Update: 10-22-17. KRONOS K70 GB. $50. 243 on list!

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Muto
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Muto, Muto

2 please, looks Awesome!
Thanks,
Keith

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ReManG
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Yup, put me down for one!

This looks awesome, any chance on a ~4000K NW tint option?

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JasonWW
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Is the side switch built into the driver? If so, that will make it very hard to do a driver swap.

Also, what size is the driver?

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware (old), lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos for BLF Q8, GT, GT Mini and ROT66

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

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RobertB
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DB Custom wrote:
I’ve seen thermal imaging tests taken as a light was turned on and in the first seconds as the heat made it’s way through the heat sink. They said the pattern was almost exactly an inversion of the light coming out the front, so if you consider the light out the top as the top half of an X and the heat out from under the emitter as the bottom half of this X, you see where the heat needs to go for fast and immediate dispersal.

Having fins on the head, up by the reflector, is simply not efficient. Sure, eventually those fins will transfer some heat to the surrounding air, but the light has to get saturated first, allowing the emitter to sit in it’s own heat for far too long a period.

Deep fins in the expanding cone of thermal path would be most effective. And yes, if aesthetic fins on the head need to be figured in then the pill and head should ideally be one piece for effective saturation transfer.

The centering ring is almost always made of a plastic material, effectively insulating the heavy aluminum reflector against drawing heat away from the mcpcb or substrate. Would be nice if this large piece of aluminum were to be optimally mated to the head and a copper centering ring used to allow effective contact for thermal expansion into the upper part of the head/reflector to aid the lower heat sink. My 2 cents.

So this thing may make sense after all. I always thought the cooling fins were in the wrong place. Maybe not.

JasonWW
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DB Custom wrote:
I’ve seen thermal imaging tests taken as a light was turned on and in the first seconds as the heat made it’s way through the heat sink. They said the pattern was almost exactly an inversion of the light coming out the front, so if you consider the light out the top as the top half of an X and the heat out from under the emitter as the bottom half of this X, you see where the heat needs to go for fast and immediate dispersal.



I have to disagree with you on this one, buddy. Heat does not flow directionally like in your picture. When the emitter heats up that copper MCPCB, the heat gets spread across it very evenly. Not perfectly, but decently. This is why larger diameter MCPCB’s do a better job at transferring heat.

Once that copper disc gets hot, the heat transfers into the aluminum below it and starts spreading out evenly like a drop of water on a sponge. Areas that are thick will take longer to heat up than thin areas. This means the thin areas will get hotter first.

Did you see a thermal image of a flashlight cut in half? I’m guessing it was a whole light. What you probably saw was the battery tube and other thin areas down low start to “heat soak” so to speak, while the thicker areas around the head was still soaking up the energy (heat).

The photo you show pretty much proves that. Thermal imaging shows actual temperatures. The fact that the temps were lower around the thick sections all around the emitter shows this design is doing it’s job and keeping things cooler.

Does that make sense?

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware (old), lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos for BLF Q8, GT, GT Mini and ROT66

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

Maukka Calibration Lights for DIY Lumen Measuring Devices

JasonWW
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RobertB wrote:
DB Custom wrote:
I’ve seen thermal imaging tests taken as a light was turned on and in the first seconds as the heat made it’s way through the heat sink. They said the pattern was almost exactly an inversion of the light coming out the front, so if you consider the light out the top as the top half of an X and the heat out from under the emitter as the bottom half of this X, you see where the heat needs to go for fast and immediate dispersal.

Having fins on the head, up by the reflector, is simply not efficient. Sure, eventually those fins will transfer some heat to the surrounding air, but the light has to get saturated first, allowing the emitter to sit in it’s own heat for far too long a period.

Deep fins in the expanding cone of thermal path would be most effective. And yes, if aesthetic fins on the head need to be figured in then the pill and head should ideally be one piece for effective saturation transfer.

The centering ring is almost always made of a plastic material, effectively insulating the heavy aluminum reflector against drawing heat away from the mcpcb or substrate. Would be nice if this large piece of aluminum were to be optimally mated to the head and a copper centering ring used to allow effective contact for thermal expansion into the upper part of the head/reflector to aid the lower heat sink. My 2 cents.

So this thing may make sense after all. I always thought the cooling fins were in the wrong place. Maybe not.



It’s important to understand that fins only add some extra surface area to the total surface area of the flashlight. The more surface area you have, the lower the max temperature the flashlight will get.

Mass is what slows down the flashlight from getting to that max temperature. Mass is what can make a 30 second max turbo time into a 90 second max turbo time.

There are lots of different combinations of surface area, mass, energy production and time so there’s no one universal design. Every flashlight needs to have the right balance based on its unique design and needs.

My Convoy L6 thread with XHP70.2, Texas Avenger FET driver, Narsil v1.2 ramping firmware (old), lighted side switch and cut down SMO reflector. Lots of amp draws on stock driver as well. 

My Supfire L5-S thread with XHP70, Texas Avenger FET driver, NarsilM v1.0 ramping firmware and lighted side switch. My mini L6! 

9 NarsilM user videos for BLF Q8, GT, GT Mini and ROT66

Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube

Maukka Calibration Lights for DIY Lumen Measuring Devices

Jinx
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Put me down for 1 please Smile

nbjly
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One please.

The Miller
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The Miller wrote:
Dang this topic dropped of the front pages fast, a shame so here you go with a bump Wink

Love the L6 anti roll cutouts smacked on a S70(S)/Jax Hunter head. You guys took the two popular XHP70 lights and used the one with the best cooling properties (good!)
For all the Convoy fans using a clear design feature of the L series, very smart.

I can’t recall what brand uses that diamond tube, something with pineapple in torch name
Clever clever!

Djeez, marking this post as rude? Facepalm

But thanks to input I now know the name of the light with the diamond knurled tube that popped into my head when I first sat the OP.
So cute..thanks Dale!

DB Custom wrote:
Some 4 or 5 years back, the Solarforce S2200 and S1100 had that large diamond knurling.

The Solarforce had the diamonds as squares, so not quite the same thing. The MecArmy PT16 is also similar…

At any rate, it’s a nice grip platform to be sure, especially on the larger diameter battery tube’s such as this.

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Interested, one light.

Yokiamy
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I like the design, i want it!
Remember that i have enough flashlights, i do not need another flashlight, i repeat, i do not need another flashlight
But i want it so badly Facepalm

Thijsco19 wrote:

a regular symptom of flasholism Big Smile

“Flasholism is the most severe form of flashlight use and involves the inability to manage your flashlight use habits. It is also commonly referred to as flashlight use disorder. Flashlight use disorder is organized into three categories: mild, moderate and severe. Each category has various symptoms and can cause harmful side effects. If left untreated, any type of flashlight use can spiral out of control.”

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Knurling reminds me to the Klarus Mi7 Ti Wink

The Miller wrote:

Have you tested the new XHP70.2?
XHP70 lights are plenty and from ~$37 a S70S could be bought not long ago. Solder blob is practically free so a modern LED could be a nice justification of the high price (well sure people have no problem with you guys earning money but still almost twice the S70S price is pretty steep) it would also show it is a new light, not something in the works for many many months.

Exactly what i was thinking!
It is a good looking flashlight, but as i am a real Dutch guy (raised as a zuinige Groninger), i think it is quite expensive, (especially when compared to the Q8)

What is so unique that it justifies the price?

Thijsco19 wrote:

a regular symptom of flasholism Big Smile

“Flasholism is the most severe form of flashlight use and involves the inability to manage your flashlight use habits. It is also commonly referred to as flashlight use disorder. Flashlight use disorder is organized into three categories: mild, moderate and severe. Each category has various symptoms and can cause harmful side effects. If left untreated, any type of flashlight use can spiral out of control.”

KawiBoy1428
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I want the battery tube and tail cap!!! Love I’ll make it fit my L2!! Wink

KB1428 “Live Life WOT”

Team KRONOS
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Interest light update to here.

Thanks, guys!

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hIKARInoob
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KawiBoy1428 wrote:
I want the battery tube and tail cap!!! Love I’ll make it fit my L2!! Wink

It’s like the Chuck Norris of battery tubes and tail caps.

atbglenn
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I’m interested in one

The constitution must stand, especially the first and second amendments. One other thing, I support ICE 100% 

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JasonWW wrote:
DB Custom wrote:
I’ve seen thermal imaging tests taken as a light was turned on and in the first seconds as the heat made it’s way through the heat sink. They said the pattern was almost exactly an inversion of the light coming out the front, so if you consider the light out the top as the top half of an X and the heat out from under the emitter as the bottom half of this X, you see where the heat needs to go for fast and immediate dispersal.



I have to disagree with you on this one, buddy. Heat does not flow directionally like in your picture. When the emitter heats up that copper MCPCB, the heat gets spread across it very evenly. Not perfectly, but decently. This is why larger diameter MCPCB’s do a better job at transferring heat.

Once that copper disc gets hot, the heat transfers into the aluminum below it and starts spreading out evenly like a drop of water on a sponge. Areas that are thick will take longer to heat up than thin areas. This means the thin areas will get hotter first.

Did you see a thermal image of a flashlight cut in half? I’m guessing it was a whole light. What you probably saw was the battery tube and other thin areas down low start to “heat soak” so to speak, while the thicker areas around the head was still soaking up the energy (heat).

The photo you show pretty much proves that. Thermal imaging shows actual temperatures. The fact that the temps were lower around the thick sections all around the emitter shows this design is doing it’s job and keeping things cooler.

Does that make sense?

While I don’t completely agree with either of you I support DB Custom’s point that the cooling fins aren’t in the best place. The way heat spreads out is comparable to how a liquid without gravity would flow (imagine the liquid has it’s source right under the LED). It goes into the direction of the smallest resistance. So the first few cooling fins are pretty deep and I am sure you would see a better thermal performance if they’d not be as deep. When designing the BLF GT we also did extensive thermal analysis and the results were pretty clear – having the fins distributed around the shelf yields a significantly better thermal performance compared to having them above the shelf (here we even disregarded any transitional resistances). See the following thermal analysis of a BLF GT design with fins around the shelf and fins above the shelf:

Edit: Also, the thicker the walls, the more evenly the heat gets distributed and more heat can flow away from the source. Again, think of the liquid, the thicker the walls the more space there is for the liquid to flow away.

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In for one

DB Custom
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The testing I saw some time back was a simulation, with a reflector on the mcpcb but a solid heat sink underneath. The heat flowed into the heat sink in a pattern almost identical to the output of the light up top. Given our light has a driver bay and thus there are re-directs, proper positioning of fins is critical.

I’ve been drawn to the Eagle Eye X6 for this very reason since it came out and I’ve made some pretty intense little monsters on the X6 as a host over the past few years.

It’s a delicate balance, heat sourced and heat removed, quite a dance really. Simple changes can throw off a nice design, or make it better, everything in it’s perspective of course.

Dale

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Team KRONOS wrote:
Interest light update to here.

Thanks, guys!


Really?
Questions asked not answered?
Come on this is your debut as commercial party!

EDIT below this:

Oh man,again with the rude? Well for this I can’t feel bad or se what is so rude about it, would have asked for engagement if a seller started a thread introducing a light, got questions and only reacte “thanks for interest” and not answered any questions, but the rude markings make it easy to find the post might t be needed later down the path.

Team KRONOS wrote:
In due time, Miller.

In the meantime, I am wondering if you diligently read our original post all the way through? Some of your comments and questions are already addressed there…

Cheers


Ah, good!
Questions are edited in, let me see what I could have missed from the OP in relation to the many questions:

1 question:

RobertB wrote:
I know you are comparing the to the S70, but what about the improved S70S? (aside from the tail switch)

yes partially answered, see remark about S70S below.
.
.
1 question:
Rusty Joe wrote:
Get rid of the 3-min step-down and I’m in.

the S70S has 5 minute stepdown, this was received very well, see remarks about S70S (which you sem to have missed to come out months ago)
The S70s with its longer stepdown period still preforms pretty nice in the heat department, it has been tested and spoken about on BLF a lot Wink
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1 question:
maukka wrote:
I’d like a dedomed XHP70.

.
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2 questions:
FlashPilot wrote:
But the thicker floor plate isnt going to help a whole lot in transferring heat through the head because its not the thermal bottleneck. What are the chances of making the head a solid 1 piece unit for a few dollars more, and keeping the aluminum walls thick to follow the contours of the reflector to better transfer heat through the head?
snip (red.)
As it is now, the light has the same thermal bottleneck as the S70 (and most others), which survives at 5 amps. Since you’re almost doubling the amps, I think you’d do much better in asking ThorFire if they can accommodate us. Every little bit is going to count at those power levels, and cells shouldn’t be used as heat sinks for such an awesome light that you’ve created!
Thoughts?

Nope not answered yet, also not in OP.
here the thicker integrated shelf is addresses, would probably not make much difference but adding no costs to the making for sure. More on this later when Dale and Fritz chime in.
.
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3 questions:
The Miller wrote:

Who made these nice renders by the way?

Can you show the driver?

Have you tested the new XHP70.2?
XHP70 lights are plenty and from ~$37 a S70S could be bought not long ago. Solder blob is practically free so a modern LED could be a nice justification of the high price


Nope not answered in OP (it almost seems like you guys missed the S70S coming out with the same heavy OP reflector you show, a moon mode in the driver, all it seems now you have asked Thorfire to do is a long click to reverse and bypass the sensing resistors and think this is all a huge improvement over the S70. Yes guys, the S70S driver with its moon and beacon side led was indeed an improvement but it already came out months ago Wink
.
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1 question, that modern XHP70.2 again:
Pok wrote:

..If it’s possible to use XHP70.2 final ?

.
.
3 questions:
DB Custom wrote:

Having fins on the head, up by the reflector, is simply not efficient. Sure, eventually those fins will transfer some heat to the surrounding air, but the light has to get saturated first, allowing the emitter to sit in it’s own heat for far too long a period.

Deep fins in the expanding cone of thermal path would be most effective. And yes, if aesthetic fins on the head need to be figured in then the pill and head should ideally be one piece for effective saturation transfer.

The centering ring is almost always made of a plastic material, effectively insulating the heavy aluminum reflector against drawing heat away from the mcpcb or substrate. Would be nice if this large piece of aluminum were to be optimally mated to the head and a copper centering ring used to allow effective contact for thermal expansion into the upper part of the head/reflector to aid the lower heat sink. My 2 cents.


1 fins around the and below the ledshelf?
2 head in one piece? (again this question)
3 use the reflector as part of heat management?
.
.
1 question:
ReManG wrote:
any chance on a ~4000K NW tint option?

Ah since you seemingly missed the launch of the S70S, let me bring you up to speed on another thing that has been going on on BLF in your absence, the friendly yet heated ( Smile ) debate about the S70/S70S and L6. A major advantage the L6 objectively has over the S70 and S70S is the choice in LEDs and tint. Since you seem to try to get design features of the L6 combined with the S70 and S70S you really can make an objective step forwards in tint/led options here.
.
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2 questions
JasonWW wrote:
Is the side switch built into the driver? If so, that will make it very hard to do a driver swap.
Also, what size is the driver?

.
.
1 question
Yokiamy wrote:

The Miller wrote:

Have you tested the new XHP70.2?
XHP70 lights are plenty and from ~$37 a S70S could be bought not long ago. Solder blob is practically free so a modern LED could be a nice justification of the high price (well sure people have no problem with you guys earning money but still almost twice the S70S price is pretty steep) it would also show it is a new light, not something in the works for many many months.

Exactly what i was thinking!
It is a good looking flashlight, but as i am a real Dutch guy (raised as a zuinige Groninger), i think it is quite expensive, (especially when compared to the Q8)
What is so unique that it justifies the price?

There, you see, even a simple “we will answer questions in due time” is better then not saying anything, for the questions will pop up again Wink better address them or say you will as you now did so people can know it is taken into account.
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1 question:
KawiBoy1428 wrote:
Really interested in this part….

The KRONOS K70 was designed in cooperation with ThorFire, and based on their beastly S70. Originally, we only planned to upgrade the internals/UI to fully realize the potential of this light. We soon came to the conclusion that a re-design of the host was also needed to overcome some design issues with the original S70. Therefore, the KRONOS K70 is not just a simple re-design, but a new light with plenty of oomph. Our goal is a walloping 8-9 amps!

Please check out the prototype/development pics. We will update with pictures and specifications after samples are received and tested:

Wondering if it had something to do with this part of the design?

Care to elaborate?


seemingly about the two part head (so another question about this)
But it was about or also about the shelf itself:
.
.
1 question:
KawiBoy1428 wrote:
2 pc. Head yep! Talking about the amount of material removed from the shelf, you only need 2 lead access holes and 2 hold down holes. If I was making a XHP70 Hot-Rod I’d want a full shelf, that’s just me. Unless I’m missing something in the rendition cut away?

Just wondering…….

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In due time, Miller.

In the meantime, I am wondering if you diligently read our original post all the way through? Some of your comments and questions are already addressed there…

Cheers

The official thread for all KRONOS projects.

PineyJustice
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I’ve got a couple 26650s sitting around doing nothing, why not

In.

Gerrh
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Put me down for two please: )

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S70, it’s already there Big Smile !

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I’m in for one. Thanks looks great !!

KawiBoy1428
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Really interested in this part….

The KRONOS K70 was designed in cooperation with ThorFire, and based on their beastly S70. Originally, we only planned to upgrade the internals/UI to fully realize the potential of this light. We soon came to the conclusion that a re-design of the host was also needed to overcome some design issues with the original S70. Therefore, the KRONOS K70 is not just a simple re-design, but a new light with plenty of oomph. Our goal is a walloping 8-9 amps!

Please check out the prototype/development pics. We will update with pictures and specifications after samples are received and tested:

Wondering if it had something to do with this part of the design?

Care to elaborate?

KB1428 “Live Life WOT”

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Look at the cutaway drawings Kawi, it’s still made that way…

Dale

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2 pc. Head yep! Talking about the amount of material removed from the shelf, you only need 2 lead access holes and 2 hold down holes. If I was making a XHP70 Hot-Rod I’d want a full shelf, that’s just me. Unless I’m missing something in the rendition cut away?

Just wondering…….

KB1428 “Live Life WOT”

D10ten
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Definitely in for one!

yasenf
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In for one, please.

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