Wurkkos TS25 pre-production unit review and suggestion + some measurments from a production unit

dedomed TS25, stock TS25:

more info here

ps, my mistake, that is not a TS25, it is a D4K (carclo quad w 21700, so maybe similar… not sure.) I do not know if the TS25 uses carclo also.

Thanks jon_slider I noticed, but out of courtesy did not respond. But yes, you fixed it. I saw comparison shots on the wall of the TS25 specifically and the difference in hotspot size was significant, definitely not the same as this.

glad you found photos… please share a link or post here?

And now that you got the answer to your questions, what do you think? Do you want to dedome or keep domes on?

fwiw, on the D4K, here is the beam profile difference:

Looks terrible! Unfortunately, there are no photos for TS25 (online correspondence, did not save), but it was much better there. An even circle, smaller and more intense than stock 3 times! That is, it turned out to be a fairly long-range flashlight, which is also not quite what I would like. And unfortunately, there were no photos in nature.

thanks for the info…
I hope you enjoy whatever light you decide to try

The optic of TS25 is a little different from the Carclo optics we used to see in Emisar or Noctigon lights. The TIR optic of TS25 is partially frosted at the part where it is right above the led.

First, here are some photos.

clear (d4v2), frosted (kr4), partially frosted (ts25)

clear (d4v2), frosted (kr4), partially frosted (ts25)

Partially frosted, front view. The front surface is smooth. The frosted surface is in the rear.

Partially frosted, rear view. The frosted surface is in the recessed area.

Im often mindful of other night walkers and blinding cars. I did notice with the ts25 looking towards the light, even from the very side, hurts my eyes more than say my fireflies Tir optics. I think that frosting might be why.

As far as I know, frosted surfaces smooth out tint shifts and beam artifacts. You can see the direct comparison in the famous mauka’s review on KR4. At the same time, the frosted surface diffuse light therefore are more noticeable from the very side. I think this may be the reason why you notice more light from the side. You are seeing diffused light on the frosted surface, which you wouldn’t see on clear TIR optic.

By the way, when I shine D4v2, KR4, and TS25 on a white wall, I see TS25 hot spot is more focused compared to the other two. So, I think the TIR in TS25 is more focused by design even with the small frosted spots.

Yeah it just seems more painful to look at even on low and leaves dots in my eyes shaped like the 4 frosted areas. Not the end of the world but something i might avoid in the future. I can pretty much look at my fireflies on full power from the side without discomfort.

Those dots!!! I had several instances that I accidentally turned on turbo on my NOV-MU. It was from the sides, but since NOV-MU does not have optics it left red led marks on my retina for a while (several minutes if I recall correctly).

I set my aux leds on high so that I make sure not to look at it when I turn it on. The aux leds are like a warning light that the high-powered light is loaded.

Yeah ive set mine to red when in standby/ready and voltage when locked after 4 minutes.

I very rarely accidentally blast myself im just thinking about people nearby and pets on walks.

I liked the fact that the e07 could be up bright enough for my walk and not blind everything nearby to my sides. The beam hot spot is pretty much the same width so its not like its the beam angle. Its the reflection from that optic

It is normal that triple and quad Tir optics have more visible sidelight than a reflector w single LED that sits farther away from the bezel


This viewing angle with a reflector, blocks line of sight to the LED. Whereas the Tir produce more glare in line of sight, because the illuminated center of the optic is closer to the bezel.
I can see the illuminated center of the Tir optics, but not the LEDs in the reflectors.

That is why I prefer to use reflector lights, when I use a light tailstanding below eye level.

When using a light around people, I always make sure to aim it in such a way that the spill of the beam cannot reach their eyes. I can do that by aiming the light towards the ground, not horizontally.

I can also use my hand around the bezel of a Tir, to block sidelight more. For example, I can hold the light in icepick position, with my fist against my chest, while aiming the light at a downward angle. This makes it very easy to stabilize the beam and block any horizontal glare.

The distance may have played some role. But in this case glowing frosted lens is in play I think. The TIR in TS10 is also like TS25 in that it is partially frosted. It is the frosted part that glows.

As far as I know clear TIR lens usually have better focus and less spill in general.

Yeah i have plenty of tir lights and have no problem with glare or beam angle.

The second im on the led side of this ts25 its messing my night vision up for a few minutes and leaves spots in my eyes.

Maybe ill find a different optic or just use it on lone walks.

wide hotspot “floody wall of light”, narrow hotspot “throwy”:

Maybe I should elaborate it more here. What I meant was for the same hot spot angle (viewing angle), TIR lens can achieve more focused beam than reflectors. This point is well illustrated at LEDiL’s webpage.

Original image is taken from https://www.ledil.com/support/guide-to-tir-lenses/ and I added the illustration describing what may happen in TIR of TS25 at the bottom.

TIR generally have less spill. However, frosted surface will emit light when the led below it is lit. It therefore creates additional spill similar to the orange beam seen in the illustration of a reflector. The difference is that orange beam will start from the frosted surface. This effect is illustrated at the bottom of the above image.

Of course, not all TIR lens are designed the same. Some may have larger hot spot, some may choose not to focus the beam to the hotspot, and some may artificially include more spill by frosting the surface.

Yes im totally with you limsup thats why ive gone with TIR mostly. My ms03 was a good example of a reflective torch that washed out your night vision with spill or got trucks beeping at me but thats obviously a serious flooder and expected that.

The frosted part on these seems visibly nearer the lens surface so its bouncing a little light 180 degrees. So theres no spill on the ts25 its just a bit painful for anyone on the LED side regardless of how im pointing it.

The fireflies look deeper down inside and obviously arnt frosted.

Maybe the green harsh samsung led doesnt help lol. Might try the nichia too and im sure that will improve somewhat.

I walk on pitch black lanes and through woods so this probably is a bit specific to me and not really an issue just something ive not had before.

l-r single LED in reflector, triple narrrow clear carclo, triple TS10

lights off:

lights on, but single LED not visible:

lights on, with single LED visible:

floody multi LED lights create a wall of light, and stepping in front of the bezel will illuminate a person. otoh, a single LED in a reflector will leave dark areas in front of the bezel, that do not illuminate a person:

pics from this thread

Im not sure we are talking about the same thing.

Heres a picture of the side of two 5000k tir torches.

My camera cannot focus on the ts25 at 1000 lumen as its too intense. Its also way whiter looking and actually hurts my eyes at 1000 lumen. The fireflies is set to around 1500 here and no pain and the camera can focus on each optic easily.

I can barely see any spill from either torch but looking at the ts25 from the side isnt good for me. Im not looking at the led im looking at a highly illuminated frosted lens area from the side. Like when I’m climbing over a gate i get an eye full.

maybe you are right, youre talking about the frosting, and I keep talking about the beam angle and line of sight to the LEDs… three different things :wink:

can you take a photo of the fireflies beam aimed straight at a wall, side by side w the TS25 please, so we can see which one has the more narrow focus?

in any case, since the TS25 keeps beaming you in the eye, for whatever reasons, I hope you have other options that suit you better