Fireflies ROT66 Flashlight

974 posts / 0 new
Last post
toobadorz
toobadorz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 19 min ago
Joined: 01/10/2017 - 09:04
Posts: 146
SKV89 wrote:
toobadorz wrote:
I received my SST-20-W40H ROT66 a few days ago. Excellent and pleasant tint, but I think it is of 7×7135 because its output is pretty close to the 219B version when both driven by 100% 1×7135 + 100% Nx7135 (level 3 of mode-set 4).

Did you take lumen measurements compared with the 219B? How does the tint compare with 219B or any 5A/5D Cree tint flashlights? Maukka tested the SST-20-W 4000k 95CRI from Kaidomain to have some greenish tint.

About 5% more lumens if compared with the 219B.


I’m not answering the specific tint question because I don’t have a spectrophotometer to analyze the spectrum. I’m satisfied with it though.


However these two ROT66’s I newly received both have the bump problem. They got reset when hit at the tailcap or shaken more quickly. Adding an additional plastic disk between the battery carrier and the tailcap can fix this and increase 10%+ Turbo output (well, poor contact), however I don’t like such a poor idea, so I’m returning them to Fireflies and asking for replacements.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163
Tom Tom wrote:
Flashy Mike wrote:
This light is pretty sensitive to bumps! Give it a tap on the tail cap and its off. Its lacking a buffer cap, as I proposed for the Q8 a while ago: http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1193969#comment-1193969

OMG!

Have the hardware designers learned nothing ? It is not as if they haven’t been told, repeatedly, by me, and Flashy Mike. And the fix is so easy.

This really is inexcusable.

I could rant on, but they just don’t listen. They just regurgitate the same old sad designs, no innovation, no progress.

I despair.

Just an FYI Mike, it seems Sofirn have listened and their new version of the Q8 does include a chunky buffer capacitor. There is some information about this on Djozz’s Sofirn Q8 thread.

e.g. http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1380946#comment-1380946

Quite why this is so difficult to comprehend, and seems to be so resisted, by other designers, is a mystery to me. Just as selecting decent springs or simply making the battery compartment fit properly seems to be a lost art.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163

Puzzled why this thing needs a cell/battery carrier which just adds a load of complexity and potential problems for a basic parallel cell arrangement.

Many more contact surfaces in the current path, and bits to go wrong, in design, manufacture/assembly, and in service. Added cost, mass and volume too.

And complication when changing cells.

Edit: Trying to tug them out, perhaps with some fabric ribbons to help, if you remembered to tuck them behind when loading, or bash them out, or insert fingernails, penknife etc and damage the wrapper. Whilst tugging the springs sideways and further compromising their weak performance. If a plastic spacer put at the button end to prevent reverse polarity, even more difficult.

Edit2: If suffering poor performance and suspecting excessive resistance in the current path, well, there are so many places to suspect, look at, and try to fettle, good luck trying. Unless it’s just a hobby to muck about with.

Instead of faffing about with a carrier, just unscrew, drop out old cells, drop in new. run a finger around the top to check they are all the correct way up. Close.

The simple SRK/Q8 etc. arrangement is tried and tested. It also suffers bump disconnection because the contact ring in the head is solid, not spring loaded. But that is easily avoided with suitable circuit design.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
toobadorz wrote:
However these two ROT66’s I newly received both have the bump problem. … Adding an additional plastic disk between the battery carrier and the tailcap can fix this and increase 10%+ Turbo output

Out of curiosity, what happens if you do this?

  1. Loosen the battery tube at least a full turn or two.
  2. Tighten the tailcap as far as it’ll go.
  3. Tighten the battery tube.

And if that doesn’t work, flip the battery tube around. I think it looks better backward anyway.

On mine, the parts can actually tighten more than necessary. When I tighten the tailcap first, then the tube, the only thing which stops it from turning farther is that the battery carrier is pressed firmly against the driver’s retaining ring. It’s so tight that the spring doesn’t even matter; there is no room to move either way.

Anyway, if it just needs a bit more thickness inside the tailcap, perhaps a printed copy of the UI cheatsheet would make a good spacer? Or perhaps a 3D puffy bubble sticker of a firefly.

contactcr
Offline
Last seen: 51 min 10 sec ago
Joined: 05/19/2017 - 18:52
Posts: 2926
Location: US

Firefly puffy sticker you say?

Will stock them at my flashlight modding store..

SKV89
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 25 min ago
Joined: 12/10/2017 - 12:46
Posts: 3679
Location: US
djozz wrote:
SKV89 wrote:
djozz wrote:
Fireflies is a new company but with some (they mentioned to me) experienced guys who worked for other flashlight companies before (they will not:say which). Before releasing their first flashlight they contacted several people on BLF for advice (they asked me about leds), which is a clever move, but they also have a good nose themselves for what are wanted features and are especially keen on high CRI.

Since they asked you about the LEDs, do you have any idea what tint bin SST-20 4000k they are using? Is it the same FB4 from Kaidomain? But if that’s the case, it would be green and not below the BBL as shown in their test report.


It was some time ago, when the SST-20 W was not not available and tested yet. I suggested the high CRI LH351D or LH351C, they checked the D but finally went for the N.219Bsw45r9080 because they did not like the LH351D. But I had no recent contact.

I just got a reply from Jacky regarding the tint bin:
It is SST-20-W40H-A120-J4402(J4-VH-FA3 . The color is yellow , not great

Given this one is FA3 tint, it should be between 4000k-4250k and a good chance of being below the BBL. The one being sold at Kaidomain, which Maukka tested is FB4 tint, which is completely above the BBL and looks at least as good as the 219C according to Maukka; so I wonder why Jacky thinks it looks “not great”.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3

SKV89 wrote:
I just got a reply from Jacky regarding the tint bin:
It is SST-20-W40H-A120-J4402(J4-VH-FA3 . The color is yellow , not great

Given this one is FA3 tint, it should be between 4000k-4250k and a good chance of being below the BBL. … I wonder why Jacky thinks it looks “not great”.

He described it as yellow, not green or orange. So he probably thinks the CCT is “not great”, not the tint. 4000K looks pretty yellow compared to the 219B model.

Here are three 219B lights at 92CRI… 5000K, 4700K, and 4000K. With one’s eye accustomed to 5000K lighting, 4000K looks pretty yellow:

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163
ToyKeeper][quote=toobadorz wrote:
However these two ROT66’s I newly received both have the bump problem. … Adding an additional plastic disk between the battery carrier and the tailcap can fix this and increase 10%+ Turbo output

Out of curiosity, what happens if you do this?

  1. Loosen the battery tube at least a full turn or two.
  2. Tighten the tailcap as far as it’ll go.
  3. Tighten the battery tube./quote]

Not addressing the root cause, which has been discussed for a long long time and fixed long ago. But ignored by the usual suspects.

It’s not even something that you can fix in firmware.

Not surprised DEL has been offline for ages, it is getting rather boring around here as far as
hardware development is concerned . I.e. zilch.

There are only so many ways to connect e.g. some 7135s and a FET, with an MCU. Perhaps with some flashy extra lighting in the head, rather than the tail.

Led4Power being the honourable exception, please support him.

But still, useful advice for those suffering. It might help. This is the difficulty with “direct drive” i.e. just crowbarring a FET between the cell and the LED, with all the losses in between. Then let your cell transfer characteristic, state of charge, LED transfer characteristic, metalwork rubbishness, switch resistance, driver FET choice and adequacy of wiring and MCPCB thermal path, optical wonderfulness, and on, and on, deliver an outcome, for, maybe, 30 seconds or a minute, whilst you measure it, ready for the big reveal.

Personally I prefer more practical things that run for many hours at useful light levels efficiently, at sensible cost.

The more elegant the better. Style, ergonomics, materials and UI are important.

But maybe I’m in the wrong forum..

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
Tom Tom wrote:
I could rant on, but … maybe I’m in the wrong forum.

You may be onto something here.

The general culture on BLF is less about ranting from the sidelines, and more about diving in to fix things ourselves. If you want something, build it.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163
ToyKeeper wrote:
Tom Tom wrote:
I could rant on, but … maybe I’m in the wrong forum.

You may be onto something here.

The general culture on BLF is less about ranting from the sidelines, and more about diving in to fix things ourselves. If you want something, build it.

That’s the problem, with the hardware. Very few have the skills, interest, determination, fabrication and test equipment, to bother with these, frankly not very interesting if you have a day job, things. Never mind give the designs away for free.

So it is just going to continue to be dreary derivative AMC+FET designs I think. With increasingly esoteric firmware options that few will ever use.

With maybe some flashy subsidiary lights.

I’d like to be wrong about this, but perhaps it is time to focus BLF techies energy on a new decent useful driver.

Comfychair had his day, but that was a long time ago, and it seems we are still living with it.

Buck or boost, or buck-boost, efficient, straightforward modes, minimal component count, open for firmware development with e.g. pogo-pin pads, perhaps even accessible for DIY assembly with crude tools.

Except I think that ship has sailed and, once you take a look at the good commercial suppliers, you might decide that they usually have an edge over BLF torches.

Summary:

BLF still has a place if it can rejuvenate hardware development, and open up and interest firmware development again to more than just one contributor.

Contribution from LED assessors (e.g. Maukka, Djozz) is key. Nevermind the hardware, the LED performance is absolutely the most important thing, as it progresses.

Assessment of cells is important, however it really is not so important if the torch has a good circuit design with a driver that doesn’t just rely on shorting the cells across the LED for max output. E.g. a properly considered linear or buck driver could deliver far better performance, overall,and maybe HKG’s curves would show better use.

shirnask
shirnask's picture
Online
Last seen: 7 min 57 sec ago
Joined: 03/21/2016 - 23:58
Posts: 1178
Location: Louisiana
Tom Tom wrote:
ToyKeeper wrote:
Tom Tom wrote:
I could rant on, but … maybe I’m in the wrong forum.

You may be onto something here.

The general culture on BLF is less about ranting from the sidelines, and more about diving in to fix things ourselves. If you want something, build it.

That’s the problem, with the hardware. Very few have the skills, interest, determination, fabrication and test equipment, to bother with these, frankly not very interesting if you have a day job, things. Never mind give the designs away for free.

So it is just going to continue to be dreary derivative AMC+FET designs I think. With increasingly esoteric firmware options that few will ever use.

With maybe some flashy subsidiary lights.

I’d like to be wrong about this, but perhaps it is time to focus BLF techies energy on a new decent useful driver.

Comfychair and Del had their day, but that was a long time ago, and it seems we are still living with it.

Buck or boost, or buck-boost, efficient, straightforward modes, minimal component count, open for firmware development with e.g. pogo-pin pads, perhaps even accessible for DIY assembly with crude tools.

Except I think that ship has sailed and, once you take a look at the good commercial suppliers, you might decide that they usually have an edge over BLF torches.

Summary:

BLF still has a place if it can rejuvenate hardware development, and open up and interest firmware development again to more than just one contributor.

Contribution from LED assessors (e.g. Maukka, Djozz) is key. Nevermind the hardware, the LED performance is absolutely the most important thing, as it progresses.

Assessment of cells is important, however it really is not so important if the torch has a good circuit design with a driver that doesn’t just rely on shorting the cells across the LED for max output. E.g. a properly considered linear or buck driver could deliver far better performance, overall,and maybe HKG’s curves would show better use.

This is the Fireflies ROT66 thread – not to minimize your observations of the BLF culture – but perhaps they belong in their own thread Wink

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163

shirnask wrote:

This is the Fireflies ROT66 thread – not to minimize your observations of the BLF culture – but perhaps they belong in their own thread Wink

Agreed, just poking and prodding to try to stimulate some forward-thinking discussion. On this thread because Fireflies appear to be interested in doing things differently and better, and this is just their first one. And they might be monitoring.

There is another one from them on way, and I have posted similarly acerbic comments on that thread, in the hopes that it might stimulate some useful debate, and thoughts.

PS: when I said DEL, I meant Wight. Doh. Sorry.

jimmy yang
jimmy yang's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 months 1 day ago
Joined: 12/01/2017 - 01:15
Posts: 68

FireFlies wrote:
ROT66 Aux led board available now

!http://www.ff-light.com/image/data/20180827224708.jpg!

I also received it yesterday. ROT66 Aux led board .

Can Aux led turn off or choose brightness?
.

I like the SST20 4000K CRI95 of ROT66, this is my first SST20.

What is the difference in color temperature between the SST20 4000K CRI95 and the 219B SW45 R9080? Is it worth buying 219B again? (if ROT66 219B
Compared with D4S 219B?)
.
.
.
.
PS..
Understand that the lantern can not be turned off, only the tail cover can be turned off. Perhaps the new version can, but it seems to only open and close. Facepalm

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
Tom Tom wrote:
There is another one from them on way, and I have posted similarly acerbic comments on that thread, in the hopes that it might stimulate some useful debate, …

The thing is, acerbic comments are rarely productive. They’re more likely to backfire than to accomplish anything, hence the responses being “calm down” instead of “heck yeah”. Intentionally posting acerbic comments to stimulate debate is awfully similar to the definition of trolling, and is unlikely to have a positive result.

If you truly want to create positive change, it takes more than just complaining. Look for feasible pathways from what you have to what you want, then pick one and start a journey.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3

jimmy yang wrote:
ROT66 Aux led board .

Can Aux led turn off or choose brightness?

Compared with SST20 4000K CRI95 and 219B SW45 R9080, will the color temperature be much worse?

I don’t think the ROT66 aux LED board can be dimmed or turned off by firmware, because there are no more pins on the MCU to attach anything to. I will probably be able to test it soon though.

About the color temperature, it is a very personal preference so only you can answer that question. Some people love 4000K, some people hate it.

JasonWW
JasonWW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 hours 59 min ago
Joined: 10/22/2016 - 11:41
Posts: 12383
Location: Houston Texas

jimmy yang wrote:
FireFlies wrote:
ROT66 Aux led board available now


I also received it yesterday. ROT66 Aux led board .

Can Aux led turn off or choose brightness?


Do you have a picture of it? If it has the trimmers on the board then you can adjust the brightness with a screwdriver.

There’s only one option of controlling on and off through the firmware and that is to wire it in parallel with the switch lights.

The alternative is to wire it to stay on continuously.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube and JoshK Sphere calibrated with Maukka lights

Click this to go to signature links. I'm still around, just not reading many new threads.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
 ROT66 MCU pin layout
           ----
   Reset -|1  8|- VCC
 eswitch -|2  7|- switch LEDs
     FET -|3  6|- Nx7135
     GND -|4  5|- 1x7135
           ----

As JasonWW said, the aux LED board could be connected to pin 7, to make it mirror the behavior of the switch LEDs. Otherwise, it’ll just be on all the time, which I think is probably the case. It has its own controller and everything, so it’ll change colors based on voltage.

I’m very curious to find out how much power it uses. I heard 50uA for the aux LED board’s LDO and controller, but I haven’t seen measurements of the total standby power.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163

ToyKeeper wrote:

The thing is, acerbic comments are rarely productive.

Touché. I’ll back off for now.

toobadorz
toobadorz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 19 min ago
Joined: 01/10/2017 - 09:04
Posts: 146

ToyKeeper wrote:

Out of curiosity, what happens if you do this?
  1. Loosen the battery tube at least a full turn or two.
  2. Tighten the tailcap as far as it’ll go.
  3. Tighten the battery tube.

And if that doesn’t work, flip the battery tube around. I think it looks better backward anyway.

On mine, the parts can actually tighten more than necessary. When I tighten the tailcap first, then the tube, the only thing which stops it from turning farther is that the battery carrier is pressed firmly against the driver’s retaining ring. It’s so tight that the spring doesn’t even matter; there is no room to move either way.

Anyway, if it just needs a bit more thickness inside the tailcap, perhaps a printed copy of the UI cheatsheet would make a good spacer? Or perhaps a 3D puffy bubble sticker of a firefly.

Thanks, but unfortunately, these loosening / tightening steps didn’t work. Stretching the spring a little bit and adding a sticker did help though. Well I dislike the battery carrier design…

twisted raven
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 1 day ago
Joined: 03/13/2016 - 11:10
Posts: 497
Location: texas

Got my ROT66 with Samsung LH351Ds + Lee Zircon 804 filter from Vinh:

The hotspot is massive in comparison to the Nichia version of the ROT66. CCT seems similar to my H600FC MK4, but slightly more rosy/less green. I probably wouldn’t like LH351D without the filter.



SKV89
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 25 min ago
Joined: 12/10/2017 - 12:46
Posts: 3679
Location: US

Nice comparisons. The LH351D with filter looks great. Did you take lumen measurements? I read the filter reduces output by about 20%. Also how do you know it is 98CRI?

twisted raven
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 1 day ago
Joined: 03/13/2016 - 11:10
Posts: 497
Location: texas

The 804 reduces output by about 15%. The overall output of the Samsungs with filter compared to the Nichias on max is indistinguishable to the eye.

I’m going off of Maukka’s measurements of the 4000k 90cri Samsung emitters + the 804 filter. Granted, different optics can produce slightly different results, but it should be similar.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163

ToyKeeper wrote:
 ROT66 MCU pin layout
           ----
   Reset -|1  8|- VCC
 eswitch -|2  7|- switch LEDs
     FET -|3  6|- Nx7135
     GND -|4  5|- 1x7135
           ----

As JasonWW said, the aux LED board could be connected to pin 7, to make it mirror the behavior of the switch LEDs. Otherwise, it’ll just be on all the time, which I think is probably the case. It has its own controller and everything, so it’ll change colors based on voltage.

I’m very curious to find out how much power it uses. I heard 50uA for the aux LED board’s LDO and controller, but I haven’t seen measurements of the total standby power.

Likewise. It can’t be much different from e.g. the old lighted tailcap implementations. I.e. cell current lights up the aux. LEDs, albeit through an LDO regulator, but that makes no difference really to current consumption compared with the simple bypass resistor on the earlier designs, except the output is stabilised, so current should not vary much as the cell discharges.

If they can change colour based on cell voltage, that would be nice, but I’m not sure that is what is being offered here.

At the end of the day, keeping some aux. LEDs glowing takes a small continuous amount of power. Perhaps not a problem with a x3 18650 torch, depending on brightness, but certainly for smaller ones. The BLF X5 is such an example, although only having one LED in the tailcap the 14500 cell capacity is insufficient to keep the tailcap glowing for useful periods, hence disconnected on mine.

Just lighting up the switch, as on the Q8, takes minimal current, given the x4 18650 capacity, and is a useful feature.

It is a neat and clever design, for those who want it.

I have a few torches that have a switch LED which indicates cell state of charge, e.g. blue or red, when the torch is switched on. Or can be left on permanently. One even blinks red when off, to warn of low cell voltage. I find this useful. (Nitecore designs)

In other words, I like these as indicators of cell voltage, or as a way of locating the torch in darkness. Putting them in the head, rather than the tail, is an improvement I think, and perhaps the best way in e-switch designs, although just lighting up the switch in two different colours is good enough for me, and should take far less current.

Not enough pins on the chosen MCU though I think.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
Tom Tom wrote:
ToyKeeper wrote:
I heard 50uA for the aux LED board’s LDO and controller,

If they can change colour based on cell voltage, that would be nice, but I’m not sure that is what is being offered here.

It has already been revealed that the aux LEDs change color to indicate low voltage. It has its own controller to manage the aux LEDs.

Tom Tom wrote:
keeping some aux. LEDs glowing takes a small continuous amount of power. Perhaps not a problem with a x3 18650 torch, depending on brightness, but certainly for smaller ones. The BLF X5 is such an example…

The X6v2 / X5 used an average of about 450 uA to keep the tailcap lit, so a 650 mAh cell would last about 60 days. It was annoyingly short.

Newer designs use less power. The Q8 uses anywhere from 30 uA to 130 uA to keep the button lit, so 4×3000 mAh cells should last anywhere from 10 to 45 years. If the X5 had the same design as the Q8, its 650 mAh cell would from last 7 months to 2.5 years per charge.

If I understand correctly, the PL47 aux LED board has a pot to trim the brightness to the user’s desired level. With it turned up relatively high, like 200 uA (plus 50 uA overhead), it would probably run over 2 years per charge. Or, at a lower level, perhaps over 5 years. But I haven’t measured it yet, so that is only speculation. In any case, rough estimates indicate it should last a useful amount of time.

JasonWW
JasonWW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 hours 59 min ago
Joined: 10/22/2016 - 11:41
Posts: 12383
Location: Houston Texas

If we go back to post 274, I believe Lexel means that the ROT66 board will shut down all its leds as part of the lvp. Before that, the inner 4 leds (of red color) will either turn on or blink to indicate low voltage. All 3 rings of leds have trimmers so you can control the drain.

Lexel wrote:
As I do not have a ROT66 myself I can only post that I have first Aux board in my GEN3 tail setup finished and limited supply of LEDs and PCBs to make more as it was just first prototype of theese board design

basically the same as usual each LED has its own balance resistor so any combinations are possible

here just 2 rings in same color (ice blue and pink) that are dimable independantly with two trimmers,
the central 4 LEDs show low battery warning, the threshold voltage can be set as you wish with a resistor value swap
red for low battery has also its own brightness adjust trimmer, also any other color combination possible if you dont want red for low battery indication

right next to it my new D4S board also in Generation 3 here no circular pattern the trimmers are making a cross around the 4 LEDs

LVP shuts down all LEDs at the 2. (2nd?) threshold level, tested down to 3V, below that the LDO falls out of regulation and it stays off until battery gets high enough above the hysteresis

Fireflies should have its own first prototypes tested right now but will very likely only bring only a blue and red for low battery variant with next batch

Texas Ace Lumen Tube and JoshK Sphere calibrated with Maukka lights

Click this to go to signature links. I'm still around, just not reading many new threads.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163
ToyKeeper wrote:
It has already been revealed that the aux LEDs change color to indicate low voltage. It has its own controller to manage the aux LEDs.

Aah, a separate controller purely to sense battery voltage. That is certainly one way to do it.

ToyKeeper wrote:
The X6v2 / X5 used an average of about 450 uA to keep the tailcap lit, so a 650 mAh cell would last about 60 days. It was annoyingly short.

Newer designs use less power. The Q8 uses anywhere from 30 uA to 130 uA to keep the button lit, so 4×3000 mAh cells should last anywhere from 10 to 45 years. If the X5 had the same design as the Q8, its 650 mAh cell would from last 7 months to 2.5 years per charge.

The tail LED introduced on the X5/X6 shouldn’t have needed much current (though it was set excessively bright), there must have been some additional parasitic drain due to semi-powering the driver, perhaps through the voltage divider chain (before we increased the component values and then eliminated it altogether with clever firmware).

The bypass resistor was also a heavy parasitic drain when operating at moonlight/firefly levels, consuming much more power than the main LED. I never liked it.

The Q8 was done very well I think, after the hiccup with the first faulty switch PCBs, quickly corrected.

ToyKeeper wrote:
If I understand correctly, the PL47 aux LED board has a pot to trim the brightness to the user’s desired level. With it turned up relatively high, like 200 uA (plus 50 uA overhead), it would probably run over 2 years per charge. Or, at a lower level, perhaps over 5 years. But I haven’t measured it yet, so that is only speculation. In any case, rough estimates indicate it should last a useful amount of time.

Fingers crossed. I guess it will be down to how well the MCU firmware manages power, and how it senses the voltage (slightly worried about mention of an external resistor change to set the level, suggesting a voltage divider might have returned). The 50 uA base figure suggests it is good, if all that remains is the aux. LED current, user selected with the trimpots.

Turning off completely (?) at 3V is safe

It is ingenious.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
Tom Tom wrote:
Aah, a separate controller purely to sense battery voltage. That is certainly one way to do it.

A while back, I made firmware for a similar aux LED board in the tailcap… but as far as I’m aware, no one has ever actually built or tested the hardware. The design there was a little different though, with six LEDs going RGBRGB in a circle. The idea was that, every time the user clicked the button to turn the main light off, the tailcap would boot up, spin the LEDs for a couple seconds like a roulette board while it measured voltage, then slow to a stop at a color matching the current voltage. Red, yellow, green, cyan, blue, or purple. Afterward, it’d blink that color like a beacon every few seconds, measuring voltage periodically to update the color.

The roulette bit also served to help the user time the duration of their button presses, to more consistently get short or long presses as desired, or short/medium/long.

Blingy, I’ll admit… but also useful. Would still like to have one.

Tom Tom
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 1 week ago
Joined: 09/10/2017 - 08:30
Posts: 1163
ToyKeeper wrote:
Tom Tom wrote:
Aah, a separate controller purely to sense battery voltage. That is certainly one way to do it.

A while back, I made firmware for a similar aux LED board in the tailcap… but as far as I’m aware, no one has ever actually built or tested the hardware. The design there was a little different though, with six LEDs going RGBRGB in a circle. The idea was that, every time the user clicked the button to turn the main light off, the tailcap would boot up, spin the LEDs for a couple seconds like a roulette board while it measured voltage, then slow to a stop at a color matching the current voltage. Red, yellow, green, cyan, blue, or purple. Afterward, it’d blink that color like a beacon every few seconds, measuring voltage periodically to update the color.

The roulette bit also served to help the user time the duration of their button presses, to more consistently get short or long presses as desired, or short/medium/long.

Blingy, I’ll admit… but also useful. Would still like to have one.

Now that would justify putting an MCU on the board. I’d certainly buy that.

Puzzled about the name, ROT66. Where did that come from ? I keep thinking ROT13 and wondering whether there is some hidden message …

Edit: and rot is not a good word in English. In other languages, this differs.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 16 min ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10240
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3

I have no idea where the name “ROT66” came from. I also have no idea where the name “PL47” came from, but it kinda makes sense… 4 emitters, 7 cm battery, and it’s shaped kinda like the letter P or L.

chinooker
chinooker's picture
Offline
Last seen: 28 min 20 sec ago
Joined: 12/16/2015 - 13:27
Posts: 1871
Location: mid left coast

ssttrrettcchhhh :ARROW-RIGHT:

Pages