooches and just swap batteries every day or two. The TS21 is only used on walks occasionally for things like keeping the foxes at bay or just for the fun of having the equivalent of my car’s high beams in my hand;-)
While I’m at it some numbers from the incredibly popular Emisar D4V2:
D4V2 Copper w/ lighted switch AND top aux lights: High 1 mA , Low 67 µA
D4V2 Aluminum with top aux lights only: High 1.9 mA, Low 116 µA
So a number of “normal” lights (Sofirn, Wurkkos TS30, Emisa) seem to be around 1-2 mA at the high setting. I really am having more fun (and more to learn) from flashlights than I’ve ever expected lol.
High is out of the question. Dim works for some people, but too dim for me. I am testing blinking - it blinks every 3 seconds, BUT… the duration of the blink is less than a second, so it’s going to be reduced more than 75% I hope (fingers crossed).
As posted in the first post of this thread, the following 2 steps solve the TS21’s problems: 1. Thermal calibration and increase max stepdown temp. 2. Re-set switch’s light to dim or blinking.
So still highly recommended for Nichia collectors looking for a PERFECT neutral-tint LED (mine lands right on the BBL) at 5000K CCT, with NOT a hint of tint shift (perfect white to grey transition on beam shot). And of course CRI is highest rating possible, R9080. :+1:
I have some good news for TS21 owners . I am running a quick test wherein I set aux lights of a couple Wurkkos (TS21, TS30), a Sofirn (IF25a), and a Convoy S21D at different brightness levels and compare battery voltage drop over days. Preliminary 1st run (will do more trials to confirm) is that the blink mode in our beloved but infamous Wurkkos TS21 drops voltage less than high mode in Sofirn IF25a, which drains 1.55 mA, a number seemingly “typical” of the lights I have.
For example: Sofirn 4.15 to 4.12 v in 3 days, vs Wurkkos 4.09 to 4.08. The battery voltage drops have a fairly consistent pattern, so far. But this is first trial so please take with a small grain of salt. And anyone with multiple lights could do same test to compare with my result.
What does this mean? The blink mode is good and safe in TS21. Next I will compare voltage drop of blink mode in TS21 vs low brightness in Sofirn IF25a, which drains 81-352 µA (it jumps up every few seconds for some strange reason). Since no one “should” be using high mode anyway (too much drain even in normal functioning lights such as Sofirn IF25a and Emisar D4V20), this “finding” also means our Wurkkos TS21’s parasitic drain is for all practical purposes a non issue.
More good news from the Anduril thread, especially for “blinkers” : there is Low Voltage Protection specifically for the aux and button LED. LVP means at 2.8 V the aux/button LED should turn off.
Note that for lights with single-color aux LED like this Wurkkos TS21, the protection is for blinking mode only, NOT dim mode (strange isn’t it?).
I don’t have a chance to test yet, but if you have any battery that dips to 2.8 v level please check to see if it works.
Haha I am “sorry” to have caused anyone to spend $. Still by far among the least costly of all hobbies though.
And… the fun is more than worth it.
IMHO, this is a light one buys for the “reference” LED that somehow Wurkkos lucks into (just kidding). The beam is on the cold side but still a must-have for collectors because of CCT (5000k) and Duv (on-BBL neutral). The +prototype “daylight neutral tint+”. R9080, NO tint shift.
Have fun and please share your experience. Sound like you are experienced with flashing firmware, something that I know nothing about, but I’m sure other readers would appreciate.
I guess that explains why the silver 219C is way more expensive than the first ones that came out. It’s more than just a new color or new stocks but rather a surprising upgrade.
(More good news for TS21 owners who use blinking button mode.) Because it’s not possible to know exactly the parasitic drain of the blinking mode, I left 3 Anduril lights alone for 3 weeks and measure voltage drop. The 3 lights are 2 Sofirn IF25a’s (High and Dim mode) and the Wurkkos TS21 (Blink mode).
Anduril Dim Button (~100 µA drain measured): 0.079 volt
Anduril Blink Button (unknown): 0.112 (so it seems blink mode is about between dim and bright Anduril mode)
Anduril Bright Button (~1.5 mA drain measured): 0.164
Convoy S21D Blue Metal Button (4.1v: 9.4 mA , at 3v: 2.74 mA): 0.067
Before you cry bloody murder, yes I am aware relationship between voltage drop and consumption varies among batteries, but this is best I could do as an amateur to test the blinking mode. (It didn’t help my cause that I forgot to use the same battery brand for the tested lights .) So please take this as a rough GUESSTIMATE. And if you have time do the same test so I could confirm my result.
Exemplary Convoy number but doesn’t make sense if you compare it against specs from Simon. I am sure of my result though because I have made measurements at intervals in between and it has matched Anduril Dim step by step. Nevertheless I’d like to repeat test; is it one more reason to love Convoy?
I agree that the Convoy numbers don't make sense, but not because of specs from Simon.
According to the numbers above, the Convoy drain is above 2mA at all times, compared to Anduril bright button at 1.5mA. Despite the higher drain, the drop in voltage is almost 3x lower.
Another reason the numbers don't make sense to me: let's assume the best case, that the Convoy drains only 2.74mA constantly. Then over a three-week period, the amount of capacity drained is at least 2.74*24*7*3=1380mAh. This is between 1/3 and 1/4 of the total capacity of a 21700, which should drop the voltage much more than 0.067V.
I feel that I might be misunderstanding some parts of your post, but am unsure--any clarification would be appreciated!
BTW, my S2+ with blue rubber button always drains less than 2mA; below around 3.9V, the drain is low enough to be undetectable by my multimeter with 1mA resolution. My orange button drains less than 4mA.
Thanks for the comments. Another set of “raw” numbers - from 8/27 to 9/21:
Sofirn Bright drops 1.5*24*7*3=756mAh
Voltage drop 4.192 - 4.028=0.164v
Does this one make sense?
A couple things I’m thinking:
first is that the voltage drop is not linear - very flat at top,
second, the blue light draw in my S21D is neither of Simon’s spec, and less than 2.74mA. Not as easy to measure but I’ll try later.
third, thanks to your number 2mA, does it mean Simon’s specs below on Aliexpress are just wrong? I maybe should ask him.
fourth and probably most important, I possibly made a mistake and need to run test again. In case you have any interest, maybe run the test yourself for 1 week.
(Metal button + adapter + 20mm lighted switch) kit for for M21A M21B M21C M26C L21A S12 S16 etc.
When the battery is fully charged and the voltage is 4.2V
Blue light consumption current 9.4mA,
Orange light consumption current 14mA,
When the battery is low and the voltage is 3.0V
Blue light consumption current 2.74mA,
Orange light consumption current 6.8mA,
The new Sofirn numbers you just posted seem very reasonable. It is helpful to reference this mAh loss versus voltage drop plot of a Sofirn 21700, taken from HKJ's review.
I do agree that the voltage drop is highly nonlinear, but even with the flat top of the curve, losing 1380mAh would easily sink 0.2V, which is way off from 0.067V!
Ok, I think I understand my confusion now--the current draw from post #100 are Simon's numbers, not yours! I would love to see what kind of numbers you get with your test equipment. My meter only has 1mA precision, which is as good as none at this scale!
My numbers certainly disagree greatly from Simon's, but I couldn't say for sure that his are wrong for all lights. My setup is S2+ running 4-mode 5A driver, and it is known that driver choice greatly influences current draw. With a 17mm ramping driver instead, the drain is so low that my meter cannot register it at all, and the tailcap becomes much, much dimmer. Maybe there is some driver that causes faster drain, but I don't know. I feel that Simon is really erring on the side of caution with his numbers, which I do appreciate. It's better to expect hazardously high levels of current drain and get low drain in reality, than the other way around.
Finally did the measurement with this end switch arrangement and didn’t blow up anything (the end switch thing is the only reason why I haven’t measured it). 4 volt Sofirn battery with both S21D and M21B, blue metal switch. I have one lead on spring, other lead on battery rear, then press really (really) hard of end of cap to body of light for the blue light to go on. I hope that’s correct.
I think I found an explanation for why my empirical voltage drop is so low: the Convoy blue metal switch’s current draw is very low. So low that I have to have my wife take a picture for proof . Anyone with similar light if you’re interested please check to confirm my results.
Assuming I have done test correctly (I think so), the blue light metal switch in M21B and S21D is a miser, running about 400-500 µA, still higher than Anduril Dim (~100 µA), but nowhere near specs posted on Aliexpress of 9.4 mA. 9.4 mA is very bad and this error puzzles me - has anyone discussed this?
Thank you so much cannga for the data! Your testing method looks right, and the numbers are believable. 395 microamps over 3 weeks is 100mAh, which should result in less than 0.05V drop. The fact that you measured more voltage drop suggests that the loss from lighted tail is on the same order of magnitude as loss from self-discharge, which is really good news!
As far as I know nobody has discussed the discrepancy between Convoy's numbers and the actual current draw. Maybe we could make a post in the Convoy thread about this discovery?
Thanks. At the least Simon’s 9.4 mA is way off no? 9.4mA x 7 x 24 = 1579 mAh per week - is my math correct?
Most definitely my Convoys don’t go into LVP mode for at least a couple of months, let alone 3-4 weeks.
That 9.4 mA spec is actually the reason I included Convoy in this comparsion - it has bothered me.
Hello Argo, I was reading one of your reviews the other day and could EASILY tell you are a seasoned shutterbug and pixel peeper (like me ). That was the first time I noticed that with any flashlight reviewers.
Thanks for the very nice photo comparison.
.) So please take this as a rough GUESSTIMATE. And if you have time do the same test so I could confirm my result.
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