TLF/BLF/Lumintop FW3A review (18650, 3x XP-L HI cool white)

251 posts / 0 new
Last post
JasonWW
JasonWW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 38 min ago
Joined: 10/22/2016 - 11:41
Posts: 11868
Location: Houston Texas

I think the only thing missing is the timing. The battery tube length was finilized a long time ago. Maybe over a year ago.

Maybe you can ask ToyKeeper about it in the main FW3A thread. There might be reasons that I don’t know about.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

Click this to go to signature links.

teacher
teacher's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 02/23/2016 - 19:04
Posts: 9596
Location: NE & SW Alabama

JasonWW wrote:
I think the only thing missing is the timing. The battery tube length was finilized a long time ago. Maybe over a year ago.
The below concerning battery type & length is from the OP (post #1) of the main thread, FW3A, a TLF/BLF EDC flashlight .
  • Runs on a single 18650 battery.
  • 92.5 × 25.5 mm: Unusually small for an 18650 light — about the size of a SK-68 (1xAA).
  • Battery size: 18mm x 65mm (66mm maximum). Protected cells won’t fit.

So maybe another thing missing is that it appears there is no need to change anything concerning “tube(s) length”. It was stated long ago that the ‘maxium battery length’ was 66 mm. And that ‘protected cells’ would not fit.

Simple as that, it appears to me.

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

      Xlamp size chart _ BatteryU _ Flashaholic? Need Professional Help???            TheOriginal _ TAB _ LightSearch _ BatterySearch _ 14500's _ DiCal 

 

                                             

djozz
djozz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 44 min 16 sec ago
Joined: 09/07/2012 - 17:04
Posts: 16107
Location: Amsterdam

funkychateau wrote:
So increasing both tubes (if necessary) by a small but equal amount, and slightly lengthening the springs, should not hurt the functionality. Am I missing something?

You are missing that a few mm extra length does hurt the functionality, for me it does. EDC’s that use a 18650 battery are almost always too large for pocket carry and this may be the first one that will make it into my pocket, only just, and 3mm extra length will matter a lot.

Most of the safety provided by protected batteries is double-up, accounted for by the driver in nowadays flashlights (reverse polarity protection, low voltage protection), only a battery short can happen if something goes wrong, a large impact may cause that. If a quality brand battery is used, that will be accounted for by the build-in (one-time) fuse inside the battery.

Agro
Agro's picture
Online
Last seen: 8 sec ago
Joined: 05/14/2017 - 11:16
Posts: 4963
Location: Ślōnsk

djozz wrote:
funkychateau wrote:
So increasing both tubes (if necessary) by a small but equal amount, and slightly lengthening the springs, should not hurt the functionality. Am I missing something?

You are missing that a few mm extra length does hurt the functionality, for me it does. EDC’s that use a 18650 battery are almost always too large for pocket carry and this may be the first one that will make it into my pocket, only just, and 3mm extra length will matter a lot.

That’s why I love DQG style tail.
I can put 18700 cell-powerbank in a Tiny and make it much better for some trips. Or put 18650 and it gets 5 mm shorter.
That would be harder to pull off with FW3A double tube though.
JasonWW
JasonWW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 38 min ago
Joined: 10/22/2016 - 11:41
Posts: 11868
Location: Houston Texas

djozz wrote:
funkychateau wrote:
So increasing both tubes (if necessary) by a small but equal amount, and slightly lengthening the springs, should not hurt the functionality. Am I missing something?

You are missing that a few mm extra length does hurt the functionality, for me it does. EDC’s that use a 18650 battery are almost always too large for pocket carry and this may be the first one that will make it into my pocket, only just, and 3mm extra length will matter a lot.

Most of the safety provided by protected batteries is double-up, accounted for by the driver in nowadays flashlights (reverse polarity protection, low voltage protection), only a battery short can happen if something goes wrong, a large impact may cause that. If a quality brand battery is used, that will be accounted for by the build-in (one-time) fuse inside the battery.


I think he’s asking about adding 0.5mm-1mm to both tubes length so that more/most button top cells will fit. I can’t really remember if there was a specific reason against this. Fritz or ToyKeeper might know this.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

Click this to go to signature links.

Scallywag
Scallywag's picture
Offline
Last seen: 4 hours 35 min ago
Joined: 01/11/2018 - 22:23
Posts: 738
Location: Ohio, United States

TK's response:

ToyKeeper wrote:
JasonWW wrote:
TK, since no one from Maukka's review has asked here yet, can you tell us why the two battery tubes in the FW3A can not be equally lengthened 0.5mm to 1mm so as to make it fit both flat top and button top batteries?
It's mostly just too late, and would risk making shorter batteries lose contact when bumped. Also, I think Lumintop may have only a compiled version of the 3D model, without any way to modify it. They might need the original from Fritz instead of an exported / compiled version. I'm not sure about the details though.

EDC Rotation: ZL SC62 | Jaxman E2L XP-G2 5A | Purple S2+ XPL-HI U6-3A | D4 w/ Luxeon V | RRT-01 
EagTac D25C Ti | DQG Slim AA Ti | UF-T1 by CRX | Olight S1 | Klarus Mini One Ti
L6 XHP70.2 P2 4000K FET+7135 | Jaxman M8 | MF02 | Jaxman Z1 CULNM1.TG | Blue S2+ w/ ML Special
In-progress: Supfire M6 3xXHP50.2 
Others: Nitecore EC23 | Nebo Twyst | Streamlight ProTac 1AA | TerraLux LightStar 100

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 43 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10090
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
Scallywag wrote:
TK’s response:

Well, that… and the only reason proto4 had any battery length issues was because of the driver being in the wrong place. Button tops shouldn’t be an issue on the real thing, if Lumintop can fix the other issue.

Driver 2
Driver 2's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 6 hours ago
Joined: 02/26/2019 - 22:37
Posts: 2

1 please. XPL HI.

We are what we repeatedly do. Therefore, excellence is not an act, but a habit.

JasonWW
JasonWW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 38 min ago
Joined: 10/22/2016 - 11:41
Posts: 11868
Location: Houston Texas

This is a review only.

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

Click this to go to signature links.

He’sdeadJim
He’sdeadJim's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 1 week ago
Joined: 03/02/2019 - 16:37
Posts: 6

For the love of all things bright and shiny, please put me on the list for this little gem.

“You need the dark in order to show the light.” Bob Ross

shirnask
shirnask's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 50 min ago
Joined: 03/21/2016 - 23:58
Posts: 1071
Location: Louisiana
He’sdeadJim wrote:
For the love of all things bright and shiny, please put me on the list for this little gem.

Express your interest in this thread

dealgrabber2002
Offline
Last seen: 7 hours 35 min ago
Joined: 06/20/2014 - 23:51
Posts: 640
Location: California

Does it make a click when you press the tailcap?

joechina
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 8 hours ago
Joined: 03/05/2016 - 08:23
Posts: 1435
Location: Germany
dealgrabber2002 wrote:
Does it make a click when you press the tailcap?

Yes, but half as loud as a normal clicky

Just out of curiousity I tested all ten different lights within reach: Not one is silent, all make a click sound.

maukka
maukka's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 hour 49 min ago
Joined: 12/31/2015 - 04:15
Posts: 2005
Location: Finland

I’d say it’s a bit quieter than a S2+ mechanical switch. Depends on how you hold the light and how evenly you press the switch. I like however, that no matter where you press it, it always activates. Pressing it at the very edge with a tip of a finger makes it quite silent.

Geuzzz
Geuzzz's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 week 1 day ago
Joined: 10/25/2015 - 10:27
Posts: 1114
Location: Netherlands
joechina wrote:
dealgrabber2002 wrote:
Does it make a click when you press the tailcap?

Yes, but half as loud as a normal clicky

Just out of curiousity I tested all ten different lights within reach: Not one is silent, all make a click sound.

For real silent you need a rrt01. Although my s mini is quite silent also.

abhinit90
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 1 week ago
Joined: 05/07/2017 - 10:31
Posts: 126

That’s a pretty nice review. I guess a lot has changed since this light was conceptualised.

How does it compare with the D4 (since it’s more it’s size)?

joechina
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 8 hours ago
Joined: 03/05/2016 - 08:23
Posts: 1435
Location: Germany
Geuzzz wrote:
joechina wrote:
dealgrabber2002 wrote:
Does it make a click when you press the tailcap?

Yes, but half as loud as a normal clicky

Just out of curiousity I tested all ten different lights within reach: Not one is silent, all make a click sound.

For real silent you need a rrt01. Although my s mini is quite silent also.

I have an Olight S1 mini Baton:
- Normal pressed the FW3A is louder
- Pressed on the side the FW3A is quieter.

hatman
Offline
Last seen: 2 weeks 6 days ago
Joined: 11/25/2012 - 16:07
Posts: 128
Location: Midwest

One, please, XPLHI.

Firelight2
Firelight2's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 04/08/2011 - 15:17
Posts: 3727
Location: California

Does the FW3A use a coated glass lens?

And what is the diameter of the lens?

Karl M Atwood
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 3 days ago
Joined: 03/28/2019 - 15:23
Posts: 10
Location: Earth

Very nice review. Thank you for the information and feedback.

“Give me liberty, or give me death!” / Patrick Henry

funkychateau
funkychateau's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 weeks ago
Joined: 07/01/2018 - 02:05
Posts: 105
Location: Dallas, Texas

djozz wrote:
funkychateau wrote:
So increasing both tubes (if necessary) by a small but equal amount, and slightly lengthening the springs, should not hurt the functionality. Am I missing something?

You are missing that a few mm extra length does hurt the functionality, for me it does. EDC’s that use a 18650 battery are almost always too large for pocket carry and this may be the first one that will make it into my pocket, only just, and 3mm extra length will matter a lot.

Most of the safety provided by protected batteries is double-up, accounted for by the driver in nowadays flashlights (reverse polarity protection, low voltage protection), only a battery short can happen if something goes wrong, a large impact may cause that. If a quality brand battery is used, that will be accounted for by the build-in (one-time) fuse inside the battery.

I don’t think anyone is interested in using protected cells. What I am pointing out is the desirability of accomodating unprotected button-top cells, and that’s not going to add a few mm. 66 mm is just borderline, and it shouldn’t be that way.

For example, I’ve bought four 18650 Emisar lights and a Q8. Button-top high-drain unprotected cells were recommended for these lights, so I ordered them simultaneously. I also took advantage of a sale or two to get spares, and now I have accumulated quite a collection. And they also work in EVERY other one of my (too-vast) collection of 18650 flashlights and headlamps. Until now.

It doesn’t make much sense that the FW3A designers, to save maybe 1% in overall length, would deliberately abandon the versatility of using BOTH standard configurations of unprotected cells. It seems this was just a terrible oversight that, despite some discussion, has literally fallen through the cracks.

As it is, until I purchase special cells to accommodate this ONE light, the only thing I have on hand that will fit may be laptop pulls.

funkychateau
funkychateau's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 weeks ago
Joined: 07/01/2018 - 02:05
Posts: 105
Location: Dallas, Texas
Scallywag wrote:

TK’s response:


ToyKeeper wrote:
JasonWW wrote:
TK, since no one from Maukka’s review has asked here yet, can you tell us why the two battery tubes in the FW3A can not be equally lengthened 0.5mm to 1mm so as to make it fit both flat top and button top batteries?
It’s mostly just too late, and would risk making shorter batteries lose contact when bumped. Also, I think Lumintop may have only a compiled version of the 3D model, without any way to modify it. They might need the original from Fritz instead of an exported / compiled version. I’m not sure about the details though.

But it hasn’t always been “too late”. How long has this thing been in the works? I’m a fairly new poster on here, and I only became aware of this project several months ago, but I’ve been questioning the potential battery-fit issue since I first read about it. Surely others noticed sometime in the past two years? Somehow we’ve just decided to accept an “afterthought” mechanical design because the rest is cool.

Yes, I’m planning to buy one, but I’ll always think about how the versatility is crippled for lack of a millimeter.

If accommodating button-tops would suddenly make flat-tops lose contact, I’d expect problems with my Emisars, Nitecores, and Zebralights. But these digest both configurations without a hitch. Probably the only thing needed for the FW3A would be to lengthen the springs as well as the tubes. Just copy the Emisar’s battery-compartment dimensions.

ToyKeeper
ToyKeeper's picture
Offline
Last seen: 43 min 26 sec ago
Joined: 01/12/2013 - 14:40
Posts: 10090
Location: (469219) 2016 HO3
funkychateau wrote:
accomodating unprotected button-top cells

I tried a cell 66.8 mm long in my production sample, and it worked fine.

teacher
teacher's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 02/23/2016 - 19:04
Posts: 9596
Location: NE & SW Alabama

@ funkychateau…. You do realize the FW3A is selling now don’t you? It is to late for should-a, wood-a, could-a…. it is done & “it is fit”. Wink

There are plenty of batteries that will fit this light & it is in no way, as you mentioned; “crippled” if some batteries don’t fit.

There are many lights that not all cells will fit. The Fireflies E07 is but one example. Just because every cell will not fit every light does not necessarily make a light ‘bad’.

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

      Xlamp size chart _ BatteryU _ Flashaholic? Need Professional Help???            TheOriginal _ TAB _ LightSearch _ BatterySearch _ 14500's _ DiCal 

 

                                             

teacher
teacher's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 months 4 weeks ago
Joined: 02/23/2016 - 19:04
Posts: 9596
Location: NE & SW Alabama

hatman wrote:
One, please, XPLHI.
Wrong thread hatman. Go here: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/54239

But do it quick, it has been reported that in a bit less than a day the list will close.

You never know how a horse will pull until you hook him up to a heavy load./"Bear" Bryant 

 .................................. "Slow is Smooth, Smooth is Fast" ...................................

       Texas Lumens Flashlights / M4D M4X Deals : sign up - save $$$$  

         Rudeness Level _ mΩ _ {width:70%} _ LightWiki _ LED Tint Chart  

      Xlamp size chart _ BatteryU _ Flashaholic? Need Professional Help???            TheOriginal _ TAB _ LightSearch _ BatterySearch _ 14500's _ DiCal 

 

                                             

joechina
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 8 hours ago
Joined: 03/05/2016 - 08:23
Posts: 1435
Location: Germany
funkychateau wrote:
accomodating unprotected button-top cells

The universal approach is by good short cells, e.g. 30Q and solder blob them in case.

funkychateau
funkychateau's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 weeks ago
Joined: 07/01/2018 - 02:05
Posts: 105
Location: Dallas, Texas
ToyKeeper wrote:
funkychateau wrote:
accomodating unprotected button-top cells

I tried a cell 66.8 mm long in my production sample, and it worked fine.

That’s great! So 66 is not really the max!

funkychateau
funkychateau's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 weeks ago
Joined: 07/01/2018 - 02:05
Posts: 105
Location: Dallas, Texas

teacher wrote:
@ funkychateau…. You do realize the FW3A is selling now don’t you? It is to late for should-a, wood-a, could-a…. it is done & “it is fit”. Wink

There are plenty of batteries that will fit this light & it is in no way, as you mentioned; “crippled” if some batteries don’t fit.

There are many lights that not all cells will fit. The Fireflies E07 is but one example. Just because every cell will not fit every light does not necessarily make a light ‘bad’.

Yep, I’m waiting for my code.. I would have opened the battery discussion two years ago, but I wasn’t here. Just surprised no one else thought of it.

NWoodsman
NWoodsman's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 months 1 day ago
Joined: 11/06/2018 - 09:34
Posts: 51

Maukka, can you provide the inner diameter of the clip? Want to see if the Ti surefire clip on prometheus lights’s website can fit.

Bob_McBob
Offline
Last seen: 2 hours 34 min ago
Joined: 08/14/2016 - 04:53
Posts: 545
Location: Canada
funkychateau wrote:
If accommodating button-tops would suddenly make flat-tops lose contact, I’d expect problems with my Emisars, Nitecores, and Zebralights. But these digest both configurations without a hitch. Probably the only thing needed for the FW3A would be to lengthen the springs as well as the tubes. Just copy the Emisar’s battery-compartment dimensions.

Zebralight doesn’t really support button top cells. Even if you can cram it in there, the current pogo pin configuration often won’t make contact with the terminal.

Pages